[TodmordenLad]

Originally Posted by SteveChester

The problem with the grilles debate is that's the way ALL BMWs will look shortly......

Yep, just wait 'til the new 4 series arrives. The front of the car is basically one huge grille with skinny lights and a bumper attached.

[mikeoz]

Originally Posted by teaston

That is crazy! Mind you, with those grilles it would have to be another £200pm cheaper to tempt me!

Give it time...

[teaston]

Originally Posted by mikeoz

Give it time...

Well, I suppose a black one with black grilles might look ok!

[JD6]

Originally Posted by teaston

Well, I suppose a black one with black grilles might look ok!

I was wondering if there was a good way of camouflaging it. Any examples out there?

While I really like the standard kit, particularly the Comfort Seats, Nappa leather and the build quality, the size would probably put me off.

I should hold out for a decent deal on the M5...

[teaston]

Originally Posted by JD6

I was wondering if there was a good way of camouflaging it. Any examples out there?

While I really like the standard kit, particularly the Comfort Seats, Nappa leather and the build quality, the size would probably put me off.

I should hold out for a decent deal on the M5...

A few:

https://www.samleman.com/inventory/n...7u2c05lgm27693

https://www.jdpower.com/detail/2020/...7u2c00lgm27133

[JNW1]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

What you really want is a great car. With a great deal.

Very true but for obvious reasons the two don't often go together!

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by JD6

I was wondering if there was a good way of camouflaging it. Any examples out there?

While I really like the standard kit, particularly the Comfort Seats, Nappa leather and the build quality, the size would probably put me off.

I should hold out for a decent deal on the M5...

You should!

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by JNW1

Very true but for obvious reasons the two don't often go together!

Nope,but just occasionally it all comes together....

[Mr Burt]

Originally Posted by teaston

A few:

https://www.samleman.com/inventory/n...7u2c05lgm27693

https://www.jdpower.com/detail/2020/...7u2c00lgm27133

I think the black grilles look worst. The front on shots are really not good.
Great car, beautiful looking interior, but as another has already said, you need to look back once parked and admire not cringe.
If anything happens to my F31 I could see my going Mazda next time, the design language of the Germans is currently Gash!

[RoShambolt]

Even in the individual red with black shadowline the grill still looks like it's been photoshopped for a joke. If it was in line with the aggressive head lights it would look serious. What are they playing at? The big stray with design is obviously effecting sales with a 39% discount on these and RustyBits comments about the salesman saying the new three and one aren't selling.

[JD6]

Originally Posted by RoShambolt

Even in the individual red with black shadowline the grill still looks like it's been photoshopped for a joke. If it was in line with the aggressive head lights it would look serious. What are they playing at? The big stray with design is obviously effecting sales with a 39% discount on these and RustyBits comments about the salesman saying the new three and one aren't selling.

It is a real shame. The headlights look sleek and aggressive, and the rest of the design is actually rather good. WTF were they thinking with that grille...

I hope that their sales suffer to such an extent that they realise that the design language needed for some markets will destroy sales in places where people have some sense of modesty.

It wouldn't have been hard to have a thinner, sleek grille for developed markets and a comedy one for the USA and far east.

[Wills2]

I'd say a lack of sales is more down to the UK economy and other political/regulatory issues than the new designs, plus they have always sliced a lot off the 7 and the 6 and the M cars nothing new in that.

I remember the F10 M5 was offered on a £550 per month lease the current one had over 30k slashed from the price to move them recently, the X3M over 20k etc....people crowed about getting 25% off 335d back in the day so this is no different.

I remember getting 33% off a new e92 M3 as well and that didn't have big grilles...

BMW sales are up globally.

[RoShambolt]

Originally Posted by Wills2

I'd say a lack of sales is more down to the UK economy and other political/regulatory issues than the new designs, plus they have always sliced a lot off the 7 and the 6 and the M cars nothing new in that.

I remember the F10 M5 was offered on a £550 per month lease the current one had over 30k slashed from the price to move them recently, the X3M over 20k etc....people crowed about getting 25% off 335d back in the day so this is no different.

I remember getting 33% off a new e92 M3 as well and that didn't have big grilles...

BMW sales are up globally.

True, but surely some these wacky designs can't be helping their situation.

[Wills2]

Originally Posted by RoShambolt

True, but surely some these wacky designs can't be helping their situation.

They're selling more...people who buy 7 series wanted something more impactful than a large 3 series design, new X5 doing very well as is the X7 in the markets that count for those cars.

TBH this forum is full of people that aren't in the market for these cars, they never bought a 7 before aren't driving S-class or the like either and therefore we're not the target audience for these cars.

Their sales are up so no it's not affecting them, I have a 7 series and love the new design I wanted a new one but the deals at the time didn't allow it, however the new deal would have seen me in one.

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by Wills2

They're selling more...people who buy 7 series wanted something more impactful than a large 3 series design, new X5 doing very well as is the X7 in the markets that count for those cars.

TBH this forum is full of people that aren't in the market for these cars, they never bought a 7 before aren't driving S-class or the like either and therefore we're not the target audience for these cars.

Their sales are up so no it's not affecting them, I have a 7 series and love the new design I wanted a new one but the deals at the time didn't allow it, however the new deal would have seen me in one.

I'm not sure that's all true. Plenty of buyers move up the range as they get older, so some of us could easily be BMW's target market. I'm sure you didn't start off in a 7 Series. I nearly bought an A8 on a deal like this a few years ago, only for the dealer to go back on the discount.

I sat in a 7 today at Sytners in Sheffield, I didn't think the black grille looked as bad in the flesh. It didn't look good though.

The designer has already said that the grilles won't stay big for long, it was just to match the current Chinese trend. If he's saying that already, I think it's a pretty good acknowledgment that they're not sure they look good or are right going forwards.

Whilst the market is currently much smaller in Europe, it would still be pretty significant if they could crack the S Class buyers.

And dismissing that a cars appeal can be based on its looks is a little dodgy too. It could be an economic factor, or it could be people just think they look shit. Jaguar are trying to blame all their sales losses on diesel targeting, which then allows them to ignore the fact that they totally ruined the looks of the XF for example. It allows them to conveniently ignore one factor that must make up part of it.

If BMW forums are panning a number of their new designs, they'd be silly not to take a little bit of notice.

I sat behind a new one series the other day as well and thought it looked bland and like a bad Korean take on a hatchback.

[RoShambolt]

Originally Posted by Wills2

They're selling more...people who buy 7 series wanted something more impactful than a large 3 series design, new X5 doing very well as is the X7 in the markets that count for those cars.

TBH this forum is full of people that aren't in the market for these cars, they never bought a 7 before aren't driving S-class or the like either and therefore we're not the target audience for these cars.

Their sales are up so no it's not affecting them, I have a 7 series and love the new design I wanted a new one but the deals at the time didn't allow it, however the new deal would have seen me in one.

I think maybe I should have clarified I was referring to BMW UK and UK sales, I wasn't talking whole world, I have no idea what the Chinese for example think of the 7 and how it's selling there, no doubt if they're loving it BMW aren't offering 39% off.

If nations that like big shinny things and lots of chrome are buying more BMWs than us we may or may not have to get used to seeing more and more of this, time will tell.

Perhaps the biggest point to be taken from whats said in that Forbes piece is that they know they can't please everyone, they're just trying to push the envelope a bit for once and it's getting a mixed reception, you can't knock them for that I suppose.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michael...le-on-purpose/

I've seen one in the flesh and it didn't jump out at me as being a complete mess, just not sure if I would be buying one myself, I'm just finding the whole thing quite interesting as a lot of companies usually play it fairly safe when they have a strong customer base, like Audi. As people say "beauty is in the eye of the beholder".

I don't agree that it would help if you were able to afford a car before you can have an opinion on its looks, if that's the point you're making regarding forum members on here and s-class/7 series buyers(in a backhanded way)
edit: scratch this para as I skim read, you said "we're" not "were" totally changes the intent of what your saying, my bad, I thought you were being a dick. 😅

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by Wills2

Their sales are up so no it's not affecting them, I have a 7 series and love the new design I wanted a new one but the deals at the time didn't allow it, however the new deal would have seen me in one.

So Wills2 if thedeal on the 7 was around before you signed for the X3M which would you have had?

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

So Wills2 if thedeal on the 7 was around before you signed for the X3M which would you have had?

OMG he went there.



I think 7er maybe BUT a man needs to switch it up every now and then, after a while since the M3 I bet the X3M was a very welcome addition.

[teaston]

Originally Posted by Wills2

They're selling more...people who buy 7 series wanted something more impactful than a large 3 series design, new X5 doing very well as is the X7 in the markets that count for those cars.

TBH this forum is full of people that aren't in the market for these cars, they never bought a 7 before aren't driving S-class or the like either and therefore we're not the target audience for these cars.

Their sales are up so no it's not affecting them, I have a 7 series and love the new design I wanted a new one but the deals at the time didn't allow it, however the new deal would have seen me in one.

True, but this forum should be full of people in the market for a 3 series, but they're not buying the new 3 either!

[albew]

Good Information!

[Blacktemplar]

Originally Posted by teaston

A few:

https://www.samleman.com/inventory/n...7u2c05lgm27693

https://www.jdpower.com/detail/2020/...7u2c00lgm27133

Nope, still (IMO of course. In true Auntie fashion, other controversial opinions are available )

[Wills2]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

I'm not sure that's all true. Plenty of buyers move up the range as they get older, so some of us could easily be BMW's target market. I'm sure you didn't start off in a 7 Series. I nearly bought an A8 on a deal like this a few years ago, only for the dealer to go back on the discount.

I sat in a 7 today at Sytners in Sheffield, I didn't think the black grille looked as bad in the flesh. It didn't look good though.

The designer has already said that the grilles won't stay big for long, it was just to match the current Chinese trend. If he's saying that already, I think it's a pretty good acknowledgment that they're not sure they look good or are right going forwards.

Whilst the market is currently much smaller in Europe, it would still be pretty significant if they could crack the S Class buyers.

And dismissing that a cars appeal can be based on its looks is a little dodgy too. It could be an economic factor, or it could be people just think they look shit. Jaguar are trying to blame all their sales losses on diesel targeting, which then allows them to ignore the fact that they totally ruined the looks of the XF for example. It allows them to conveniently ignore one factor that must make up part of it.

If BMW forums are panning a number of their new designs, they'd be silly not to take a little bit of notice.

I sat behind a new one series the other day as well and thought it looked bland and like a bad Korean take on a hatchback.

Coulda, shoulda, woulda does not make a business case.....they take notice of sales not people mouthing off on the internet (we all do that) the real world isn't the internet.

They're bothered about the people in China and the US that buy them.