[J_MENIS]

First of all, I would like to give a special thank you to @mike@x-ph.com for hooking it up with a great deal!

I had taken comparison pics of the FMICs but for some reason they didnt save.

For those of you who are not familiar, the Phoenix FMIC is roughly $300 (without any promotion).... And i will let the logs say the rest.

San Francisco 50F, Full-Bolt ons, E40. Hard to do log during 9pm at night. But ill post more logs on this thread as needed.

http://www.datazap.me/u/jmenis/fbo?log=0&data=1-4 - 3rd to roughly red line.

http://www.datazap.me/u/jmenis/fbo-spin?log=0&data=1-4 - 2-4 with wheel spin.

Feel free to check out my datzap account to compare logs from before the FMIC. and even my last car lol #23psi.

[1stupidsailor]

The temps on many of the recent logs are increasing quickly. With an aftermarket IC, the temps drop immediately when getting on it even a little as air starts moving over and through it, then steady out and begin their increase. Compare longer runs, not single gear runs, and compare what the IC bottoms at and how much it rises. Cruising and stop and go temps are relatively similar to stock, it's how the IC performs when under WOT, and how much it's increasing that I would think shows how well it works. If the temp is bounding up quickly the last half of the one-gear run, I think that's something to be noted.


It performs better than stock, that's what's relevant. Outside of that, it's up to the owner to decide if their spent money was worth it. For $300 to get any notable increase, I'd say that's a good deal. 50F outside though, I'm jealous...

[FSociety]

Originally Posted by 1stupidsailor

The temps on many of the recent logs are increasing quickly. With an aftermarket IC, the temps drop immediately when getting on it even a little as air starts moving over and through it, then steady out and begin their increase. Compare longer runs, not single gear runs, and compare what the IC bottoms at and how much it rises. Cruising and stop and go temps are relatively similar to stock, it's how the IC performs when under WOT, and how much it's increasing that I would think shows how well it works. If the temp is bounding up quickly the last half of the one-gear run, I think that's something to be noted.


It performs better than stock, that's what's relevant. Outside of that, it's up to the owner to decide if their spent money was worth it. For $300 to get any notable increase, I'd say that's a good deal. 50F outside though, I'm jealous...

Agree, im happy I saw Phoenix logs and Rev9 before and made my purchase of CTS easy since its on sale for only a few bucks more and still under $400 shipped.

[J_MENIS]

Originally Posted by 1stupidsailor

The temps on many of the recent logs are increasing quickly. With an aftermarket IC, the temps drop immediately when getting on it even a little as air starts moving over and through it, then steady out and begin their increase. Compare longer runs, not single gear runs, and compare what the IC bottoms at and how much it rises. Cruising and stop and go temps are relatively similar to stock, it's how the IC performs when under WOT, and how much it's increasing that I would think shows how well it works. If the temp is bounding up quickly the last half of the one-gear run, I think that's something to be noted.


It performs better than stock, that's what's relevant. Outside of that, it's up to the owner to decide if their spent money was worth it. For $300 to get any notable increase, I'd say that's a good deal. 50F outside though, I'm jealous...

I agree this isn't the best FMIC, but IMO it's doing the job. The two logs above were the best of about 8 back to back WOT pulls within a 15 min span. (4 pulls allowing map 5 to adjust) and a few pulls for smiles lol.

While temp is increasing slightly, the stock FMIC would of been heat soaked by my 3rd pull or so. Not to mention before the FMIC map 5 wouldn't hold 15 psi, instead it would hold around 12.

IMO this FMIC is perfect for someone looking to drive spiritedly and save money. Definitely would recommend something else for track oriented people.

However, after adding the FMIC I can't hook my MPSS from 1-3 anymore (used to be able to even with this weather) . So the butt dyno shows improvement

[J_MENIS]

For those who can't view the logs
Log 1: 2-4 gear with a ton of wheel speed (explains boost)

Log 2 : Without FMIC 2-4 gear roughly 60F

[sicmadek]

Im happy with my phoenix ic and i honestly think its the same as the cts. People need to state which front numper they have when posting iat logs.

[FVierra27]

Originally Posted by sicmadek

Im happy with my phoenix ic and i honestly think its the same as the cts. People need to state which front numper they have when posting iat logs.

I am trying to figure that out. Can one of you guys get a measurement of the fin density?

[sicmadek]

Originally Posted by FVierra27

I am trying to figure that out. Can one of you guys get a measurement of the fin density?

When i measured it was the same results as in the cts ic thread.

[FVierra27]

Originally Posted by sicmadek

When i measured it was the same results as in the cts ic thread.

Then it sounds like it may be.

[J_MENIS]

Originally Posted by sicmadek

Im happy with my phoenix ic and i honestly think its the same as the cts. People need to state which front numper they have when posting iat logs.

I have the m sport bumper

[1stupidsailor]

Originally Posted by FSociety

Agree, im happy I saw Phoenix logs and Rev9 before and made my purchase of CTS easy since its on sale for only a few bucks more and still under $400 shipped.

I think the cheaper options will be better for most people, as most don't have the climate or mods to necessitate something larger, especially when considering the price differences now available. My choice was based on climate first, then perceived quality next based on the upper end options available. Crappy gas lent to that as well. I definitely wouldn't have bothered with the ER if I was still stuck in Oregon, but I'm pretty happy with it here.

[1stupidsailor]

Originally Posted by sicmadek

Im happy with my phoenix ic and i honestly think its the same as the cts. People need to state which front numper they have when posting iat logs.

Agree wholeheartedly. I finally picked up my M-sport bumper from the paint shop today and took a couple quick measurements. The open area to the front is almost 3 times larger on the M-sport, I'm sure that accounts for some cooling while in motion as well as the containment of heat. I noticed I also have like a large rubber flap that runs the length of the IC attached to the old bumper that sits over top of the IC. Seems like another heat trap as well, so I'm going to leave that off when I do the swap.

[sicmadek]

Originally Posted by 1stupidsailor

Agree wholeheartedly. I finally picked up my M-sport bumper from the paint shop today and took a couple quick measurements. The open area to the front is almost 3 times larger on the M-sport, I'm sure that accounts for some cooling while in motion as well as the containment of heat. I noticed I also have like a large rubber flap that runs the length of the IC attached to the old bumper that sits over top of the IC. Seems like another heat trap as well, so I'm going to leave that off when I do the swap.

I removed all of that from mine. Having a m sport bumper is a ic upgrade by itself.

[hardparker]

That "large rubber flap that runs the length of the IC attached to the old bumper that sits over top of the IC" and the other pieces around it are designed to direct flow and pressure through the intercooler, rather than around it. Anything you can do to duct the maximum frontal area open in the bumper through the intercooler core, without offering a bypassing flow around it, will help with intercooler efficiency.

[sicmadek]

Originally Posted by hardparker

That "large rubber flap that runs the length of the IC attached to the old bumper that sits over top of the IC" and the other pieces around it are designed to direct flow and pressure through the intercooler, rather than around it. Anything you can do to duct the maximum frontal area open in the bumper through the intercooler core, without offering a bypassing flow around it, will help with intercooler efficiency.

Maybe for the stock ic but it was completely blocking the top of my phoenix ic.

[sicmadek]

Originally Posted by wakeofdeath

With the price of CTS Turbo IC and with the logs/reviews already here, there's not an IC that makes more sense at their current sale price. $384 shipped vs $300 (Phoenix logs are worth $200)

They are the same ic. I spoke with cts today and the guy told me there was a very high chance of this. They come from the same manufacture in china.

[FSociety]

I think the Black Powder Coating in the Phoenix/Rev9 might not be helping ?

I thought they were similar too and I went on and bought from CTS Turbo because its a well known brand (VW/Audi contender). Comparing a friends Log from July (we went to dyno together) his IAT weren't impressive vs my stock one but def 20-30F difference only.

I' just saw some VRSF Race Logs and for $700 doesn't look like its doing a "$700 job" to be honest
I spent about 6 months looking at FMIC and comparing logs, even was ready to go with Rev9 (only if i could get it for $200) cuz it was an upgrade over stock but not worth $300+

Then sicmadek got Rev9 and while I had already seen my buddy's IAT in the summer with Rev9 too i wasnt impressed (DynoDay), sicmadek temps were a bit better. Then I saw the CTS Turbo went on tax return sale and badbread thread that has a really good review + logs made a good impression i knew it was a sign. About 10 of us joined a GroupBuy and got the FMIC for $360 shipped (Sale on website $384 shipped ends on the 10th of this month).

I didn't wait no time, installed it the next day took stock FMIC logs same day same 16-19psi boost map (aggressive). This was last week. now today I was on a Dyno for 2hrs tweaking and seeing where my car is on a Mustang dyno "Heartbreaker". Just want to let everyone know I dont care which IC you go with, but CTS Turbo may or not look like my neighbors IC, the difference is, its really working guys. Now I understand if the IC were $300 vs $450+, but in this case the Phoenix/Rev9 is a $200-$250 IC and being marked up $300-$400 (is not worth it). Heck, buddy of mine bought a VRSF for $300 on black friday LOL. I'm not the only guy with logs and proof; the vendors dont want another brand to sell if it aint there's ;-)

Here's some IAT logs from my 2hr Dyno session today, Ambient 60F ; Not the best AirFlow in the Dyno (only 5ft from the wall) and a small door open (back). Fans weren't on highway but hey whatever i dont care i wanted to see what it would do; going to Dynojet in a week for my comparison to my last year run.

Stock run in 5th gear (2nd pull of the day)
Starting temp 75F
Under Wide Open Throttle: 73F
At Redline: 84F

Did about 15 pulls total and without more than 5mins of cool down

The difference with what we're seeing being compare is JB4 cars on map2/5 (boost not consistent) and not map7 (absolute) 18psi target
My flash is (holding boost through the range, unlike piggyback that does not hold boost consistently) look at the IAT for yourself guys, when car is heat-soaking, pulling time your jb4 drops boost. check out my signature for logs and will be adding more this week.

What we mostly see is 2-4th gear, but most of the heatsoak occurs in back to back 3-5th gear and most of it 5th gear from my logging. Redline the car and don't shift early is where I see all my heatsoak

Since i'm running jb4 map4 (DME_BT is my true DME boost)
http://datazap.me/u/fsociety/log-148...1-5-6-15-19-23 (see how under WOT my temps drop)
http://datazap.me/u/fsociety/log-148...=1-4-5-6-15-19

Last but not least, go see my comments on http://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1322795 when I was asking badbread for more logs, info etc why? because i wanted to see if he can duplicate the results. I know am seeing it for myself. I have no favorites just letting you guys know, research before spending $1 or $1000

[wakeofdeath]

Originally Posted by sicmadek

They are the same ic. I spoke with cts today and the guy told me there was a very high chance of this. They come from the same manufacture in china.

I still would choose the CTS Turbo for all the more reasons
I have someone to email or call, btw you also said in the other thread that PTF/Bm3 takes 30mins to flash (You're wrong here), can I see the proof of CTS saying this to you?

But i do notice VRSF/CTS Turbo/Wagner/Phoenix/Rev9 all look alike, logs will speak for themselves.

[J_MENIS]

Originally Posted by wakeofdeath

I still would choose the CTS Turbo for all the more reasons
I have someone to email or call, btw you also said in the other thread that PTF/Bm3 takes 30mins to flash, can I see the proof of CTS saying this to you?

But i do notice VRSF/CTS Turbo/Wagner/Phoenix/Rev9 all look alike, logs will speak for themselves.

I would post up more logs, some from 3-5th but I made a rookie mistake and didn't tighten my clamps down and my CP is leaking lmao

(I will post my map 7 wot log I took right when my clamp blew.) so people can see the FMIC under heavy booost
All in all, I haven't done any digging for logs. But it seems the 2 are almost similar. However there is more available data for the CTS out I believe. Which may be a contributing factor to why people are favoriting it more.

It also depends on what mods people have and how much boost their car is making. And a bunch of other factors

[wakeofdeath]

Originally Posted by J_MENIS

I would post up more logs, some from 3-5th but I made a rookie mistake and didn't tighten my clamps down and my CP is leaking lmao

(I will post my map 7 wot log I took right when my clamp blew.) so people can see the FMIC under heavy booost
All in all, I haven't done any digging for logs. But it seems the 2 are almost similar. However there is more available data for the CTS out I believe. Which may be a contributing factor to why people are favoriting it more.

It also depends on what mods people have and how much boost their car is making. And a bunch of other factors

I don't think there is more data for the CTS, but just the few folks that have it are showing it actually works better. The Phoenix is the same Rev9 from my research and they work better than stock just not better than CTS. For the money, I was happy to spend $60 more for CTS.

With this review itself http://*************/new-intercooler/ made my decision easy, then seeing FSociety and the other guys in the CTS Turbo Intercooler thread I couldn't pass it. Don't mean to hi-jack your thread and yes a lot of ppl dont have high boost logs, happens that the CTS turbo logs are running more boost and higher gears than the other folks.

[J_MENIS]

Originally Posted by wakeofdeath

I don't think there is more data for the CTS, but just the few folks that have it are showing it actually works better. The Phoenix is the same Rev9 from my research and they work better than stock just not better than CTS. For the money, I was happy to spend $60 more for CTS.

With this review itself http://*************/new-intercooler/ made my decision easy, then seeing FSociety and the other guys in the CTS Turbo Intercooler thread I couldn't pass it. Don't mean to hi-jack your thread and yes a lot of ppl dont have high boost logs, happens that the CTS turbo logs are running more boost and higher gears than the other folks.

By all means your not hijacking my thread. If an intercooler provides better data then, that's enough said.

However without the discount it is about $500 or so. And this thread was for those who were looking to for a cheaper FMIC

[sicmadek]

Originally Posted by wakeofdeath

I still would choose the CTS Turbo for all the more reasons
I have someone to email or call, btw you also said in the other thread that PTF/Bm3 takes 30mins to flash (You're wrong here), can I see the proof of CTS saying this to you?

But i do notice VRSF/CTS Turbo/Wagner/Phoenix/Rev9 all look alike, logs will speak for themselves.

The black coating definitely could be affecting the performance and i dont have a m sport bumper. I honestly dont care enough to argue about whos cheap ic is better. All of these threads are useless to me without timeslips. Those are the only numbers that matter to me.