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      04-14-2015, 01:46 PM   #1
marine0369
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MS-8 install

So after what has seemed like hours upon hours for about 7 months now and some inbox questions for Technic (thanks for your patience!!), I decided to do the JBL MS-8 install. I know this topic has been beat up worse than a $5 hooker, but I thought I would just take a moment and give my impressions of this unit. I purchased a lightly used MS-8 on Ebay for $325 (not a bad price, I have been watching what they can go for on there for awhile.)
Back in late 2012 when I first bought my car (2012 328i Sport w/ HiFi), I knew almost immediately that I at the very least needed a undersea sub upgrade, so after some research (and finding this site) I decided on the Earthquake under seat upgrade with stand alone amp. I purchased a Technic "add a sub and amp" PnP harness and a lightly used Alpine PDX 2.150. The difference was night and day with the better low end. I stayed wit that for a couple of years before I gave into mu urges to upgrade more. I then purchased an Alpine PDX 5 and another Technic harness (factory amp replacement harness) and installed that. I tinkered with the amp settings for two weeks and I was just not pleased with how it sounded. I personally thought it sounded better with factory main amp and just the sub upgrades. So I re installed factory amp and the Alpine 2.150 until I decided on my next option. I then bought the BSW Stage 1 upgrade and sound was much improved. But I was still hungry for more. I then installed a stand alone sub in the trunk. I had a custom made fiberglass box built for the right side cubby (battery side) and bought a Jl Audio JX500 and a JL Audio 10w3v3. Sound was wonderful wit REAL lower end. But after awhile, i felt as if the rest of the system was not able to keep up with the sub, so I went back to the drawing board for more power/ sound for the BSWs . I went back and forth whether to get the xd600/6, MS-8, or the Helix Match. Again after a TON of research on the MS-8 through the countless pages in the numerous forums, I pulled the trigger and took a chance with the MS-8. I used the Technic PnP "factory amp replacement harness to install the MS-8. I used the front set of RCAs of the harness as the input to ms-8 and use the MS-8 speaker level outputs to the harness inputs for sound. The MS-8 is powering all the BSWs while I used the MS-8 RCA out puts for my sub amp and the under seat subs, which are now used exclusively for mid bass. Install was pretty straight forward in my opinion. I thought it would be a little more complicated due to some of the posts I have read, but I had 0 issues and was no more difficult than installing an amplifier. So I went through the calibration process after reading up on it. Sound wasn't terrible first go, but it wasn't to my total satisfaction. SO back to the MS-8 threads for more research. I just have calibrated and re-calibrated 20 times or so, using different settings trying to dial it in just right, ESPECIALLY in the mid bass department which is what was lacking the most. Well as of 2 days ago, I think I have dated it in just right and it absolutely sounds amazing. You really had no idea what I was missing, until you do lol. Ill be honest as well, I am quite surprised in the clarity and the high volumes this thing can now play clear and clean as a bell. I was worried about only using the internal amp within the MS-8, but it has more than impressed me, especially with the BSW stage 1 upgrade. For now, I feel pretty content with how things are wit this stereo and will probably leave it how it is. Im not sure how much "better" it could get by using MORE power for the BSWs as this is pretty damn loud n clear as is. Maybe somebody out there that has the MS-8, and BSWs amped can comment on with or without? So, if you are on the fence about the MS-8 as I was, don't be, it is COMPLETELY worth it!! Anyways, there is my 2 cents in a nutshell, hope my nammerin' on was helpful to some!
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      04-14-2015, 03:51 PM   #2
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I agree. Love my MS-8 as well. Mine is powering the subs as well. Mind sharing your settings here or in pm? I have Bavsound as well and never got around to tweaking the settings since the speaker installs.
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      04-14-2015, 10:13 PM   #3
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I upgraded my standard HiFi system in this order, with the observations after each upgrade:

1) Bavsound S-1 speakers - overall much better clarity and detail, but lacked punch. Audio would start distorting/clipping around 75% max volume (bass a little earlier). I listen to a lot of EDM, trance, and like it at high volumes, at least 50%-75% max. SQ was better, but i felt like the BSWs were capable of so much more.

2) JL Audio XD800v2/8 + JBL MS-8 - purchased together used, but there was a broken mic on the MS-8, so wasn't sure if this affected the calibration sweeps or that i just didn't know what the hell i was doing. After the first calibration sweep, it sounded horrible, like AM radio, but i chalked that up to not knowing how to configure it. But the MS-8 was under amazon warranty, so i returned both the mic and the MS-8 unit. During that time, i only had the XD800, so i had a solid week to listen to the BSWs + XD800 by themselves.

3) JL Audio XD800v2/8 only - wow, everything came alive. With 75W RMS through all the speakers, i felt like i was hearing the BSW's like they were intended to be powered. Soundstage, clarity, and detail were all there, but with the extra boost, the music was immersive, almost hypnotic. Bass was clean, deep and tight, like a heartbeat, even close to 90% max volume, which was creeping into headache inducing territory. After a week of experiencing amazing audio, a brand new MS-8 arrived with a new headset/mic.

4) JL Audio XD800v2/8 + JBL MS-8 - I don't know if it was just overkill or what, but while i was able to get the MS-8 (using it only as a DSP) in the mix fine, the increase in SQ was only marginal. The XD800+BSWs were pretty close to perfection in my opinion, and the constant MS-8 calibration sweeps (i prob did close to 100) trying to get that extra 10%-20% out started to wear me out. It can get pretty addictive. And it did. I was working with Kaigoss on getting better improvements, and started doing RTA's, downloading and messing with test signals, doing polarity checks on each speaker, and pretty soon it just became all consuming. What started as a little side hobby turned into an obsession for about two weeks. I was after the elusive holy grail of perfect frequency response. One day, i just realized i was spending more time chasing a unicorn rather than enjoying the pure-bred i already owned. I was planning to just leave it be, and when i started to button up the trunk one day, i discovered that both the XD800+MS-8 couldn't fit in that area of the trunk where the OEM amp was. That's when i decided i was going to take it out just enjoy the BSW + XD800.

I plan on keeping the MS-8 for now until i decide to upgrade the underseats and add a trunk sub, but until then, i still have a brand new MS-8 with the protective film still on the unit sitting in my office. Btw... the little display cracked when the unit was on the way back, and so i got a new one of those too - so I purchased a used unit, and I ended up getting brand new everything.

The reason i wrote all that in that order was that if i had not gotten the XD800 at the same time as the MS-8, or if i had gotten just the MS-8 by itself, i probably would have LOVED it with my BSWs. The DSP time-correction algorithm along with auto-calibration, and the 31-band EQ are top-notch, and while i loved it the time i had it installed, i unfortunately was jaded by listening to how the XD800 performed on its own.

I never did listen to just the MS-8 with the BSWs, but since i like to listen to my music loud, and with some oomph, the 15-20w RMS it outputs probably would not do it for me in the long run.

Still, i think its a great unit and while there have been a lot of naysayers about this product, i think JBL got to the point where they got past all the earlier issues of initial production boards - e.g. broken display connectors, jet airplane issue, BT echo, etc...

My experience with the MS-8 was top notch and i would not hesitate to recommend it to anyone, as long as its not one of the early production units.
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      04-15-2015, 10:45 AM   #4
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My settings I have right now are as follows (mind you I am running two separate amplifiers for a stand alone subwoofer and SWS-8's under seats)

Channel 1,2- FL & FR(H)/2 way/ Front Lo/Hi Xover 160Hz/slope 24db
Channel 3- SL/ One way/ Xover 160Hz
Channel 4- SR/ Same as center
Channel 5- C/ same as center
Channel 6,7- FL & FR Low (under seat) Xover settings at the amplifier/ gain 50%/low pass set to approximately 220Hz (This seems to work pretty well with how the MS-8 crosses over these speakers; I can actually here mid bass now and sound in sync with the BSW. Prior to this setting, I had the amp crossover set to hi pass and crossed over at 80Hz and I could barely hear them at all and it didn't sound right over all.

Channel 8- Sub- 1- subsonic filter 20 Hz/ Slope 12db/ Sub/Front Slope 12db/ amplifier crossed over at 80Hz/ sub amplifier crossed over at 80Hz

Calibration Volume set at 25, regular listening volume 5

These settings as of right now sound the best to me. Not sure how it will sound for you with running the stock subs with MS-8 internal amp.
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      04-15-2015, 11:26 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squidlyboy View Post
I upgraded my standard HiFi system in this order, with the observations after each upgrade:

1) Bavsound S-1 speakers - overall much better clarity and detail, but lacked punch. Audio would start distorting/clipping around 75% max volume (bass a little earlier). I listen to a lot of EDM, trance, and like it at high volumes, at least 50%-75% max. SQ was better, but i felt like the BSWs were capable of so much more.

2) JL Audio XD800v2/8 + JBL MS-8 - purchased together used, but there was a broken mic on the MS-8, so wasn't sure if this affected the calibration sweeps or that i just didn't know what the hell i was doing. After the first calibration sweep, it sounded horrible, like AM radio, but i chalked that up to not knowing how to configure it. But the MS-8 was under amazon warranty, so i returned both the mic and the MS-8 unit. During that time, i only had the XD800, so i had a solid week to listen to the BSWs + XD800 by themselves.

3) JL Audio XD800v2/8 only - wow, everything came alive. With 75W RMS through all the speakers, i felt like i was hearing the BSW's like they were intended to be powered. Soundstage, clarity, and detail were all there, but with the extra boost, the music was immersive, almost hypnotic. Bass was clean, deep and tight, like a heartbeat, even close to 90% max volume, which was creeping into headache inducing territory. After a week of experiencing amazing audio, a brand new MS-8 arrived with a new headset/mic.

4) JL Audio XD800v2/8 + JBL MS-8 - I don't know if it was just overkill or what, but while i was able to get the MS-8 (using it only as a DSP) in the mix fine, the increase in SQ was only marginal. The XD800+BSWs were pretty close to perfection in my opinion, and the constant MS-8 calibration sweeps (i prob did close to 100) trying to get that extra 10%-20% out started to wear me out. It can get pretty addictive. And it did. I was working with Kaigoss on getting better improvements, and started doing RTA's, downloading and messing with test signals, doing polarity checks on each speaker, and pretty soon it just became all consuming. What started as a little side hobby turned into an obsession for about two weeks. I was after the elusive holy grail of perfect frequency response. One day, i just realized i was spending more time chasing a unicorn rather than enjoying the pure-bred i already owned. I was planning to just leave it be, and when i started to button up the trunk one day, i discovered that both the XD800+MS-8 couldn't fit in that area of the trunk where the OEM amp was. That's when i decided i was going to take it out just enjoy the BSW + XD800.

I plan on keeping the MS-8 for now until i decide to upgrade the underseats and add a trunk sub, but until then, i still have a brand new MS-8 with the protective film still on the unit sitting in my office. Btw... the little display cracked when the unit was on the way back, and so i got a new one of those too - so I purchased a used unit, and I ended up getting brand new everything.

The reason i wrote all that in that order was that if i had not gotten the XD800 at the same time as the MS-8, or if i had gotten just the MS-8 by itself, i probably would have LOVED it with my BSWs. The DSP time-correction algorithm along with auto-calibration, and the 31-band EQ are top-notch, and while i loved it the time i had it installed, i unfortunately was jaded by listening to how the XD800 performed on its own.

I never did listen to just the MS-8 with the BSWs, but since i like to listen to my music loud, and with some oomph, the 15-20w RMS it outputs probably would not do it for me in the long run.

Still, i think its a great unit and while there have been a lot of naysayers about this product, i think JBL got to the point where they got past all the earlier issues of initial production boards - e.g. broken display connectors, jet airplane issue, BT echo, etc...

My experience with the MS-8 was top notch and i would not hesitate to recommend it to anyone, as long as its not one of the early production units.
Thats interesting, I wonder why it wouldn't sound as good or better paired with the xd800/8? I agree with you, they're were quite a few posts about negative experiences with the MS-8. So far I have not encountered any of them, including the Blue tooth echo ( I called several people specifically to ask if they heard and echo on their end). I also can see how it can become a bit of an obsession (searching for the perfect sound) and never being satisfied but I am glad I chose the MS-8 as I believe this unit is probably the easiest to tune compared to other types of DSP's
I was able to use the factory amp location for the MS-8, as I used the trunk floor compartment for the subwoofer amplifiers, so the stock location was available for the MS-8 (photo)
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Last edited by marine0369; 04-15-2015 at 11:31 AM..
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      04-15-2015, 12:01 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marine0369 View Post
Thats interesting, I wonder why it wouldn't sound as good or better paired with the xd800/8? ...
I was able to use the factory amp location for the MS-8, as I used the trunk floor compartment for the subwoofer amplifiers, so the stock location was available for the MS-8 (photo)
Its kinda like buying a special Carnuba wax then applying it to your brand spankin' new car with a mint paint job thinking its going to make it look WAY better than it already does.

I just feel that the xd800/8 and BSWs is pretty close to perfection as it is. Maybe i just got lucky? I dunno... the MS-8 did add certain qualities that enhanced the sound, it wasn't a blow-me-away night and day difference, and that was after a lot of fiddling and a ton of calibration sweeps. But it wasn't a $350 difference

However, i'm confident that if i just had the MS-8 alone, it would BLOW away the OEM HiFi amp and there would be a night and day difference. If i had that scenario the MS-8 would definitely not be sitting in my house right now.

I know i could have mounted the MS-8 in the dual cubby hole area like you did, but i was already on the fence about keeping it in the car, and i didn't feel like doing any cutting/drilling. I'm trying to keep the car as OEM as possible and be able to return it to full "factory" so no one can tell the difference.

Very nice set up btw... very OEM... very MINT - super clean - you did a great job@!!

Last edited by squidlyboy; 04-15-2015 at 09:57 PM..
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      04-15-2015, 01:54 PM   #7
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If I were you. I would follow the e90 forum to get your MS8 setup.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...394375&page=36

I have recommended this to squidlyboy.

kaigoss69 in that thread is very helpful and If you read all that till the end, you will get a good understanding of MS8 and its limitations. However I think MS8 is a very good choice, if you want to keep it simple and get good improvement of your overall sound quality.

Give it a shot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by marine0369 View Post
So after what has seemed like hours upon hours for about 7 months now and some inbox questions for Technic (thanks for your patience!!), I decided to do the JBL MS-8 install. I know this topic has been beat up worse than a $5 hooker, but I thought I would just take a moment and give my impressions of this unit. I purchased a lightly used MS-8 on Ebay for $325 (not a bad price, I have been watching what they can go for on there for awhile.)
Back in late 2012 when I first bought my car (2012 328i Sport w/ HiFi), I knew almost immediately that I at the very least needed a undersea sub upgrade, so after some research (and finding this site) I decided on the Earthquake under seat upgrade with stand alone amp. I purchased a Technic "add a sub and amp" PnP harness and a lightly used Alpine PDX 2.150. The difference was night and day with the better low end. I stayed wit that for a couple of years before I gave into mu urges to upgrade more. I then purchased an Alpine PDX 5 and another Technic harness (factory amp replacement harness) and installed that. I tinkered with the amp settings for two weeks and I was just not pleased with how it sounded. I personally thought it sounded better with factory main amp and just the sub upgrades. So I re installed factory amp and the Alpine 2.150 until I decided on my next option. I then bought the BSW Stage 1 upgrade and sound was much improved. But I was still hungry for more. I then installed a stand alone sub in the trunk. I had a custom made fiberglass box built for the right side cubby (battery side) and bought a Jl Audio JX500 and a JL Audio 10w3v3. Sound was wonderful wit REAL lower end. But after awhile, i felt as if the rest of the system was not able to keep up with the sub, so I went back to the drawing board for more power/ sound for the BSWs . I went back and forth whether to get the xd600/6, MS-8, or the Helix Match. Again after a TON of research on the MS-8 through the countless pages in the numerous forums, I pulled the trigger and took a chance with the MS-8. I used the Technic PnP "factory amp replacement harness to install the MS-8. I used the front set of RCAs of the harness as the input to ms-8 and use the MS-8 speaker level outputs to the harness inputs for sound. The MS-8 is powering all the BSWs while I used the MS-8 RCA out puts for my sub amp and the under seat subs, which are now used exclusively for mid bass. Install was pretty straight forward in my opinion. I thought it would be a little more complicated due to some of the posts I have read, but I had 0 issues and was no more difficult than installing an amplifier. So I went through the calibration process after reading up on it. Sound wasn't terrible first go, but it wasn't to my total satisfaction. SO back to the MS-8 threads for more research. I just have calibrated and re-calibrated 20 times or so, using different settings trying to dial it in just right, ESPECIALLY in the mid bass department which is what was lacking the most. Well as of 2 days ago, I think I have dated it in just right and it absolutely sounds amazing. You really had no idea what I was missing, until you do lol. Ill be honest as well, I am quite surprised in the clarity and the high volumes this thing can now play clear and clean as a bell. I was worried about only using the internal amp within the MS-8, but it has more than impressed me, especially with the BSW stage 1 upgrade. For now, I feel pretty content with how things are wit this stereo and will probably leave it how it is. Im not sure how much "better" it could get by using MORE power for the BSWs as this is pretty damn loud n clear as is. Maybe somebody out there that has the MS-8, and BSWs amped can comment on with or without? So, if you are on the fence about the MS-8 as I was, don't be, it is COMPLETELY worth it!! Anyways, there is my 2 cents in a nutshell, hope my nammerin' on was helpful to some!
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      04-15-2015, 02:00 PM   #8
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I was wondering....is it possible to disable the center channel in the MS-8 setup? i.e. input that there's nothing connected (even though it really is)?

I'd like to see how I like the staging without the center. As some have said, it tends to squeeze the separation of the front speakers too much. I know a bunch of people don't bother connecting it.
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      04-15-2015, 09:50 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vithy View Post
If I were you. I would follow the e90 forum to get your MS8 setup.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...394375&page=36

I have recommended this to squidlyboy.
vithy is the MAN I still owe you a beer bro... whenever you are in Phoenix ...
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      04-15-2015, 09:53 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fronzdan View Post
I was wondering....is it possible to disable the center channel in the MS-8 setup? i.e. input that there's nothing connected (even though it really is)?

I'd like to see how I like the staging without the center. As some have said, it tends to squeeze the separation of the front speakers too much. I know a bunch of people don't bother connecting it.
Yes programatically, for sure. I did it with center, and i did it without center. To be honest, i really didn't notice a HUGE difference. At the end, i left it back in. I prob don't have quite the golden ears most people have here...
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      04-16-2015, 12:22 PM   #11
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My entire stereo can be taken out and converted back to stock. I did make a small incision in the cubby compartment just to allow the cabling in, but you can't even tell it's there when the cabling is not running through because of the yup of plastic material used. For me it was the best option, as I didn't want anything showing in the trunk (amps mounted to seat backs) except the subwoofer which flows with the interior rather nicely because of the fiberglass box. Either way, if you are happy with just the 800/8, more power to Ya, it's your car, and your ears, have it the way you like it
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      04-20-2015, 02:54 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squidlyboy View Post
Its kinda like buying a special Carnuba wax then applying it to your brand spankin' new car with a mint paint job thinking its going to make it look WAY better than it already does.

I just feel that the xd800/8 and BSWs is pretty close to perfection as it is. Maybe i just got lucky? I dunno... the MS-8 did add certain qualities that enhanced the sound, it wasn't a blow-me-away night and day difference, and that was after a lot of fiddling and a ton of calibration sweeps. But it wasn't a $350 difference

However, i'm confident that if i just had the MS-8 alone, it would BLOW away the OEM HiFi amp and there would be a night and day difference. If i had that scenario the MS-8 would definitely not be sitting in my house right now.

I know i could have mounted the MS-8 in the dual cubby hole area like you did, but i was already on the fence about keeping it in the car, and i didn't feel like doing any cutting/drilling. I'm trying to keep the car as OEM as possible and be able to return it to full "factory" so no one can tell the difference.

Very nice set up btw... very OEM... very MINT - super clean - you did a great job@!!
Thanks for the compliment! A clean install has always been important to me; nothing worse than a car full of amps and cables all over the place, I am super OCD about that kinda stuff!
On that note, AS content with the sound I am getting from just the MS-8, I found a great deal on a JL xd700/5 (JL remanufactured, $325 shipped) and I couldn't pass it up!!! So it should be here in about 4 days. I am going to replace my Alpine amp powering the understates with this and run front and rear BAVs with it as well and keep the center on the MS-8. Hopefully I don't have the same problem as you did when you ran the d800/8 with the MS-8!!! Anyways, I am DONE after this (or so I say that now) lol
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      04-20-2015, 03:27 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marine0369 View Post
I found a great deal on a JL xd700/5 (JL remanufactured, $325 shipped) and I couldn't pass it up!!! So it should be here in about 4 days. I am going to replace my Alpine amp powering the understates with this and run front and rear BAVs with it as well and keep the center on the MS-8. Hopefully I don't have the same problem as you did when you ran the d800/8 with the MS-8!!! Anyways, I am DONE after this (or so I say that now) lol
Nice! Keep us posted on your impressions of the new configuration once everything is installed and dialed in. I for one would love it if i found out i missed something with the ms-8 and there is a golden configuration out there somewhere.
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      04-20-2015, 03:29 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squidlyboy View Post
Nice! Keep us posted on your impressions of the new configuration once everything is installed and dialed in. I for one would love it if i found out i missed something with the ms-8 and there is a golden configuration out there somewhere.
I sure will, Thanks man
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      04-22-2015, 04:55 PM   #15
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Why have your amp's crossovers involved with the underseats at all? The MS8 is taking care of it. You have them low passed at a frequency higher than MS8 is feeding them. I would recommend disabling your amps crossovers.
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      04-22-2020, 10:38 AM   #16
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Apologies all for the bump after 5 years but I am wanting to install a MS8 in my wife’s 220d that has HK speakers but I believe from wiring it is same as Hifi.

I was hoping something like a technik harness would just feed the ms8 instead of the oem amp from source and use existing wiring to speakers.

Years ago I had a proper install with Denon amps, Morel speakers, chord company speaker cables etc in my mini and was hoping it would be more plug and play so could do myself in the beemer.

Plan is to use morel hybrid 4 in doors, cwr254 in Center and some scanspeak in rear. Also have AD W800neo for underseat use.

Also with a Center I guess I need to run door tweeters and mid as 1 channel rather than 2 with ms8 limited to 8 channels? Unless underseat pair can be ran as 1 channel?
Appreciate 0
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