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      05-15-2012, 11:23 AM   #1
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Negotiation tips when building to order

I am planning on ordering an M-sport F30. I have 4 configurations below that I am still deciding on (not sure if it is relevant but I included it). I understand there’s some leverage when you are to negotiate for a floor model but what about when building one?

- M-Sport, Technology, Steering, Bluetooth, Sound, Park Distance, Premium Package Manual 328i (RWD) MSRP 49945

- M-Sport, Technology, Steering, Bluetooth, Sound, Park Distance, Premium Package 8ZPT 328xi (AWD) MSRP 50445

- M-Sport, Steering, Bluetooth, Sound, Park Distance Manual 335i (RWD) MSRP 51145

- M-Sport, Steering, Bluetooth, Sound, Park Distance Manual 335xi (AWD) MSRP 53545

I have a 2008 e93 335i appraised at around $30k for trade in.

In any case, I also have a $300 ultimate app voucher code and an upcoming $1000 Team USA driving credit. Since this is my first time building and ordering a car, would anyone care to share some negotiation tips?

Or do the dealers pretty much have me by the throat on this?
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      05-15-2012, 12:01 PM   #2
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Building a car to order is different than buying off the lot because while showroom models are already sitting there (the dealer wants them gone to make room for more cars) if you build one then the dealer must order it. This means occupying space on the lot with it until you pick it up and one fewer "showroom" car that he can order. Theres also the chance that you put in the deposit and order but never pick the car up. While you would lose your deposit the dealership would now be taxed with selling the car which you may have ordered in less desirable colors/options. For these reasons you may be able to get a little bit off but if you order a car you will likely pay close to MSRP.

The same is true of shipping a car from another dealership to yours. When the dealership occupies a lot space specifically for you then your price negotiation becomes limited.
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      05-15-2012, 01:01 PM   #3
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Bummer. Thanks PINeely
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      05-17-2012, 09:32 PM   #4
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I think there is still room to negotiate a fair deal, even when you order. Use resources like truecar, edmunds, and bmwconfig to find the invoice price and what others are paying. I ordered an F30 328i recently and even quotes I turned down were not near MSRP. Maybe the M-sport is more desirable, but I wouldn't resign to paying full retail without doing homework on the car I planned to buy. By the way, my dealership did ask for a deposit because they were afraid they couldn't fine someone that could still drive a manual if I bailed on the deal.
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      05-17-2012, 09:52 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PINeely View Post
Building a car to order is different than buying off the lot because while showroom models are already sitting there (the dealer wants them gone to make room for more cars) if you build one then the dealer must order it. This means occupying space on the lot with it until you pick it up and one fewer "showroom" car that he can order. Theres also the chance that you put in the deposit and order but never pick the car up. While you would lose your deposit the dealership would now be taxed with selling the car which you may have ordered in less desirable colors/options. For these reasons you may be able to get a little bit off but if you order a car you will likely pay close to MSRP.

The same is true of shipping a car from another dealership to yours. When the dealership occupies a lot space specifically for you then your price negotiation becomes limited.
From what I have researched it was the opposite of what you are saying. Dealers are less likely to go close to invoice price for cars already out in the lot because its already costing them money everyday it sits on the lot.

I ordered my 335i and paid $800 over invoice.
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      05-17-2012, 10:42 PM   #6
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Hey Ric,
Did you pay $800 over invoice including all fees (MACO and any other dealer training and/or doc fees)? Or, have you not yet seen the final contract (in case yours in still on order)?

Thanks.
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      05-17-2012, 11:00 PM   #7
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No one should have to pay close to MSRP. There are many people who ordered for less than 1000 over invoice, a few for less than 500.
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      05-18-2012, 12:37 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Save Bluth View Post
Hey Ric,
Did you pay $800 over invoice including all fees (MACO and any other dealer training and/or doc fees)? Or, have you not yet seen the final contract (in case yours in still on order)?

Thanks.
No Fees are separate from cost of the car, but here are the fees I paid.

Registration: $450
Doc: $599
tire fee: $5
battery fee: $1.50
Lemon Law: $2
FL Doc Stamp: $100.10

I am not sure what MACO is but its not on my bill
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      05-18-2012, 01:08 AM   #9
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My research also found the opposite to be true. Strange as it may seem, factory orders tended to be less than a car on the lot.

And, I don't believe deposits are non-refundable. If you decide to cancel the order, even if the car were on the lot staring at you, you are entitled to get your deposit back...100%.
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      05-18-2012, 01:09 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by TrueBlue12 View Post
No one should have to pay close to MSRP. There are many people who ordered for less than 1000 over invoice, a few for less than 500.
True in most cases but less so when there's only one dealer in 2500 miles radius, when they don't have anything in stock and when the customer is paying cash (they make less money that way).
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      05-18-2012, 01:13 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ric124 View Post
No Fees are separate from cost of the car, but here are the fees I paid.

Registration: $450
Doc: $599
tire fee: $5
battery fee: $1.50
Lemon Law: $2
FL Doc Stamp: $100.10

I am not sure what MACO is but its not on my bill
You actually paid $1400 over invoice. The FL Doc stamp was Lauderdale BMW's "actual" doc fees. The doc fee (they call it a dealer fee sometimes too) you see listed is just dealer profit with a name people won't recognize.

It is a good deal on a 335 because the allocations are limited. On a 328, people outside of S.FL. should be able to do better than this. Lauderdale's going rate on F30s seems to be in that 1200-1400 range these days.
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      05-18-2012, 01:13 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svache View Post
True in most cases but less so when there's only one dealer in 2500 miles radius, when they don't have anything in stock and when the customer is paying cash (they make less money that way).
A downside to living in paradise?
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      05-18-2012, 01:43 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ric124 View Post
From what I have researched it was the opposite of what you are saying. Dealers are less likely to go close to invoice price for cars already out in the lot because its already costing them money everyday it sits on the lot.

I ordered my 335i and paid $800 over invoice.
Did you see the invoice price from the dealer invoice sheet? Or with the edmunds/bmwconfig invoice?
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      05-18-2012, 03:02 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by live4wknds View Post
A downside to living in paradise?
one of the many
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      05-18-2012, 06:57 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toph View Post
I think there is still room to negotiate a fair deal, even when you order. Use resources like truecar, edmunds, and bmwconfig to find the invoice price and what others are paying. I ordered an F30 328i recently and even quotes I turned down were not near MSRP. Maybe the M-sport is more desirable, but I wouldn't resign to paying full retail without doing homework on the car I planned to buy. By the way, my dealership did ask for a deposit because they were afraid they couldn't fine someone that could still drive a manual if I bailed on the deal.
Thanks for the tip, I guess I have to wait a bit since there is no comparison for the MY2013 on either of those sites. It'd also be easier if they didn't repackage some of their options and tweaked the price as well so that I could of extrapolated the figures from 2012 to 2013.

By the way how much do they require for the deposit? Maybe I misread somewhere but are people already putting money down early to hold a spot to ensure to be one of the first with the M sport. Wouldn't production still be 8 - 10 weeks or is there a delay in the pipeline since the M sport is in high demand?
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      05-18-2012, 07:24 AM   #16
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Ordered a 335i for $500 over invoice. I always order cars and it never seems to impact the negotiation. It seems to be all about the CA's perception of your willingness to walk away from the deal and go to a competitor.
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      05-18-2012, 08:01 AM   #17
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Yeah, I paid $500 over invoice for my 328i which I factory ordered. You shouldn't have any trouble negotiating differently because it's an order. I used the information on Edmunds.com and found it extremely helpful. I paid well below their 'True Market Value' for my car in the region which I was very happy with. Just be confident, let them know you've done your research and don't want to play games and you should be good to go.
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      05-18-2012, 09:25 AM   #18
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Dang look at that doc fee!! $600??

You got worked....
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      05-20-2012, 05:25 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueBlue12 View Post
Did you see the invoice price from the dealer invoice sheet? Or with the edmunds/bmwconfig invoice?
I used edmunds.com

So everyone factors in the fees for stating how much is paid above invoice? I didn't because I know these fees are not in MSRP in the first place.
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Last edited by ric124; 05-20-2012 at 05:30 PM.
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      05-20-2012, 07:03 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ric124 View Post
I used edmunds.com

So everyone factors in the fees for stating how much is paid above invoice? I didn't because I know these fees are not in MSRP in the first place.
I didn't count the fees in my invoice price. In my experience, they don't budge on the fees which is why you have to get the 'price' down down down as far as possible.
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      05-20-2012, 10:22 PM   #21
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edmunds prices are accurate. The legitimate fees are maco, training, documentation fee and none of them should be 599.
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      05-20-2012, 10:55 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueBlue12 View Post
edmunds prices are accurate. The legitimate fees are maco, training, documentation fee and none of them should be 599.
$599 was the dealer fee, CA said he couldn't waive it so he reduced the price of the car instead but that $599 has to stay on the paper work. Also I have no MACO fee on my paperwork.
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