[Michael Schott]

Originally Posted by glennQNYC

I love my "gas sucking" automobiles... But it isn't really like EVs are a viable alternative for an only car. Especially people residing in condos and apartments.

i3s are econoboxes without the economy. Every time I see the $50k sticker on one I shake my head and contemplate how the hell anyone could justify owning one.

How is the i3 an econobox? BMW doesn't do econoboxes and at point in the technology EV's are not economy cars. They are a lifestyle choice.

[Technic]

Originally Posted by maa335iF30

There's a recent post where guys are getting 650+ miles on a single tank in their 300hp 335s (I'm not quite there; but close)....so we don't need this!

That is 41mpg.

Perhaps that was a E90 335d.

[Crashnbrn5]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

European users really have to go diesel for the performance option. Simply to keep a lid on the costs.

It is not as if users don't desire the N55 engine, it just doesn't make financial sense to have one for the average driver, even many an enthusiast has to give it a miss.

Even the smaller N20 (328i) doesn't add up and/or make financial sense to most users.

HighlandPete

They should worry about getting a better job than buying a BMW. Lol

[Alex_bm]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

European users really have to go diesel for the performance option. Simply to keep a lid on the costs.

It is not as if users don't desire the N55 engine, it just doesn't make financial sense to have one for the average driver, even many an enthusiast has to give it a miss.

Even the smaller N20 (328i) doesn't add up and/or make financial sense to most users.

HighlandPete

Financial sense? Are we still on BMW forum?

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by Crashnbrn5

They should worry about getting a better job than buying a BMW. Lol

Originally Posted by Alex_bm

Financial sense? Are we still on BMW forum?

I think we live in a different part of the universe over in Europe.

There is a big difference in running petrol and diesel over here, easy just to pour money away buying on choice alone. Tax implications are often high on the priority list, both for personal burden and fuel (tax) costs. Even residual values favour the diesel, can make a big difference for 'like for like' real world performance vs. total costs.

May also appear strange to choose a 'lesser' model BMW, but that is the reality, even for those who could afford to go higher up the range, to petrol, or even to M-cars.

Perhaps "financial prudence" is not something we often read about on a BMW forum.

Many guys drive 20 - 25k miles a year, even if not, many even prefer the high performance diesel, both on controlling costs and it does most things as well, or even better, in 95% of day to day driving.

Could well be moving towards double the running costs (M-cars) for that last few percentage of driving satisfaction.

Another factor to remember for Europe, most 3-series cars are small diesels anyway. Here in the UK the 320d dominates the sales, many examples driven by sales reps, service engineers and the like, driving the motorways.

HighlandPete

[....,,,,..,,..]

As Pete says, slightly different over this side with Fuel costs and tax (business emissions type).

Predominantly 320's with 325d's (twin turbo 320d).

With the 330d and 335d we get better performance than a 328i and much better fuel economy.

With the 335d giving both better performance than a 335i also along side superior fuel economy. I think it's around 4.8 0 to 62 mph.

Even my lowly 330d will give about 5.4 0-62 and I can get over 50mpg (not at same time lol) not bad from a tourer with a 3.0l engine.

As emissions gets tighter in the EU, the rest of world will feel impact from both exports and imports (EU).

[Crashnbrn5]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

I think we live in a different part of the universe over in Europe.

There is a big difference in running petrol and diesel over here, easy just to pour money away buying on choice alone. Tax implications are often high on the priority list, both for personal burden and fuel (tax) costs. Even residual values favour the diesel, can make a big difference for 'like for like' real world performance vs. total costs.

May also appear strange to choose a 'lesser' model BMW, but that is the reality, even for those who could afford to go higher up the range, to petrol, or even to M-cars.

Perhaps "financial prudence" is not something we often read about on a BMW forum.

Many guys drive 20 - 25k miles a year, even if not, many even prefer the high performance diesel, both on controlling costs and it does most things as well, or even better, in 95% of day to day driving.

Could well be moving towards double the running costs (M-cars) for that last few percentage of driving satisfaction.

Another factor to remember for Europe, most 3-series cars are small diesels anyway. Here in the UK the 320d dominates the sales, many examples driven by sales reps, service engineers and the like, driving the motorways.

HighlandPete

If it cost an extra 5k per year to run petrol then obviously that is a good percentage of the cost of the whole car. I get it... But gas will always provide that "feeling" over diesel. To me at least. I had the x5 35d with the chip and it was glorious. But still no match for my N55 x3. Not that I'm rich but I never consider gas cost an issue or an expense it is what it is it's like buying food for your family, it's like brushing your teeth in the morning, it's like going to work everyday. If I have to spend an extra 2K per year to put a smile on my face then so be it. I just really don't care about efficiency.... Lol. I do care about the environment of course. But when people are trying to squeeze dollars out of their gas/diesel engine, it's just saddens me because they could of got a cheaper car for about 8k less and not have to worry so much about gas. People have to learn about delaying gratification

[DS_BMW]

Cool but I would rather drive my ST for half the price with way better handling, performance and it's just a riot to drive while still capable of 30mpg+.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Crashnbrn5

But when people are trying to squeeze dollars out of their gas/diesel engine, it's just saddens me because they could of got a cheaper car for about 8k less and not have to worry so much about gas. People have to learn about delaying gratification

Agreed, if i was in that situation i would get a wrx or some other cheaper/faster car than 320d/328d. I tried one of those as a loaner car and it was so slow.

I suppose if it was a company car and the rules forced me into a 180hp diesel that is a very different story.

On a related note, thats my struggle with the i3 as well. I need that $200/mo lease for the math to make sense to me. There is no way i would pay $40k-$50k cash for a i3. Its just too slow and doesnt save money in that scenario.

[....,,,,..,,..]

Originally Posted by DS_BMW

Cool but I would rather drive my ST for half the price with way better handling, performance and it's just a riot to drive while still capable of 30mpg+.

Nice car, yes Fiestas handle really well.

Have had a number of ST's over the years and great on very windy back roads.

One of our other cars is due replacing and that is likely to be a Fiesta St with Mountune engine upgrade.

However my 330d hammers my mates Fiesta on anything other than very tight bends.

The big advantage of the 3.0 diesels is I can do a number of 200 mile trips, each one can vary between 30 mpg and 54 mpg and that's with an Xdrive.

Typical urban, city and motorway mix driving quickly will constantly return mid 40 mpg.

I guess once EU and car manufacturers are hit with the 2016 -2019 onwards emissions fines, these will filter across the pond with 'possible' emissions fines putting up a 335i by $9000.