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      12-23-2012, 02:37 AM   #1
PK2348
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lack of handling on base 328 xdrive

this is my 3rd bmw, i had an 08 528 and 09 328 prior. both had base suspension, which i found perfect for my needs commuting daily from brooklyn to midtown manhattan. Both were RWD.

The F30 base with xdrive i have now feels much different. Bigger, softer , boaty, floaty, arcade steering, weird brakes. I do not like putting the car in the sport mode, i find the engine response to be too much. Throwing the gear stick to the right has the same effect on throttle system.
I regret not getting the DHP, which i think would have helped a lot.

However, i believe it was mentioned before, if you disable DSC completely handling becomes much more enjoyable. I wonder if anyone is knowledgeble about how it's achieved.

I suspect more torgue is distributed to the front axle, the car feels more planted on the road, and feels more like full time all wheel drive. The steering is harder, however steel lacks feedback. The combination of these two create a feel of a tighter suspension, although i realize suspension is passive and it's settings cannot be changed.

I would only deactivate DSC on a dry road, maybe on occasion in the rain just for fun, never in the snow, unless stuck, or again just to have a bit of fun.

Does anyone know exactly how this functions? Any suggestions?
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      12-23-2012, 05:22 AM   #2
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Just press & hold the DSC button (not more than 10s) then everything (DSC+DTC) is switched off. If u just press the DSC button then only DSC is off as DTC remains on.
If u don't have DHP then the only thing u can do, if u want tighter handling, is to fit an aftermarket coilover system, but I'm not sure whether they're out yet for the xDrive. Adjustable systems such as KW offers acceptable ride quality together with improvement in handling.
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      12-23-2012, 08:22 AM   #3
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I doubt that DSC is the problem. If you stay in DTC mode, the ESP is still on and allows you some drifting.

Un less you have a lease, put the money that you didn't spend on the DHP / Sport line on lowering the car and getting 18" wheels. Larger sway bars may be a good idea, but I would do the other mods 1st.

xdrive takes a toll on handling and specially steering feel, nothing new.
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      12-23-2012, 09:36 AM   #4
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Stock xDrive suspension on E90 sucks so I'm not surprised that the F30 is the same.
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      12-23-2012, 09:51 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MassBimmer View Post
Stock xDrive suspension on E90 sucks so I'm not surprised that the F30 is the same.
If you think the stock suspension on E90 sucks, then you really dont want to try the stock suspension on F30, its even worst, softer, more leans around the corner and more float, not to mention the terrible steering feel and engine note.
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      12-24-2012, 01:36 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarence
Just press & hold the DSC button (not more than 10s) then everything (DSC+DTC) is switched off. If u just press the DSC button then only DSC is off as DTC remains on.
If u don't have DHP then the only thing u can do, if u want tighter handling, is to fit an aftermarket coilover system, but I'm not sure whether they're out yet for the xDrive. Adjustable systems such as KW offers acceptable ride quality together with improvement in handling.
Not another one these. Pressing down one click leaves DSC on (stock setting) and turns DTC on (stock setting is off - the ON lets you spin your wheels more).
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      12-24-2012, 02:08 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pkim1079 View Post
Not another one these. Pressing down one click leaves DSC on (stock setting) and turns DTC on (stock setting is off - the ON lets you spin your wheels more).
DTC is subset of feature within DSC (it only deals with traction & not cornering stability). If u press & hold the button for not more than 10s, the DSC (incl DTC) is deactivated. If u just press the button once then the cornering stability part of the DSC is deactivated, leaving the traction control part (i.e. DTC) on.
It's all in pages 111 & 112 of the owner's manual.
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      12-24-2012, 02:52 AM   #8
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Now M Sport suspension is not good enough. Need M Sport PERFORMANCE suspension. How much I love you BMW for making me continually open my pocket book.
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      12-24-2012, 01:08 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
If you think the stock suspension on E90 sucks, then you really dont want to try the stock suspension on F30, its even worst, softer, more leans around the corner and more float, not to mention the terrible steering feel and engine note.
Makes a good story, except that the xDrive does not have the steering problems of the RWD models, because it doesn't have electrically assisted steering. So a story is all it is.
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      12-24-2012, 01:34 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raleedy View Post
Makes a good story, except that the xDrive does not have the steering problems of the RWD models, because it doesn't have electrically assisted steering. So a story is all it is.
F30 Xdrive still has EPS. It's the F10 that seems to give up EPS when switching to Xdrive.
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      12-24-2012, 02:30 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesons Viggen
Quote:
Originally Posted by raleedy View Post
Makes a good story, except that the xDrive does not have the steering problems of the RWD models, because it doesn't have electrically assisted steering. So a story is all it is.
F30 Xdrive still has EPS. It's the F10 that seems to give up EPS when switching to Xdrive.
+1 F30 xdrive has electric steering unlike f10 xdrive.
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      12-24-2012, 05:16 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PK2348 View Post
this is my 3rd bmw, i had an 08 528 and 09 328 prior. both had base suspension, which i found perfect for my needs commuting daily from brooklyn to midtown manhattan. Both were RWD.

The F30 base with xdrive i have now feels much different. Bigger, softer , boaty, floaty, arcade steering, weird brakes. I do not like putting the car in the sport mode, i find the engine response to be too much. Throwing the gear stick to the right has the same effect on throttle system.
I regret not getting the DHP, which i think would have helped a lot.

However, i believe it was mentioned before, if you disable DSC completely handling becomes much more enjoyable. I wonder if anyone is knowledgeble about how it's achieved.

I suspect more torgue is distributed to the front axle, the car feels more planted on the road, and feels more like full time all wheel drive. The steering is harder, however steel lacks feedback. The combination of these two create a feel of a tighter suspension, although i realize suspension is passive and it's settings cannot be changed.

I would only deactivate DSC on a dry road, maybe on occasion in the rain just for fun, never in the snow, unless stuck, or again just to have a bit of fun.

Does anyone know exactly how this functions? Any suggestions?
thank you all for your replies. My question was poorly worded.
I know how to engage the system (hold the bottom for few secs).
I am wondering why steering has a tighter feel with DTC off. Also, if anyone noticed, when you turn DTC off by holding the bottom for few seconds, a screen comes up on the idrive showing sport settings/mode, but it is slightly different displays then when you put the car in the sport mode.
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      12-24-2012, 05:22 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raleedy View Post
Makes a good story, except that the xDrive does not have the steering problems of the RWD models, because it doesn't have electrically assisted steering. So a story is all it is.
i wish you were right, unfortunately my xdrive has electric steering
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      12-24-2012, 05:43 PM   #14
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Are you not able to configure your sport mode set up? In the F10 you can personalize how you want sport mode, whether its chassis and drive train or just one or the other. Personally I think driving a BMW without sport suspension really looses the BMW driveability.
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      12-24-2012, 06:16 PM   #15
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DSC will not address the floaty boat feeling you described.

You said your previous cars were RWD. That is the most influential factor, because the x-drive has a higher ride height. This means it has a higher center of gravity, this causes it to lean more in the corners. Of course the F30's suspension is noticeably softer than its predecessors too. I still find it interesting that you consider you E60 as handling better.
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      12-24-2012, 07:09 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerjph View Post
DSC will not address the floaty boat feeling you described.

You said your previous cars were RWD. That is the most influential factor, because the x-drive has a higher ride height. This means it has a higher center of gravity, this causes it to lean more in the corners. Of course the F30's suspension is noticeably softer than its predecessors too. I still find it interesting that you consider you E60 as handling better.
I agree, awd has its issues, including nose going up when you start moving. E60 was my 1st bmw. I had an older g35x before that, which i still think had awesome handling, but noise and ride quality were just too much. E60 got me hooked on BMWs, and e90 base felt almost perfect. Still trying to get used to F30. If i lease another bmw after this one, i will definately get the adaptive suspension option.
E60 was a great car, but felt a little too big at times. F30 also feels too big. But base e60 had a much better, somewhat stiffer suspension and great steering
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      12-24-2012, 07:17 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RambleJ View Post
Are you not able to configure your sport mode set up? In the F10 you can personalize how you want sport mode, whether its chassis and drive train or just one or the other. Personally I think driving a BMW without sport suspension really looses the BMW driveability.
You need to get the adaptime suspension option in F30 to have that capability.
You are right about sport suspension, but you must also consider the roads you will be driving. For me it's mostly NYC metro area. Base suspension used to provide perfect balance in such conditions.
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      12-24-2012, 08:19 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RambleJ View Post
Personally I think driving a BMW without sport suspension really looses the BMW driveability.
The thing is, it used to not be that way. Yes, the sport package cars were always better, but an enthusiast could get away with the standard car if you had too. Some would even argue that the sport suspension doesn't even capture the traditional BMW feel.
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      12-24-2012, 09:11 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PK2348 View Post
You need to get the adaptime suspension option in F30 to have that capability.
You are right about sport suspension, but you must also consider the roads you will be driving. For me it's mostly NYC metro area. Base suspension used to provide perfect balance in such conditions.
I don't have the adaptive suspension, but I can configure the driving mode drivetrain/chassis on my sportline with VSS.
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      12-24-2012, 09:23 PM   #20
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The problem is that you have the base X-Drive suspension, the base seats, the base steering wheel, the base transmission, and the smallest brakes offered. I don't mean to be rude, but what else did you expect? I mean that's what test drives are for.

I have a rear-wheel drive 328i Sport Line with Sport Auto and my only real complaint is the lack of solid brake pedal feedback which will most likely be fixed with a stock 335i. I find the steering, seats, shifting, and suspension to be very, very good considering how little I pay a month and the breadth of abilities this car has.
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      12-24-2012, 09:32 PM   #21
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Yeah-I test drove a 328 xD and a 335 RWD, and there's a dramatic difference in suspension/ travel/etc...
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      12-25-2012, 12:37 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarence View Post
DTC is subset of feature within DSC (it only deals with traction & not cornering stability). If u press & hold the button for not more than 10s, the DSC (incl DTC) is deactivated. If u just press the button once then the cornering stability part of the DSC is deactivated, leaving the traction control part (i.e. DTC) on.
It's all in pages 111 & 112 of the owner's manual.
DTC is a "mode" of DSC.

With DSC fully on/active, there is stability control and traction control.
Press the button once and release turns DTC on, "Traction" appears on the gauge cluster.
*DTC is not on when DSC is fully active. When you press the button once and release you are not deactivating DSC, you are switching it to DTC.
So pressing the button doesn't leave DTC on, it actually turns DTC on..

DTC is "dynamic traction control".
When DTC is active it allows the drive wheels to spin.
Also, there is still stability control during cornering, but at a reduced level.
With DTC on, the system allows the driver to play a bit more, like swinging the rear out, before the system intervenes.

To turn DSC completely off, press and hold the button until the sliding car icon and "off" are displayed on the gauge cluster.
With DSC completely off there is no traction or stability control.
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