[rickinaz]

Originally Posted by rickinaz

If this makes you feel any better:

I have my first BMW on order (2014 435i w/MPPK) since 2000. I have previously owned a new e39 and a used 2002tii. Over the last 10 years I have exclusively owned 911s as my non-DD. We have the same debate on the Porsche forum, but it is even a bigger stretch. Their factory powerkit is called the X51. For the 997 (the model I own) $16K buys 26bhp and a claimed 1/10 second improvement 0-60. [I didn't go for it, but some do]

Here it is on sale for $13,400, but you still have to pay for installation. And...I stand corrected, 0-60 improves by .2 second. Read the review on the adjacent tab at the website.

http://www.suncoastparts.com/product/9971X51.html

[Newton2001]

Thanks !
Interesting !

[TreDirtyFive]

Finally, someone who shares my sentiment, objectively, about the MPPK's on the N55. I've sampled it all...M235i, 435i, 335i, early N55's in my 135, oem, MPPK variants, tuned, FBO, you name it. And I've have beaten on most of them on the track. No armchair magazine spec. racing here. This is fact that the power increase is nominal, at best, and the inclusion of the open intake tray for that slightly louder induction sound and more overrun burbles are part of the psychological/emotional sensation that you are paying for. Not to mention all the stickers that give you that mental edge you are really close to real M territory (NOT).

Don't get me wrong, there is definitely a change...and I wouldn't simply call it negligible but I wouldn't call it dramatic either. The bmw fanboys (especially the newcomers) are losing their pants over it as if they are making over 450hp and going out there lining up with AMGs because the blatantly visible M Performance stickers and over boosted throttle tip-in gives them the gusto to go for the gold. Also, the BMW supported MPPK Dinan dynos are a sham if you ask me. Just MHO.

Most of this is simply business strategy by using the heritage of the M branding to get you to pay more for features that are already built into the car from the get go. I'm sure the car can easily accommodate these horsepower figures out of the box. But why give it to you when you can pay for it and feel like a superstar? The promise of better fuel economy equals a sloppy and lazy throttled ride so the MPGs look yummy but get the enthusiasts running amuck for moar power! For the laymen, a stock car is beast enough. As far as the MPPK is concerned, it's almost as easy as dealerships turning it on (despite all the long programming hoopla to phone home and allow the process to be logged, and what not, just to make you wait and feel that it's substantial). Ultimately it nothing more that the OP stated IMHO...SUBTLE.

It's a business after all.

[daberlin]

Originally Posted by Blubaron79

$16,000!?!?!?!

Yup. The CF airbox alone is over $3000. Unfortunately, the cost to increase HP in a 911 is no cheap undertaking in any form. As for upgrading a 997, I chose to skip the tuning on a 997.1 and buy the 997.2 - 385 BHP, 4 more than the X51 tuned 997.1. Also roughly $10K difference between the 997.2 Base Carrera at 345 BHP and the 385 BHP Carrera S.

[daberlin]

Originally Posted by rickinaz

Here it is on sale for $13,400, but you still have to pay for installation. And...I stand corrected, 0-60 improves by .2 second. Read the review on the adjacent tab at the website.

http://www.suncoastparts.com/product/9971X51.html

the 997.2 X51 is cheaper.

http://www.suncoastparts.com/product...Code=997238per

408 BHP. $13K for an extra 23 BHP. Makes my 42 BHP jump in the F30 335i for $5K seem like quite a deal.

[Number 6]

Originally Posted by TreDirtyFive

Finally, someone who shares my sentiment, objectively, about the MPPK's on the N55. I've sampled it all...M235i, 435i, 335i, early N55's in my 135, oem, MPPK variants, tuned, FBO, you name it. And I've have beaten on most of them on the track. No armchair magazine spec. racing here. This is fact that the power increase is nominal, at best, and the inclusion of the open intake tray for that slightly louder induction sound and more overrun burbles are part of the psychological/emotional sensation that you are paying for. Not to mention all the stickers that give you that mental edge you are really close to real M territory (NOT).

Don't get me wrong, there is definitely a change...and I wouldn't simply call it negligible but I wouldn't call it dramatic either. The bmw fanboys (especially the newcomers) are losing their pants over it as if they are making over 450hp and going out there lining up with AMGs because the blatantly visible M Performance stickers and over boosted throttle tip-in gives them the gusto to go for the gold. Also, the BMW supported MPPK Dinan dynos are a sham if you ask me. Just MHO.

Most of this is simply business strategy by using the heritage of the M branding to get you to pay more for features that are already built into the car from the get go. I'm sure the car can easily accommodate these horsepower figures out of the box. But why give it to you when you can pay for it and feel like a superstar? The promise of better fuel economy equals a sloppy and lazy throttled ride so the MPGs look yummy but get the enthusiasts running amuck for moar power! For the laymen, a stock car is beast enough. As far as the MPPK is concerned, it's almost as easy as dealerships turning it on (despite all the long programming hoopla to phone home and allow the process to be logged, and what not, just to make you wait and feel that it's substantial). Ultimately it nothing more that the OP stated IMHO...SUBTLE.

It's a business after all.

So, would you say it's comparable to getting the 335is.
MPPK = 335is?

[BMHunden]

I'm not sure if there's any point to voicing my disagreement with the OP.

My experience is different. The MPPK really did make a very noticeable difference. Maybe there is a difference between the 435i and the 335i??? Is there anyone on this forum with the kit installed in a 435i who feels that it has made no difference to the way in which the car performs???

The only way to "objectively" quantify the difference made by the MPPK would be to do a before and after dyno, on the same car, on the same dyno, and on the same day. (Even then, the "break in" period supposedly required by the MPPK would serve as a point of contention - although I felt the difference immediately so I do not believe that any such period is in fact required). No one has done such a test, so I'm getting to the point where I feel that the expression of an opinion either way has very little value.

What I can say is that before pulling the trigger and purchasing the MPPK I hunted for posts in which drivers had expressed the opinion that the MPPK didn't make any difference. I thought that by doing so I could relieve myself of the burning desire to get it. Thankfully I didn't base my decision on these opinions as I was not willing to believe that BMW would basically defraud its customer base by falsely advertising the kit on the basis of the minimum power and torque gains that it is said to provide.

[ipilcher]

A question for the folks who feel a definite difference with the MPPK ...

How aggressively do you drive, and where (what RPM range) do you feel the difference?

[Gio72]

Again: 2" less on 100/200kmh (tested on the SAME conditions) isn't enough to consider the MPPK a valid improvement of N55 performance???
On my old E91 335xi I installed the first PK (+20hp) and the differences were soft. With the 435i the 35hp added by MPPK are imho remarkable.
I confirm my satisfation

[Gio72]

Originally Posted by ipilcher

A question for the folks who feel a definite difference with the MPPK ...

How aggressively do you drive, and where (what RPM range) do you feel the difference?

At every range.
At law revs, but more at high revs.
By the way, these are the official power&torque chart:

As you can see, the curve of the MPPK gains power and torque everywhere

[TractionControlOff]

Thanks for posting that chart Gio72! Impressive.

[falar]

Originally Posted by Gio72

At every range.
At law revs, but more at high revs.
By the way, these are the official power&torque chart:

As you can see, the curve of the MPPK gains power and torque everywhere

Nice graph, thanks for posting. Love the comparison to see the "meat" of the difference.

Interesting to try and read the Italian part as well, with a decent SPanish and Latin background I find it almost readable with no knowledge of Italian.

[Gio72]

Originally Posted by falar

Nice graph, thanks for posting. Love the comparison to see the "meat" of the difference.

Interesting to try and read the Italian part as well, with a decent SPanish and Latin background I find it almost readable with no knowledge of Italian.

Oh never mind: they say no interesting things! For BMW:
- MPPK has a great advantage over third parties tuning: the sport displays!!! I would have lost my sleep without them
- According to their technicians, it's impossible to gain more power than 250kw (335hp/340ps) without changing turbo and airbox... Ah ah ah! They used to say the same with the old MPPK 320hp

I will post another official page in italian and I will translate for you the main parts

[Gio72]

Anyway, pay attention: those graphs are of the EU 435i, with our fuel that is more rich of octanes, as far as I know.
So I don't know if there are the same profile for US versions.
For example, in the other official page I mentioned before, BMW states 250kw maximum power "flat" between 5.800rpm and 6.500rpm and that's the reason why my N55 pull very hard till 6800/7000rpm, almost like an aspired sport engine (you can see also from my youtube video)!
However, in another thread, some of you argue that it is not worth to pull after 6000, that for me sounds absurd, because my N55 has a great breath at high revs!

PS recently, I went on track (Adria International Raceway) with my 435i and I enjoyed so much! Infinite engine, fantastic step8m (both upshit and downshit!), excellent M brakes (both powerful and resistance... I stressed them a lot!) and good suspension setup (even if too much roll). If you're interested, a friend of mine (with E92 335i tuned at 380hp) posted a video on youtube...

[TractionControlOff]

Originally Posted by Gio72

Anyway, pay attention: those graphs are of the EU 435i, with our fuel that is more rich of octanes, as far as I know.
So I don't know if there are the same profile for US versions.
For example, in the other official page I mentioned before, BMW states 250kw maximum power "flat" between 5.800rpm and 6.500rpm and that's the reason why my N55 pull very hard till 6800/7000rpm, almost like an aspired sport engine (you can see also from my youtube video)!
However, in another thread, some of you argue that it is not worth to pull after 6000, that for me sounds absurd, because my N55 has a great breath at high revs!

PS recently, I went on track (Adria International Raceway) with my 435i and I enjoyed so much! Infinite engine, fantastic step8m (both upshit and downshit!), excellent M brakes (both powerful and resistance... I stressed them a lot!) and good suspension setup (even if too much roll). If you're interested, a friend of mine (with E92 335i tuned at 380hp) posted a video on youtube...

I would like to see the video. Please post.

[Gio72]

Originally Posted by TractionControlOff

I would like to see the video. Please post.

Sure!
Go to the minute 15'30".
I made some mistakes for too late brakings, because I wanted to push too much when I saw my friend in the mirror
Always drove in DSC Off mode, of course.
Anyway it was the first time on track with my 435i and I'm quite satisfied, for the laptime too.
My friend with the cameracar drives an E92 335i V5 (370/380cv), step, IC Wagner, DPS free, M3 roll-bars, K&N Filter, coolcarbon+EBC brakes.

PS don't care about the sound: I don't know why, but it is not synchronized with the video...

[TractionControlOff]

Originally Posted by Gio72

Sure!
Go to the minute 15'30".
I made some mistakes for too late brakings, because I wanted to push too much when I saw my friend in the mirror
Always drove in DSC Off mode, of course.
Anyway it was the first time on track with my 435i and I'm quite satisfied, for the laptime too.
My friend with the cameracar drives an E92 335i V5 (370/380cv), step, IC Wagner, DPS free, M3 roll-bars, K&N Filter, coolcarbon+EBC brakes.

PS don't care about the sound: I don't know why, but it is not synchronized with the video...

Nice video - must have been lots of fun! Italy is my favorite place on Earth. I can only imagine all of the epic drives you can take there. On my first visit we went to a restaurant near Aosta in Cogne. I'm pretty sure it's the building on the left in the picture ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Comune_di_Cogne.jpg ) In this picturesque setting there were 20+ Ferrari's parked out front and after about 15 minutes of our arriving they all sped off on the mountain roads! It was awesome to see!
Sorry to get off topic, but I thought you might appreciate...

[Gio72]

Originally Posted by TractionControlOff

Nice video - must have been lots of fun! Italy is my favorite place on Earth. I can only imagine all of the epic drives you can take there. On my first visit we went to a restaurant near Aosta in Cogne. I'm pretty sure it's the building on the left in the picture ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Comune_di_Cogne.jpg ) In this picturesque setting there were 20+ Ferrari's parked out front and after about 15 minutes of our arriving they all sped off on the mountain roads! It was awesome to see!
Sorry to get off topic, but I thought you might appreciate...

Yes, I appreciate!
I enjoyed a lot driving on track, even if it was the first time with my 435i!
I love mountain roads and my mountains are the Dolomites, on the Northern-East, just two hours by driving from Venice.
Cortina and Alta Badia are fantastic places to sky in winter, to walk, climb, biking in summer, and very nice to drive in every seasons
Sorry for going on with OT