[DVC]

I just got my OEM -30Min swivel bearings installed, which are intended to add -0.5 degrees of front camber. After install, my shop naturally did an alignment. The results are perfect, with one exception - but the exception is a little troubling...

Front:
Camber-
left: -1.1 deg
right: -0.6 deg

Toe (in)-
left: 0.12 deg
right: 0.10 deg

Rear:
Camber-
left: -1.9 deg
right: -1.9 deg

Toe (in)-
left: 0.14 deg
right: 0.16 deg


The troubling part is of course the fact that there is 0.5 deg less negative camber at the front/right. It's almost as if the right -30Min swivel bearing was never installed. (I wish I had an alignment report before adding the parts to compare against, but this is the first alignment the car has received being that it's only a few weeks old.)
On the road, I feel that the front end has more grip when cornering to the right than to the left - but of course it's very hard to objectively tell how much when factoring in my subjective perception knowing that the numbers are off.

My question is, has anyone else seen alignments where the disparity between left and right front camber was a half degree? Being that the car is brand new, is it possible that it came from the factory with approx. -0.6 degrees on the left, and -0.1 degrees on the right?

[utenigma]

Wow - I might pull the wheel and take a look at the right side, check the part number stamped on the bearing

My guess is the tech did the left side and stopped. Remember these things are meant as camber correction bearings - to fix your car's alignment if it got in an accident. Normally you'd install just one

Or maybe they just put the old part back on accedentially b/c it's new and they couldn't tell, or maybe they picked the wrong part

Or maybe the alignment result is crap - does it pass the obvious test? Park the car on a level surface (verify it's level with a...level), take a long bubble level and orient it up down from the bottom of the tire to the top. Pull the level out a the top until the bubble centers, then measure the distance between the edge of top edge of the tire and where the level's edge now is. Do it on both sides and compare. If the values are the same, the camber is the same (assuming the ground is level)

[utenigma]

Originally Posted by DVC

Front:
Camber-
left: -1.1 deg
right: -0.6 deg

Toe (in)-
left: 0.12 deg
right: 0.10 deg

Rear:
Camber-
left: -1.9 deg
right: -1.9 deg

Toe (out)-
left: 0.14 deg
right: 0.16 deg

Other thing - why is your rear toe'd out? I hope that's a typo and your front's toe'd out and rear's toe'd in because that is going to lead to a ridiculously unstable car.

From Carrol Smith's "Engineer in your Pocket" - Section B: Cause -> Effect

Rear toe-out: any

• Power oversteer during corner exit and (maybe) in a straight line
• Straight line instability

If you're looking at your alignment sheet, a positive value for toe means toe in, negative values mean toe out

[DVC]

Originally Posted by utenigma

Wow - I might pull the wheel and take a look at the right side, check the part number stamped on the bearing

My guess is the tech did the left side and stopped. Remember these things are meant as camber correction bearings - to fix your car's alignment if it got in an accident. Normally you'd install just one

Or maybe they just put the old part back on accedentially b/c it's new and they couldn't tell, or maybe they picked the wrong part

Or maybe the alignment result is crap - does it pass the obvious test? Park the car on a level surface, take a long bubble level and orient it up down from the bottom of the tire to the top. Pull the level out a the top until the bubble centers, then measure the distance between the edge of top edge of the tire and where the level's edge now is. Do it on both sides and compare. If the values are the same, the camber is the same (assuming the ground is level)

Thanks UT - very good suggestion re: measuring with a bubble level. I'll give that a try in the garage tonight.

The install was done at an independent shop that I've used in the past several time to do most of my Dinan mods. Their alignment equipment is the same as what the dealers use, and the tech was well aware that I was intending to install both parts to add negative camber. Having said all that, there is still a chance he messed something up... my first thought was that maybe he took off the old part, then accidentally re-installed the same part again (rather than the new one). But the removed parts do both appear to be equally "dirty" from a whole 1200 miles of use... which is when I started to wonder if they accidentally shipped me the wrong part. I confirmed the part numbers that were ordered, but I'm not sure how to confirm that the parts themselves actually match the part numbers. (I'll inspect the old parts to see if they have part numbers etched on them anywhere)

Hopefully it's the simplest solution, which would be a wonky alignment report. I'm bringing it back to the shop next week for them to take another look at it.

[DVC]

Originally Posted by utenigma

Other thing - why is your rear toe'd out? I hope that's a typo and your front's toe'd out and rear's toe'd in because that is going to lead to a ridiculously unstable car.

From Carrol Smith's "Engineer in your Pocket" - Section B: Cause -> Effect



If you're looking at your alignment sheet, a positive value for toe means toe in, negative values mean toe out

Yes, you're right... both front and rear are positive numbers, so they must both be towed in (corrected above)

[shivaswrath]

Did you sort it out?

[DVC]

I measured the way UT suggested above, and each side came out to about the same. It was very difficult to get a consistent measurement using this method though, so I still want to get it re-checked; I am stopping back into the shop on Thursday to have them check the alignment again (and hopefully verify the part number of the bearing).

[utenigma]

Originally Posted by DVC

I measured the way UT suggested above, and each side came out to about the same. (It was very difficult to get a consistent measurement using this method though, so I still want to get it re-checked; I am stopping back into the shop on Thursday to have them check the alignment again (and hopefully verify the part number of the bearing).

Yeah, I don't suggest you try to align the car using that technique - but for checking to see if it looks basically ok, it'll do in a pinch

[DVC]

I just pulled off the wheels and verified that the part numbers of the swivel bearings are correct... at this point, I'm hoping that the front camber numbers were just an alignment anomaly.

On another note, in case anyone is wondering, Apex ARC-8s in 18x9 ET42 will NOT fit up front with 245/40-18 Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 tires.
Apparently this is a particularly wide tire, and the widest part (the raised bead to protect the face of the wheels) is firmly touching the strut. (This is actually a non-directional tire, so it has this bead on both sides... perhaps this is the problem.)

Apex has advised that they think a 3mm spacer should be enough to clear it... fingers crossed.
Oh, and it should be noted that Apex is shipping me the spacers for free. What a great company.

[RSXDC5]

Originally Posted by DVC

On another note, in case anyone is wondering, Apex ARC-8s in 18x9 ET42 will NOT fit up front with 245/40-18 Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 tires.
Apparently this is a particularly wide tire, and the widest part (the raised bead to protect the face of the wheels) is firmly touching the strut.

Apex has advised that they think a 3mm spacer should be enough to clear it... fingers crossed.

When you installed the oem alternate hub, what you may have failed to realize was that you were changing the camber angle by changing the angle of the HUB in relation to the strut/spring...a camber plate on the other hand, changes the camber angle by pulling the strut/spring inwards, from up top, giving you additional wheel/tire clearance on the inside as a by-product.

A hub swap like you did will inevitably decrease clearance between your tire (which is directly connected to the hub and its angle that you changed) and the strut/spring.

Apex's fitment guide for the 18x9 +42 with 245's was sooo close to the strut/spring as is, your installation of the oem alternate hub was enough to cause contact.

I definitely would have been having one of these moments with your situation... ...Luckily a very small spacer will fix your problem

[DVC]

Originally Posted by RSXDC5

A hub swap like you did will inevitably decrease clearance between your tire (which is directly connected to the hub and its angle that you changed) and the strut/spring.
...Luckily a very small spacer will fix your problem

Yes, that makes perfect sense - good call, and thanks for the insight! Hopefully the 3mm spacer will be enough, but if it's not, I could go with a larger spacer.

Apex advised that a 3mm spacer would be the largest that would still allow fender clearance, but for the same reason that the camber bearing pulls the inside/top of the wheel closer to the strut, it also pulls the outside/top of the wheel farther away from the fender... so I'm thinking a 5mm spacer should still be fine.

[utenigma]

Were you able to get the alignment re-checked yesterday?

[DVC]

Originally Posted by utenigma

Were you able to get the alignment re-checked yesterday?

No, haven't been able to get back out to the shop yet... It will probably be 2 weeks before I can get the chance.
In the mean time, I really haven't been noticing that the car grips better around left hand corners than rights, but it's probably hard to tell the difference in normal driving.

[Forgiven]

Dude, don't worry about it..I went to independent BMW shop,too first and got the similar numbers as yours. Then I took it to dealer, it was all fine, just little adjustment on rear toe but nothing serious..

It's because your mechanic has outdated alignment machine for our vehicle, probably has it under E93 3 series(see it for yourself). I watched mine getting done at the shop, he was using Hunter DSP 600, setting under E93 3 series. I was little skeptical so I took it to BMW dealership afterward.

[verheizer]

I found out that the M135i has got the -0.5° camber correction swivel bearings as standard! With the M235i it will probably be the same...

Is there anyone in this forum who installed those swivel bearings on a 4 series?

[Sami951]

Hi!

I recently had Bilstein B14 coilovers installed on my F31 328i and the front camber came out around -0.5 on the left (driver) side, -1.0 on the right side.. shop said there's nothing they can do since it's not adjustable. I have no clue how the camber was before coilovers went in. Is there any easy way to see if I've got stock swivel bearings in place, or if one side is with the correction-bearing ?

I bought the car 2nd hand (demo car), so history is not 100% certain.

[DVC]

Probably unlikely that you have just one swivel bearing installed, but yes, you can check. The easiest way is to reach around the tire under the hub with your phone and snap a picture (with the flash on) so you can see the part number on the hub.

[M-terkait]

Originally Posted by DVC

I just pulled off the wheels and verified that the part numbers of the swivel bearings are correct... at this point, I'm hoping that the front camber numbers were just an alignment anomaly.

On another note, in case anyone is wondering, Apex ARC-8s in 18x9 ET42 will NOT fit up front with 245/40-18 Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 tires.
Apparently this is a particularly wide tire, and the widest part (the raised bead to protect the face of the wheels) is firmly touching the strut. (This is actually a non-directional tire, so it has this bead on both sides... perhaps this is the problem.)

Apex has advised that they think a 3mm spacer should be enough to clear it... fingers crossed.
Oh, and it should be noted that Apex is shipping me the spacers for free. What a great company.

same thing happening to me with MPSS 245/40/18
installed 3mm still touches the strut -.-
i guess im going to remove the 5mm and install it front but its going to stick out of the fender more than now :|

so its either to go camberplate or drop?

[DVC]

A 5mm non-hubcentric spacer is a bit much for the front hub centering lip... you may get a bit of vibration. I ended up going with a 10mm hubcentric spacer for the front, and all is well now.

[tsakhan]

Thoughts on whats causing the large neg camber on front right

[Car54]

Anyone have the part numbers for the swivel bearings? Do they work on xdrive?

[Car54]

Wait...I think I found them. $242x2??? No way.

02 Pivot bearing, camber correction, left -30MIN 1 31216856535
02 Pivot bearing, camber correction, left +30MIN 1 31216856537
02 Carrier, right 1 31216853820 +core
02 Swivel bearing, camber correction, right -30MIN 1 31216856536
02 Swivel bearing, camber correction, right +30MIN 1 31216856538