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      10-24-2012, 02:17 PM   #595
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Got my car last night.

328i Sport-line, RWD, tech package, No Dynamic handling package, summer tires. I felt absolutely no vibrations at all.
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      10-25-2012, 12:58 AM   #596
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Quote:
Originally Posted by octavian View Post
Got my car last night.

328i Sport-line, RWD, tech package, No Dynamic handling package, summer tires. I felt absolutely no vibrations at all.
Let go of the steering wheel between 40-55mph and see if it dances back and forth.
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      10-25-2012, 03:09 AM   #597
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
Let go of the steering wheel between 40-55mph and see if it dances back and forth.
We have users who say they have no vibration and can feel nothing when driving along holding the wheel, and the test is to let go of the wheel to see if there is movement?

Are we looking to make a problem here, that may never come up in with many drivers? How can I put this.... Let's be careful here, or BMW won't take the real problem seriously, if they think it is being hyped up by forum hysteria.

This confuses me even more, to what some are saying the vibration issue really is. I was of the understanding that drivers could feel this as a "true vibration" while driving with hands on the wheel.

BTW, my E91 330d steering wheel would dance about if you let go, in some situations, simply due to run-flat tire characteristics. Removed them and it all stopped.

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      10-25-2012, 07:12 AM   #598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighlandPete View Post
We have users who say they have no vibration and can feel nothing when driving along holding the wheel, and the test is to let go of the wheel to see if there is movement?

Are we looking to make a problem here, that may never come up in with many drivers? How can I put this.... Let's be careful here, or BMW won't take the real problem seriously, if they think it is being hyped up by forum hysteria.

This confuses me even more, to what some are saying the vibration issue really is. I was of the understanding that drivers could feel this as a "true vibration" while driving with hands on the wheel.

BTW, my E91 330d steering wheel would dance about if you let go, in some situations, simply due to run-flat tire characteristics. Removed them and it all stopped.

HighlandPete
Just asking. I have no concerns that BMW will take this complaint any more or less seriously based on these forum discussions. They are way smarter than that.

Of the F30 cars I drove so far, the steering wheel danced when lightly held or not holding, but I wasn't really able to feel vibration while holding. My dealer tells me half of the complaints from customers cannot be felt. So, it seems some are just annoyed with the wheel dancing when lightly held.

BTW, both mine and my wife's E90's, E46's and E36's never had a hint of steering wobble, vibration, etc. BMW has historically mastered this issue so its with much surprise that they didn't in the F30.
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      10-25-2012, 09:02 AM   #599
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
Let go of the steering wheel between 40-55mph and see if it dances back and forth.
I am sorry but it sounds silly.

I was paranoid after reading this thread and when I drove my car I was ACTIVELY looking to feel the vinbrations and after driving it around for two days i still feel NOTHING.

And it's not like i was choking the life out of the steering. I held it very lightly with one hand, and drove between 40-55 mph (among faster and lower speeds) for a while.

I am not going to let go of the steering wheel at a certain speed and then watch to see if it vibrates. As long is it doesnt vibrate in my hand, I am perfectly fine.

Last edited by octavian; 10-25-2012 at 09:11 AM..
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      10-25-2012, 09:38 AM   #600
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
Just asking. I have no concerns that BMW will take this complaint any more or less seriously based on these forum discussions. They are way smarter than that.

Of the F30 cars I drove so far, the steering wheel danced when lightly held or not holding, but I wasn't really able to feel vibration while holding. My dealer tells me half of the complaints from customers cannot be felt. So, it seems some are just annoyed with the wheel dancing when lightly held.

BTW, both mine and my wife's E90's, E46's and E36's never had a hint of steering wobble, vibration, etc. BMW has historically mastered this issue so its with much surprise that they didn't in the F30.
perfectly said. all my cars prior, e90, e60, x5...you taje your hands off the wheel and not a hint of movement.
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      10-25-2012, 08:28 PM   #601
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Quote:
Originally Posted by octavian View Post
I am sorry but it sounds silly.

I was paranoid after reading this thread and when I drove my car I was ACTIVELY looking to feel the vinbrations and after driving it around for two days i still feel NOTHING.

And it's not like i was choking the life out of the steering. I held it very lightly with one hand, and drove between 40-55 mph (among faster and lower speeds) for a while.

I am not going to let go of the steering wheel at a certain speed and then watch to see if it vibrates. As long is it doesnt vibrate in my hand, I am perfectly fine.
Good for you.
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      10-26-2012, 05:35 AM   #602
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continued:
Just went back to the dealer. My 320iA with sport suspension (not adaptive) and no VSS/servotronic was balanced and aligned two weeks ago, but there are still vibrations (not visible though).
A mechanic drove my car with me in the passenger seat. He could feel the vibrations but told me this cannot be classified as 'the issue', nor would he be able to do anything about it. Compared to other cars, mine was as smooth as it would ever be. He did confirm that the F30 is build so precise that it is more prone to transferring road feedback and that it is also caused by the run-flat tires.
Concluding he could not do anything for me, he suggested to come back once the winter tires are mounted (4 weeks from now) and see what happens. And hope BMW comes with a solution.
My conclusion is that the F30 has a restless steering wheel with vibrations similar to those know to motorist (engine vibrations in that case). BMW has no solution. It doesnt bother me unless i am driving 100kms with barely touching the wheel. Sitting close to wheel (sporty position) makes me enjoy the car and hardly notice it (sitting close to the wheel makes my hands push the wheel, which changes the experience.)
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      10-26-2012, 09:58 AM   #603
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dc_bmw View Post
continued:
Just went back to the dealer. My 320iA with sport suspension (not adaptive) and no VSS/servotronic was balanced and aligned two weeks ago, but there are still vibrations (not visible though).
A mechanic drove my car with me in the passenger seat. He could feel the vibrations but told me this cannot be classified as 'the issue', nor would he be able to do anything about it. Compared to other cars, mine was as smooth as it would ever be. He did confirm that the F30 is build so precise that it is more prone to transferring road feedback and that it is also caused by the run-flat tires.
Concluding he could not do anything for me, he suggested to come back once the winter tires are mounted (4 weeks from now) and see what happens. And hope BMW comes with a solution.
My conclusion is that the F30 has a restless steering wheel with vibrations similar to those know to motorist (engine vibrations in that case). BMW has no solution. It doesnt bother me unless i am driving 100kms with barely touching the wheel. Sitting close to wheel (sporty position) makes me enjoy the car and hardly notice it (sitting close to the wheel makes my hands push the wheel, which changes the experience.)
Hi DC_BMW,

Since your car is smoother than others, your mechanic just divulged you that your car isn't PRECISELY built enough. Another question is what will be the impact of this when you make 50K mileage with no fix ? How will this affect your re-selling point ? How will affect your maintenance cost when your warranty is gone ? Looks like your dealer is making you accept that there won't be any fix ever.
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      10-26-2012, 10:46 AM   #604
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
Let go of the steering wheel between 40-55mph and see if it dances back and forth.
maybe its a built in safety feature to tell u to put your hands back on the steering wheel??
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      10-26-2012, 11:57 AM   #605
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ES_TRADER View Post
maybe its a built in safety feature to tell u to put your hands back on the steering wheel??
Good spin :-)
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      10-26-2012, 12:16 PM   #606
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ES_TRADER View Post
maybe its a built in safety feature to tell u to put your hands back on the steering wheel??
Actually, the safety feature would be for BMW to fix it so owners can stop testing for vibrations and instead focus on driving.
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      10-26-2012, 12:34 PM   #607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin
Quote:
Originally Posted by ES_TRADER View Post
maybe its a built in safety feature to tell u to put your hands back on the steering wheel??
Actually, the safety feature would be for BMW to fix it so owners can stop testing for vibrations and instead focus on driving.
lol
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      10-29-2012, 03:03 PM   #608
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Took car to dealer, rebalanced tires and still vibrating wheel, although it vibrates a little less....what is BMW doing to fix these rogue steering issue ?

Is this affecting less than 5% of all cars ?
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      10-30-2012, 06:55 PM   #609
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kirklander View Post
Hi DC_BMW,

Since your car is smoother than others, your mechanic just divulged you that your car isn't PRECISELY built enough. Another question is what will be the impact of this when you make 50K mileage with no fix ? How will this affect your re-selling point ? How will affect your maintenance cost when your warranty is gone ? Looks like your dealer is making you accept that there won't be any fix ever.
The only thing that will negatively affect resale values are threads like this.
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      10-30-2012, 06:57 PM   #610
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
Let go of the steering wheel between 40-55mph and see if it dances back and forth.
This is just plain ridiculous. That's NOT a vibration.
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      10-30-2012, 07:05 PM   #611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BavarianFanatic View Post
This is just plain ridiculous. That's NOT a vibration.
Totally agree with you!
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      10-30-2012, 07:08 PM   #612
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My god, DONT LET GO OF THE STEERING WHEEL!!!! THATS DRIVING 101
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      10-30-2012, 07:10 PM   #613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BavarianFanatic View Post
This is just plain ridiculous. That's NOT a vibration.
Do you work for BMWNA? Or maybe you're a troll?

Go easy. Some owners don't quite understand the vibration issue well. Some feel it but take it to their dealer and hear from their service dept that they "cannot duplicate". I'm only trying to help educate.

B4 you bark at others, go drive a F30 and let go of the wheel or hold it lightly. See if it dances back and forth. Then go and drive any other car (your choice) and see if it does same.
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      10-30-2012, 07:12 PM   #614
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HERE........Letting go of the steering wheel....GREAT IDEA
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      10-30-2012, 07:18 PM   #615
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Forgive me for not reading all 28 pages, but from what I've observed seeing the posts every other day it seems this has reached a level of hysteria that's no longer based in reality.

I'm sure there ARE some folks experiencing actual vibrations as they've indicated wheel balancing corrected the problem for them. But these references to letting go of the wheel and "watching" it vibrate are just nuts. As with everything else, look hard enough for "trouble" with a biased approach and you'll find it.

Here's something to consider - the F30 has an electric servo for power assist as opposed to the fixed boost hydraulic servo of yore. The new system is infinitely adjustable to compensate for changing conditions, speeds, inputs, etc. I have a feeling that these "vibrations" that many are feeling are actually minute changes in the boost signal reacting to said conditions/inputs. I think the fact that the wheel oscillates when released is actually indicative of this. It could also simply be a side effect of removing one of the inputs from the system that causes the algorithm to become unstable.

The system is constantly measuring inputs at the wheel. If there suddenly is no input (no resistance from driver) it's plausible that it simply doesn't know how to react. This isn't a fault. It's a function of PID control.

I might be off base, but this is my hypothesis. I've read that BMW did quite a bit of work with the system to provide the "feedback" that everyone wants but that is often lost with electric assist. Perhaps this artificial feedback is the culprit. Or perhaps it's the actual feedback that hasn't been properly filtered. The fact that tire changes have mitigated the issue are peculiar as well since it's generally a switch to a more compliant sidewall that corrects the "problem".

I'm not trying to make light of the issue for folks experiencing it. I'm just suggesting that everyone take pause and approach this in a logical, unbiased manner. You FEEL a vibration. You don't WATCH it.
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      10-30-2012, 07:25 PM   #616
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
Do you work for BMWNA? Or maybe you're a troll?

Go easy. Some owners don't quite understand the vibration issue well. Some feel it but take it to their dealer and hear from their service dept that they "cannot duplicate". I'm only trying to help educate.

B4 you bark at others, go drive a F30 and let go of the wheel or hold it lightly. See if it dances back and forth. Then go and drive any other car (your choice) and see if it does same.
No on both accounts. But I AM an engineer.

While your comment might have been delivered with the intention of "helping", it's ill advised to ever let go of the wheel while driving. Especially in the hopes of "seeing" a vibration.

I've driven plenty of F30s. I've driven dozens of cars over the decades. Hell, I've OWNED dozens of cars. I've had plenty of experience with vibrations of all sorts. Steering systems aren't particularly complicated or difficult to understand or diagnose.

I suggest anyone experiencing this go drive any electrically-boosted car of any make with the same scrutiny and see what happens. For some reason it seems this fundamental quality is being overlooked. It's a new world just as it was when electronic throttles first became commonplace.
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