[alexbimmer]

Let me stole a bit of this thread.

I am also confused about kickdown switch. Seems as if nothing really happens when I press it. What is the correct way of using it? Should I just suddenly hit the gas paddle to the metal because if I steadily push the gas and then click it nothing seems to happen. It seems I can get the same high revs without the kickdown so I dont really know how I can use it and feel the difference.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by alexbimmer

Let me stole a bit of this thread.

I am also confused about kickdown switch. Seems as if nothing really happens when I press it. What is the correct way of using it? Should I just suddenly hit the gas paddle to the metal because if I steadily push the gas and then click it nothing seems to happen. It seems I can get the same high revs without the kickdown so I dont really know how I can use it and feel the difference.

What's your experience, just in the 318d?

It won't be so marked as with the bigger more powerful engines, where WOT (Wide Open Throttle) doesn't necessarily trigger the multi down changes in the same way the smaller diesels seem to do. (My experience has been with the 320d ED). Whereas kick-down in something like the 3.0-litre engines can be quite brutal as it block changes and instantly selects the lowest possible gear for the speed driven.

Try different rates of pressing the accelerator to WOT, before kicking down, see how your transmission responds. Speed of applying the accelerator to WOT includes 'kick-fast' (not kick-down) and is part of the driver adaptation, so changes the transmission program to suit the driver inputs. This will overlap into the kick-down function and the gears selected.

Kick-fast is a way to get change downs, without using kick-down. Typically a slow application of the accelerator may not instigate a change, or just one. A faster application the box will change more readily, even make multiple change downs at the same road speed.

Personally I use the accelerator movement and application speed to get the gearbox to do virtually everything I want, when I want. This includes features such as kick-fast, kick-down, upshift suppression (fast lift off to zero position). Also use brake evaluation, (how you apply the brakes) to trigger down shifts for engine braking.

[alexbimmer]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

What's your experience, just in the 318d?

It won't be so marked as with the bigger more powerful engines, where WOT (Wide Open Throttle) doesn't necessarily trigger the multi down changes in the same way the smaller diesels seem to do. (My experience has been with the 320d ED). Whereas kick-down in something like the 3.0-litre engines can be quite brutal as it block changes and instantly selects the lowest possible gear for the speed driven.

Try different rates of pressing the accelerator to WOT, before kicking down, see how your transmission responds. Speed of applying the accelerator to WOT includes 'kick-fast' (not kick-down) and is part of the driver adaptation, so changes the transmission program to suit the driver inputs. This will overlap into the kick-down function and the gears selected.

Kick-fast is a way to get change downs, without using kick-down. Typically a slow application of the accelerator may not instigate a change, or just one. A faster application the box will change more readily, even make multiple change downs at the same road speed.

Personally I use the accelerator movement and application speed to get the gearbox to do virtually everything I want, when I want. This includes features such as kick-fast, kick-down, upshift suppression (fast lift off to zero position). Also use brake evaluation, (how you apply the brakes) to trigger down shifts for engine braking.

Thanks for this, as this is my first BMW I am quite inexperienced to how to use this techniques but I am trying it out. Also taking notes on your suggestions will see how it goes. I had the impression if I press kick-down it will automatically shift into lowest gear, but sometimes it feels as if nothing happenes when I press it down. Does that mean that my transmition is possibly in the lowest possible gear already?

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by alexbimmer

Thanks for this, as this is my first BMW I am quite inexperienced to how to use this techniques but I am trying it out. Also taking notes on your suggestions will see how it goes. I had the impression if I press kick-down it will automatically shift into lowest gear, but sometimes it feels as if nothing happenes when I press it down. Does that mean that my transmition is possibly in the lowest possible gear already?

Unless you are using the manual shifting (paddles) where kick-down is not readily available in all modes, there shouldn't be any issue using and feeling kick-down. Say you are trundling along at 60mph in D and floor the accelerator through the resistance point at WOT, the gearbox should change several gears, typically in one hit (block changing). If you are in M/S position and in a lower gear already, floor it and it will change in similar fashion, just one gear less.

My own car (535i), say I'm driving steady at 55mph in D, I'd typically be in 8th gear. I see an overtaking opportunity coming up and may choose to flick the shifter to M/S to break the driver adaptation, (wakes the box up without any change to the accelerator), drops to 7th... floor the accelerator through the kick-down point and it's brutal, instantly in 2nd gear towards maximum revs, works itself through 3rd and 4th gears as I gain speed.

[alexbimmer]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Unless you are using the manual shifting (paddles) where kick-down is not readily available in all modes, there shouldn't be any issue using and feeling kick-down. Say you are trundling along at 60mph in D and floor the accelerator through the resistance point at WOT, the gearbox should change several gears, typically in one hit (block changing). If you are in M/S position and in a lower gear already, floor it and it will change in similar fashion, just one gear less.

My own car (535i), say I'm driving steady at 55mph in D, I'd typically be in 8th gear. I see an overtaking opportunity coming up and may choose to flick the shifter to M/S to break the driver adaptation, (wakes the box up without any change to the accelerator), drops to 7th... floor the accelerator through the kick-down point and it's brutal, instantly in 2nd gear towards maximum revs, works itself through 3rd and 4th gears as I gain speed.

I did some more testing just now, and when I am in M/S or drive.. And let say at around 100km/h I am in 7th gear, now If I press throttle to full without clicking the kickdown it will drops 2 gears anyhow ..and the exactly same thing happens with the click,.. just don't get it. I did however try in manual mode.. I shifted to M8 gear, and then pressed kickdown click and it jumped to 4th gear..That is the only time I felt difference since pressing full throttle without the click won't downshift. So maybe the "kick-fast" is already doing the same thing as kick down would and that is why I don't notice it But as you said wouldn't putting it in to M/S mode break driver adaption and then I should definatly notice the difference between just flooring it and flooring + kickdown?

Now above video is how I imagined it will work, however once I floor it I see the jump like he does, and then when I press the kickdown nothing more happens no bigger jump.. in his video the revs jump towards red spots.. That is why I imagined something is wrong with my kickdown..But maybe I is also because my red revs start at 6k while his start at 7k and is less prominent in mine.

So I don't essentialy see difference in gear shifts, with just flooring throtle without click so far I got the same switch and jump as with the floor + click.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by alexbimmer

I did some more testing just now, and when I am in M/S or drive.. And let say at around 100km/h I am in 7th gear, now If I press throttle to full without clicking the kickdown it will drops 2 gears anyhow ..and the exactly same thing happens with the click,.. just don't get it. I did however try in manual mode.. I shifted to M8 gear, and then pressed kickdown click and it jumped to 4th gear..That is the only time I felt difference since pressing full throttle without the click won't downshift. So maybe the "kick-fast" is already doing the same thing as kick down would and that is why I don't notice it But as you said wouldn't putting it in to M/S mode break driver adaption and then I should definatly notice the difference between just flooring it and flooring + kickdown?


Now above video is how I imagined it will work, however once I floor it I see the jump like he does, and then when I press the kickdown nothing more happens no bigger jump.. in his video the revs jump towards red spots.. That is why I imagined something is wrong with my kickdown..But maybe I is also because my red revs start at 6k while his start at 7k and is less prominent in mine.

So I don't essentialy see difference in gear shifts, with just flooring throtle without click so far I got the same switch and jump as with the floor + click.

Video shows what happens in a petrol engine with a rev band to suit. What is illustrated is my experience with BMW models, even the 3.0d engines to a lesser degree. WOT can hover around 4,000rpm, there is room for a couple more down changes from WOT in the petrol engine. Remember you have a diesel with a lower rev limit, (and a lower output), so will not be as flexible or as impressive.

I know even smaller petrol engines don't have the same dramatic change, as WOT can mean you are already changing down several gears, little room for a further down change. Gearbox strategy and thresholds may mean no advantage in further down changing. If moderate application of WOT puts your engine around 4,000rpm, what's the advantage of down changing and revving out a diesel, dropping out of the best performance band? You have only about 500rpm before an up change is beneficial anyway.

If you are about 3,000rpm, then further down changing via kick-down will give added acceleration.