[newoldbeemer]

... as crazy as that sounds but yeah I think I do!

A bit of background: So it's been several months since I moved away from my N54 e90 to the N20 F30.

When I first got the f30, I was super annoyed at myself for getting the base suspension with its body roll. It annoyed me every time I drove the car. I also felt like the steering feel of the e90 was gone, but I didn't mind that very much since it's just a different feel and still has more feel than most other cars.

For the suspension I went for an MPS upgrade and the car feels very good to drive now.

Today out of curiosity I asked to drive my friend's e90 (2006 325i) that I've driven before a few times and remember being very impressed with. That car has sports package, lowered suspension and nice wheels and tyres, I remember being as impressed with that as I was with my n54. To add, that car is non-active-steering and has a very exciting raw feel to it.

So today I asked to drive it for a short while, just out of curiosity to see how much it makes me hate the f30 and also see if that steering feel makes me yearn for it again.

The answer is.. Yes and no. I mean at lower speeds especially parking speeds that heavy steering does feel good and I've missed it a bit, but once on the freeway, exits and on-ramps - am I crazy for saying this?- my f30 steering actually feels better! At least, they are very close.

Later in the evening I did a small drive in my car in sports mode and it gave me a smile.

I think I've finally move on from the e90. I still LOVE it, but I no longer feel like the f30 is inferior in any way. I feel like the f30 is a true evolution from the car I drove today.

[frenchfries]

need more feels

[philbake]

Agree. Came from an '08 E90/N54. The car grows on you and those items you mention fade. I've got 6k now on my '13 F30 328ix, and I swear, the exhaust rumble seems more noticeable now too!

[Theride]

umm. are you trying to convince yourself that the f30 is actually better?ummm

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Theride

umm. are you trying to convince yourself that the f30 is actually better?ummm

....It is.....and I've owned 3 E9X cars (..with 2 of them being M3's, but obviously I'm not referring to those). I would not take my '06 330i over my '14 F30 335i.

[btbossman]

The f30 is hands down a much better car than e90....for sure with mps, but definately with dhp as well!

[QTC]

The steering in the E90 is better, but at slow speeds (at least on my mom's 328xi), its way too heavy (almost feels unassisted). The F30 needs more feel (feedback), so there's definitely a happy medium somewhere. Honestly, electric steering racks are still pretty new - I'm sure, as time passes, they'll get better.

[newoldbeemer]

Originally Posted by Theride

umm. are you trying to convince yourself that the f30 is actually better?ummm

Hmm no, the exact opposite. I was actually convinced the e90 feels way better (see my posts on other threads stating that the f30 has only 50% of the feel that e90 has). A short drive yesterday convinced me that's all subjective and steering heaviness isn't everything. I was actually surprised, because I had a chance to drive this same e90 a few days after I'd got delivery of my car, and I distinctly remember feeling like its night and day. Now that difference is gone. Maybe it's a question of getting used to it? I don't know.

At what speed does the steering become non-assisted in both cars? That might have something to do with it.

(Of course, I'm talking about sport mode in the f30. I never drive in comfort mode these days).

[shivaswrath]

steering feedback is so personal, it's like boob preference for men.

I like the lighter steering in a parking lot, and like the heavy steering on the freeway/track. the f30 gives me this....

[turbolag]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

....It is.....and I've owned 3 E9X cars (..with 2 of them being M3's, but obviously I'm not referring to those). I would not take my '06 330i over my '14 F30 335i.

Sorry to break it to you but the E9x M3 > F30.

But then M models > BMW models.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by turbolag

Sorry to break it to you but the E9x M3 > F30.

But then M models > BMW models.

Your comprehension is off this morning eh? I said that in parentheses, and I specified which E9X I was referring to.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by shivaswrath

steering feedback is so personal, it's like boob preference for men.

I like the lighter steering in a parking lot, and like the heavy steering on the freeway/track. the f30 gives me this....

Agreed......and F30 steering in Sport and Sport+ is weighted perfectly. Comfort is great for what it is too.

[TonyS]

Originally Posted by btbossman

The f30 is hands down a much better car than e90....for sure with mps, but definately with dhp as well!

Not to mention the looks. The E90 always was a fat, dumpy, ugly thing, and was the main reason I kept my E46 for so long. No matter how I tried (and believe me I really wanted to), I couldn't see it as anything else.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by TonyS

Not to mention the looks. The E90 always was a fat, dumpy, ugly thing, and was the main reason I kept my E46 for so long. No matter how I tried (and believe me I really wanted to), I couldn't see it as anything else.

Interestingly our eyes adjust to some things. I think the F30 with the M-Sport bumper is one of the nicest looking semi-aggressive front ends on the market. It took awhile for me to get used to, but the design has a visual impact, especially with the right stance (..wheels, drop, etc.). I remember the first time I saw a modified F30 in my rearview mirror as it crept up behind my M3 while heading west on the 10 freeway. It was definitely an attention grabber.

[nicknaz]

Another way to get a reminder of the E90 steering is to try the 135 or 135is or X1 xdrive, which still retain that system.

I had a 135is loaner recently and the low speed heft was certainly different from F30 335 but I didn't think the accuracy or feedback level is different.

We should also keep in mind is that I believe there was an F30 steering rack change after Nov 12 production.

From my point of view, I am not missing my E90 sport package either, but "feel" is so personal, and others might have an earlier production F30 so I can see where all the different points of view are coming from

(the worst case for F30 perception I think is a sport package E9X owner getting a pre-Nove 2012 no-line 328 or 320 as a loaner and making a judgement based on that)

[btbossman]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Interestingly our eyes adjust to some things. I think the F30 with the M-Sport bumper is one of the nicest looking semi-aggressive front ends on the market. It took awhile for me to get used to, but the design has a visual impact, especially with the right stance (..wheels, drop, etc.). I remember the first time I saw a modified F30 in my rearview mirror as it crept up behind my M3 while heading west on the 10 freeway. It was definitely an attention grabber.

You have a picture perfect f30 for sure! But I agree, I hated the new 3, until I saw an m-sport, ironically the day I got my f30 lol, I just couldn't turn it down!

[turbolag]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Your comprehension is off this morning eh? I said that in parentheses, and I specified which E9X I was referring to.

Ah shit I didn't read the not. Sorry.

[newoldbeemer]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

Another way to get a reminder of the E90 steering is to try the 135 or 135is or X1 xdrive, which still retain that system.

I had a 135is loaner recently and the low speed heft was certainly different from F30 335 but I didn't think the accuracy or feedback level is different.

We should also keep in mind is that I believe there was an F30 steering rack change after Nov 12 production.

From my point of view, I am not missing my E90 sport package either, but "feel" is so personal, and others might have an earlier production F30 so I can see where all the different points of view are coming from

(the worst case for F30 perception I think is a sport package E9X owner getting a pre-Nove 2012 no-line 328 or 320 as a loaner and making a judgement based on that)

Totally agree. But when I drove the x1, I felt like that steering was wasted on a car that handled more like an SUV (a sudden swerve to avoid a pothole instantly reminded me).

[snowghost]

Originally Posted by turbolag

Sorry to break it to you but the E9x M3 > F30.

But then M models > BMW models.

Disagree. Maybe same series/years, but time marches on. In many ways my F30 is superior to my old E46 M3.

The VANOS blew up on my hand-built S54 engine with just 41k miles. How's that for superior.

[turbolag]

Originally Posted by snowghost

Disagree. Maybe same series/years, but time marches on. In many ways my F30 is superior to my old E46 M3.

The VANOS blew up on my hand-built S54 engine with just 41k miles. How's that for superior.

Right because hpfp and limp mode never happens.

I mean driving experience. That visceral feeling of na can never be replaced with the laziness of a turbo.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by turbolag

That visceral feeling of na can never be replaced with the laziness of a turbo.

This is a tough one. See, both NA and FI motors have their own varying degrees of "visceral". It's really tough for ME to determine which is better between an M3 and, say.....a modified turbo Supra or Skyline; those turbos sure as hell aren't lazy. It's a totally subjective thing. When I had my '03 and '05 M3's, for example, my friends had modified turbo Silvias and Truenos that would just make me nut when the rubber was put to the pavement. I would often get back into my M3 feeling like the car was lackluster compared to those cars. To ME, it's not so much about the technology that the motor uses to make power (..I'm not some naturally aspirated fascist) than it is how that power is delivered through the wheels......through the gas pedal.......through the steering wheel.......and most importantly, how I am affected emotionally. I'm sure that I will get into an F80 M3 and think to myself......"S65 what? S54 who? This new FI motor is bananas!"

[Coolhydro]

Depends!, e90 steering is too tight for me, it sucks at parking speeds and I hate it.

I have DHP-VSS and I think there is no reason to hate F30's steering, you get two different steering feels in one car!

Don't compare f30's steering to e90, compare it with a high end car are you will know the difference. I drive my friend's 911 all the time and it is not hard!

In parking speeds, e90 feels like my old 1990's power steering less car. This was said to me by many friends too.