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      06-30-2012, 09:35 PM   #16
JustinTJ
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Drives: MY13 F30, MY02 E36/7
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Jupiter, FL

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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPM90 View Post
You have a good handle on things regarding buying a vehicle.

The only thing I do not agree with you on is the "MACO and training" fee.
You've written in other threads that those fee's are NOT part of the "invoice". In fact, they ARE part of the invoice.
If you want a $500 over invoice sale, then you ask to be shown the actual invoice of the car you want, and add $500 to it.
The invoice will show the "MACO and training" fees.
Also, on bmwconfig.com, "training" is shown on the invoice, because it is part of the invoice.

Now, it is absolutely true that one could negotiate a selling price such that MACO and training are removed. But that would then mean that you are negotiating a below invoice deal. Nothing wrong with that. In fact, it's great if you can get the dealer to sell you a 3 for under invoice.
So, if your MACO and training add up to $450, then you ask for a selling price reflecting an additional $450 off, then you'd be getting the car for $450 below invoice.

I just think it's best to inform people correctly of what "invoice" actually is, and then inform people that they can try to negotiate below invoice.
If people get the wrong idea that MACO and training are not part of the invoice, then their going to get upset when it's included, thinking it shouldn't be. By knowing that MACO and training are part of the invoice, then they can tell their dealer they will pay $500 above invoice MINUS MACO and training. Then they can find out if their dealer will do that sale.
Then the customer is fully informed.
When people ask if $500 over invoice is a good offer, then they need to know that BMW invoice will include MACO and training.

I'm sure the reason why bmwconfig.com shows training fee, and doesn't include MACO, is because MACO is a regional fee and it varies according to market. Training fee is a set fee, MACO is variable. Some small markets may not have MACO at all, and larger markets may have a $300 or more MACO.

This is my 3rd BMW, and on each one the invoice included and showed MACO and training fees.
I offered my dealer $500 above actual invoice knowing that MACO and training will be on there, because it is part of the "invoice".

Other than that detail, I think you've got great information to offer to those with questions.
100% spot on. These threads where people are trying to negotiate with the dealer on invoice, ignoring TRN and MACO crack me up.

More power to them if it works, but the dealers have to pay BMW that money. It stands to reason they're not going to waive it for you and eat the cost.

This is the invoice for a 335d I almost purchased last year. Look at the bottom, MACO and Training on the dealer invoice. From BMW. Included. Right there with destination.

Notice that it's not included with MSRP pricing, but it is there on the invoice. Plain as day...

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2013 335i F30 M Sport (ZMM, EBII, ZDH, ZTP, 2TB, 688) My ED Trip
2002 E36/7 Topaz Blue Roadster
BMWCCA Member ID: 456926

Last edited by JustinTJ; 06-30-2012 at 09:43 PM..
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