01-16-2014, 08:48 AM | #1 |
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Whats the point in having Kick Down?
Might be a dumb question, but coming always having driven manual’s all my life, what the point in kick down on an auto ‘box? ie the resistance point at the bottom of the throttle when you floor it.
I can see it drops a gear (or two) whilst in kick down, but why have the resistance point? Surely it would still work without the resistance point as full throttle can still be detected ie when you put your foot to the floor?
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01-16-2014, 08:57 AM | #2 |
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I've thought that too, especially on the old 6spd Slushmatic that haunted the E90 generation. On the 8AT, particularly the DCT quick Sport Auto, I can perhaps see it making more sense as it can skip gears and so perhaps this kick-down notch is the thing that really gees it up to get to the lowest gear as quick as possible. Maybe it's purely for driver satisfaction? But yeah, I completely get what you mean...
I was driving an E63 AMG recently and its kick-down notch didn't seem that operational really - it would just continue to pull from medium rpm to redline without dropping 1 gear as I expected it would. Mind you, that's what >700NM is for. EDIT: Just as a side note, my E90 LCI 330d 6MT had a kick-down notch. Obviously, completely redundant but it still had one. However, it went in for service (about 60,000mls I seem to recall) and it came back without one. Don't know if I got a new accelerator pedal unit or what. I'm pretty sure my old E60 520d 6MT had one too.
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01-16-2014, 09:08 AM | #3 | |
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I also had a E90 LCI 330d 6sp manual (rare car!) and it never had any resistance point! Neither did my pre LCI 330d. Sounds like they put the wrong components in yours when it was built?
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01-16-2014, 09:10 AM | #4 | |
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01-16-2014, 09:11 AM | #5 |
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Kick down is triggered by the rate in which the throttle is depressed, not by a switch generally.
The fleet of 320d's we have at work all have this notch you are talking about and they all are manual.
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01-16-2014, 09:14 AM | #6 | |
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Ha, it does doesn't it! It was built May 2009 if I remember rightly. Had an oil leak twice on it and a glow plug control unit failure but other than that it was faultless. Really enjoyed that car, did not want to give it up. And being MT, with that much torque and a stiffer setup than the F30, it just went sideways everywhere
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01-16-2014, 09:17 AM | #7 |
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Not every driver has good throttle modulation, some know no difference between WOT and mashing the pedal to the floor. Kick-down, what's that?
I have always found a slight resistance point between WOT and kick-down a good feature, simply like a switch. I remember having my Cortina GT (with the Weber 28/36 twin choke carb), where even the throttle had a 'hard spot' when you went through to the second choke. Easy to modulate 'economy' driving, on the one choke. Was viewed as a positive feature, a bit more control using the senses, same for kick-down as far as I'm concerned. HighlandPete |
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01-16-2014, 09:19 AM | #8 | |
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I had no problems mechanically with it but then I only did 20K in it. But...... had A LOT of annoying rattles/squeaks/creaks ...... it driven me around the bend and was in and out the dealers trying to fix them. Apart from that, good car.
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01-16-2014, 09:27 AM | #9 | |
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Remember a full (aggressive) kick-down in the 8-speed can block change from 8th to 2nd gear in one move. That is one "wake up" manoeuvre you want to control. HighlandPete |
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01-16-2014, 09:32 AM | #10 | |
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01-16-2014, 09:55 AM | #11 | |
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But we do a lot a stop start driving so I opted out and replaced it with an auto the same. The E90 auto was ok but often caught out in wrong gear i felt. And sport was in too high a gear half the time, so i used to drive it with the paddles mostly. Back on topic... have to agree, don't see that much point of kick down on these modern autos. They are intelligent enough to mostly interpret your needs pretty well without it, and I would rather use the paddles any situation where I think kick down would be of relevance. |
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01-16-2014, 10:08 AM | #12 | |
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I don't use kick-down that often, far less in the 8-speed than in the days of the 5-speed. I'll use the paddles to give me the gear I want. But if I'm in lazy drive mode, I'll just kick-down for a fast overtake. Must say I do like the option to be there, as it does have a definite and useful function. HighlandPete |
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01-16-2014, 11:58 AM | #13 |
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I also had 2 x 330d MT's pre and post LCI. The MT LCI in particular was epic apart from in the snow!
Getting back on topic, I hardly ever use kickdown on the 8AT. I prefer to use paddles to drop a couple of gears and then enjoy the swift changes up the box |
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01-16-2014, 12:08 PM | #14 | |
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01-16-2014, 05:14 PM | #16 |
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Certainly so, according to ZF. (I'll find the technical detail). I can't be sure mine has changed from 8th to 2nd but certainly enjoyed the urgency of an instant change to 2nd gear while gently cruising, 6k rpm in milliseconds. Very aggressive response in the 535i to a fast throttle kick-down.
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01-16-2014, 05:21 PM | #18 | |
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01-16-2014, 05:40 PM | #19 | |
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01-16-2014, 06:00 PM | #20 | |
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01-16-2014, 06:15 PM | #21 |
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Same here, and usually don't require full power to get past unless I'm feeling particularly excitable.
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01-17-2014, 12:19 AM | #22 |
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I'm starting to think that I'm not using these gearboxes to their full extent. I dont think I have ever needed to deliberately initiate a kick down using the bump in the pedal. I've just never seen the need. A substaintial press is all I've ever needed to do to give me all the power I need with the appropriate gear change. If I've wanted to go down more than one gear I've put the trans into manual and chosen the gear myself. I've always found a full prod enough to initiate an uncomfortable jolt while the transmission wakes up, changes gear and applies my now 8/10ths throttle. Perhaps i need to try it.
By the way I am quite familiar with autos, had at least one for around 5 years now. DSG golf GTD, E60 M5 SMG, BMW X5, disco 4 |
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