07-03-2013, 10:17 AM | #23 | |
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I disagree on the center of gravity, the lower the COG the better.
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07-03-2013, 10:21 AM | #24 | |
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07-03-2013, 10:36 AM | #25 |
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I think people are mixing up two things. Rwd will probably feel more refined and more fun in the curves. Xdrive however will get the job done but will be clumsy at it due to the additional ride height. That's what MT is saying and the "respectable" figure 8 time, which is better than the 335i rwd btw, is an objective measure of this.
Acelerometer MT already agrees with you iro curves its right there in my initial post. I actually disagree with your assesment that the xdrive is the straight line king vs the M3, not only is the M3 quicker at 12.6s but its already going about 8mph faster at the 1/4. That's an annihilation by most standards.
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07-03-2013, 10:46 AM | #27 |
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This is a VERY Fuel Efficient M3.. that is.. I think this has its own merit.
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07-03-2013, 10:47 AM | #28 | |
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07-03-2013, 11:00 AM | #30 |
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I think so.
I do not think there is a summer tire setup on an MSport available in square sizing. The lateral G of .87 is fairly low, I saw .90 or .91 for an MSport 328 with staggered summer tires. So the wheel and tire setup likely let down the car in this test.
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07-03-2013, 11:08 AM | #31 | |
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07-03-2013, 11:14 AM | #32 | |
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Of course.
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Extra weight needs to be hauled around. This hampers acceleration, cornering and braking. Sports cars are not made better handling by making the floor of the cars heavier. No. They were summer tires: "We also noticed a slight oddity with our tester's 18-inch summer tires, thanks to some investigating by associate road test editor Carlos Lago. Instead of the staggered setup that comes from the factory, our wheels were the same width all around." |
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07-03-2013, 11:16 AM | #33 | |
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Look I am not criticizing F30 335i xDrives, there is a reason I have one sitting in my garage (identical twin to 330hp's). Our F30 is by FAR the more practical and better daily driver compared to our M3. However, I totally disagree with the notion that xDrive has a dry handling advantage over rear wheel drive. xDrive has open diffs on both ends relying on DSC+braking for individual wheel control. It isn't comparable with the AWD systems that have limited slips or active torque transfer to individual wheels. These types of awd systems provide a dry handling advantage in corners. |
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07-03-2013, 11:59 AM | #35 | |
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Most of us don't drive the car to the limit. If Xdrive extends that pushable limit by adjusting power (understeer/ovefsteer). Would that not create better results.
Also: i understand that extra weight has to be carried, but how much extra weight becomes a hinderance. 10lbs, 40lbs, 100lbs? Sometimes a car that is too light will have issues as the suspension is not optimally loaded. BMW does not offer summer tires in a squared setup as far as I am aware so if it is square and factory then it is all-season. If it's not square and all-seasons, then who knows what BMW provided for testing. If the car has DHP with adaptive suspension in sport mode my understanding is that the suspension becomes fairly sporty and stiff. Given the ride height is only 11mm (1cm higher than non XDrive). are we not just splitting hairs on this. I'm in no way suggesting this care remotely approaches an M car, but this setup should deliver good results straight and curves. Kevin Quote:
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07-03-2013, 12:01 PM | #36 | |
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I think for the MSport if you get a square setup it means all season, if you get staggered, it's summer. It's as if BMW had a car equipped with square summer tires as found on Sport 397 wheels but mounted them on square 400ms instead.
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07-03-2013, 12:28 PM | #37 | |
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You'll have to be so far off on bump/rebound and spring rate amongst a billion other engineering disasters for this to even be a consideration....ever.
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07-03-2013, 12:43 PM | #38 |
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07-03-2013, 12:44 PM | #39 |
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Are you saying they got an S4 to run 4 flat 0-60mph? I don't think I have ever heard anything like that before.
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07-03-2013, 12:46 PM | #40 |
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I think you are definitely wrong about the 19s....
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07-03-2013, 12:52 PM | #41 |
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agreed completely. staggered setup might make a difference on RWD model, but should make no difference on AWD model. Even with RWD, The difference is related to slip and the initial launch. Once you have rolling inertia, the tire width makes little to no difference assuming constant throttle input (in a straight line, that is).
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07-03-2013, 12:57 PM | #42 | |
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We talk about the difference in ride height and its effect on the COG and body-roll. If tires extend the footprint of the car making the stance say 2" wider, would this not make cornering more effective? Surely this could be as big a factor as 1cm of ride height? Given that Xdrive is basically RWD 90% of the time.
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07-03-2013, 01:13 PM | #44 |
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Yes, they are in different ways for various suspension setups/geometries. But you still optimize camber for it's known operating range (load/travel), for your specific example. You *should* always engineer the setup to the loads the car is creating dynamically. At any rate, weight is not your friend when you want it to change direction.
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