[Firaxis]

Might be in the minority here, but I just love cars and have zero brand loyalty.. From small peppy 1.6 Turbos, V8's, Diesels. You name it, I probably like it.. Hell I even like Skoda's and Alfa's ..

Only reason I bought an F30 (335D Xdrive) is because of price and performance. When I read the forums, it nearly put me off getting it. In reality it's nothing like it was being described, I had to question in a few instances whether they'd actually driven the car or not.

If I'm nitpicking, I'd say the steering is too light and it should have more feedback. But it doesn't detract from it being overall a great car. It's comfortable, fast, precise, has a great interior and the Xdrive system (well in the newer one's) is awesome. Never have I had a car with 465 LB FT of torque that actually gets the power down on the road with so little fuss, but you can still have plenty of fun.

It's mental when I want it to be, relaxed when I don't. Only complaint is, there needs to be more place where I can let it go wild.!

I'm not 100% convinced my next car will be a Beemer, but that's not because of the car. It's just I like trying new cars, if the Camaro doesn't do it for me I'll probably consider an M car.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by Tacoma

IMO, true BMW enthusiasts (whatever you think that means) are objective and tell it like it is. We are fans not fanboys who only say nice things about BMW. And by most "objective" measures, the 3-Series E36 > E46 > E90 > F30, BMW has been softening, and I think true BMW fans ought to be displeased with this trend and speak out to voice our displeasure à la the E65 and the more voices the better.

There is a different perspective... maybe the bigger BMW market complained about the overly hard BMW drives, and BMW have listened and softened the models. Certainly been the case in the UK. Our road surfaces are so poor in many areas that many BMW drivers just don't want a overly firm ride anymore, and that includes some BMW enthusiasts.

[tturedraider]

Originally Posted by Firaxis

Might be in the minority here, but I just love cars and have zero brand loyalty.. From small peppy 1.6 Turbos, V8's, Diesels. You name it, I probably like it.. Hell I even like Skoda's and Alfa's ..

Only reason I bought an F30 (335D Xdrive) is because of price and performance. When I read the forums, it nearly put me off getting it. In reality it's nothing like it was being described, I had to question in a few instances whether they'd actually driven the car or not.

If I'm nitpicking, I'd say the steering is too light and it should have more feedback. But it doesn't detract from it being overall a great car. It's comfortable, fast, precise, has a great interior and the Xdrive system (well in the newer one's) is awesome. Never have I had a car with 465 LB FT of torque that actually gets the power down on the road with so little fuss, but you can still have plenty of fun.

It's mental when I want it to be, relaxed when I don't. Only complaint is, there needs to be more place where I can let it go wild.!

I'm not 100% convinced my next car will be a Beemer, but that's not because of the car. It's just I like trying new cars, if the Camaro doesn't do it for me I'll probably consider an M car.

curiosity question regarding price. Is yours a company car? I know they're very common in the UK. In the U.S. BMW's price point is a major factor in winnowing the market for many prospective buyers.

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

There is a different perspective... maybe the bigger BMW market complained about the overly hard BMW drives, and BMW have listened and softened the models. Certainly been the case in the UK. Our road surfaces are so poor in many areas that many BMW drivers just don't want a overly firm ride anymore, and that includes some BMW enthusiasts.

In the U.S., outside the pool of relatively enthusiastic buyers, the heavy steering on BMWs has been a sticking point for many average buyers, especially prospective female buyers. There was no shortage of buyers who chose BMW in spite of the heavy steering, not because of it.

[lens]

Originally Posted by Firaxis

Might be in the minority here, but I just love cars and have zero brand loyalty.. From small peppy 1.6 Turbos, V8's, Diesels. You name it, I probably like it.. Hell I even like Skoda's and Alfa's ..

Only reason I bought an F30 (335D Xdrive) is because of price and performance. When I read the forums, it nearly put me off getting it. In reality it's nothing like it was being described, I had to question in a few instances whether they'd actually driven the car or not.

If I'm nitpicking, I'd say the steering is too light and it should have more feedback. But it doesn't detract from it being overall a great car. It's comfortable, fast, precise, has a great interior and the Xdrive system (well in the newer one's) is awesome. Never have I had a car with 465 LB FT of torque that actually gets the power down on the road with so little fuss, but you can still have plenty of fun.

It's mental when I want it to be, relaxed when I don't. Only complaint is, there needs to be more place where I can let it go wild.!

I'm not 100% convinced my next car will be a Beemer, but that's not because of the car. It's just I like trying new cars, if the Camaro doesn't do it for me I'll probably consider an M car.

My next car will definitely not be a BMW.

I'm torn between Mercedes and Lexus.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by __

In the U.S., outside the pool of relatively enthusiastic buyers, the heavy steering on BMWs has been a sticking point for many average buyers, especially prospective female buyers. There was no shortage of buyers who chose BMW in spite of the heavy steering, not because of it.

Similar over here in the UK. There have even been users questioning if there is something wrong with the steering in E9x models, because it is so heavy.

We also had some E9x models with EPS in Euro spec'. The lighter steering never got the negative press that we saw with the F3x models. A lot of the E9x users never even knew it was EPS, just loved the lighter steering.

[Firaxis]

Originally Posted by __

curiosity question regarding price. Is yours a company car? I know they're very common in the UK. In the U.S. BMW's price point is a major factor in winnowing the market for many prospective buyers.




In the U.S., outside the pool of relatively enthusiastic buyers, the heavy steering on BMWs has been a sticking point for many average buyers, especially prospective female buyers. There was no shortage of buyers who chose BMW in spite of the heavy steering, not because of it.

Mine's a personal purchase, although yeah there are an astounding amount of Beemers on company leases in the UK (where I'm from )

[goj]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Similar over here in the UK. There have even been users questioning if there is something wrong with the steering in E9x models, because it is so heavy.

We also had some E9x models with EPS in Euro spec'. The lighter steering never got the negative press that we saw with the F3x models. A lot of the E9x users never even knew it was EPS, just loved the lighter steering.

On this note...I feel like many people on this forum, when commenting on steering, assume 'feel' refers to the heaviness of the steering. :

[Firaxis]

Originally Posted by goj

On this note...I feel like many people on this forum, when commenting on steering, assume 'feel' refers to the heaviness of the steering. :

Nah, it's that "detached" feeling. Where the car moves when turning the wheel, but it doesn't feel like you're completely in control of it. So your brain try's to assess the difference constantly. Never had this issue with hydraulic PAS and it wasn't especially "heavy" either.

I think it's something you get used to, but going between the two types you can really tell the difference.

[goj]

Originally Posted by Firaxis

Nah, it's that "detached" feeling. Where the car moves when turning the wheel, but it doesn't feel like you're completely in control of it. So your brain try's to assess the difference constantly. Never had this issue with hydraulic PAS and it wasn't especially "heavy" either.

I think it's something you get used to, but going between the two types you can really tell the difference.

I understand what it is. I was merely commenting on an onservation

[Firaxis]

Originally Posted by goj

I understand what it is. I was merely commenting on an onservation

Never said you didn't and some probably believe it is due to "weight", just saying that's what the issue is with most electronic setups. But as said you do tend to get used to it (rightly or wrongly)..