[jtuds]

Originally Posted by r3dbimmer89

I dunno about Canadian prices but currently the 2012 F30 335i sport line is only about a $1000 difference in price when compared to a similarly 2012 S4. For a $1000 the S4 is the better car. The S4 is faster and grips the road better but the 3er is more nimble. For a nicely equipped 2013 F30 335i M sport is about $4000 less than a similarly equipped LCI 2013 S4. Audi has really increased the cost of options on these cars for MY 13 making it not worth to me. They're probably doing the same as far as prices in Canada as well. Who ever said that the S4 is a M3 competitor is smoking something. RS Audis go against ///M cars and Audi S cars go against a BMW ending in 35i.

For 2013 Audi is sweetening the deal on the S4. A S4 Premium with auto transmission will start at $59, 450. That includes Nav, Bang and Olufssen, and backup camera. The only real options to add are the drivetrain related options like drive select and rear differential....add those and you're approaching $70K. (that's where I came up with the 10 grand more estimate)

Considering the expected price bump in the 335i for 2013, the addition of options and the M Sport package, it is a possibility that a 2013 S4 will be cheaper in Canada than a 2013 335i with M Sport.

[gatoman39]

Originally Posted by jtuds

Considering the expected price bump in the 335i for 2013, the addition of options and the M Sport package, it is a possibility that a 2013 S4 will be cheaper in Canada than a 2013 335i with M Sport.

That settles it, I'm moving to Toronto. But not in the city, maybe 1.5-2 hrs west.

[verbs]

Audi feels like a pig, but IMO looks better on the outside and inside compared to the BMW. That said it's just not nearly as much of a drivers car as the BMW.

[jtuds]

Originally Posted by verbs

Audi feels like a pig, but IMO looks better on the outside and inside compared to the BMW. That said it's just not nearly as much of a drivers car as the BMW.

Not quite a pig, and less of a driver's car, yes. Even though it goes faster, it doesn't feel faster when you're going fast...

Nicer, higher quality interior though, and more refined....but I don't think the exterior styling is all that great on the S4.

One more positive for 2013 is that Audi are adding a way to direct engine noise to the cabin....which is nice, because in the 2012 all you hear is exhaust drone...and it's not that nice.

Still, in the 335i, you get a sensation of being pushed back into the seat when you accelerate, and that makes you feel like you're driving something really sporty.

On the speedometer in the S4, you see the numbers going up really fast, but you don't get the same sensation.

On the roads around here I found it difficult to judge handling....although the steering advantage with both cars in sport mode, to me, is better in the 335i.

[Casey 5]

I do not understand?

Is it better to actually go fast or "feel" like going fast.

Did you ever get smoked off the line but say....doesn't matter because it "felt" like I was going faster than you?

Bone stock vs. bone stock the S4 smokes the F30 335i off the line and from a 5mph roll.

Heck the n54 335is smoke the F30 N55 335i.

The F30 335i is not all that much quicker than an F30 328i...

This will change when BMW upgrades the 335i with either the N54 set up in the current E92 335is coupe...or some other set up.

But until BMW really and truly comes out with the next evolution for the 335i (which current F30 335i with N55 is not)....you will not be able to face the S4 at the line with confidence.

That is the test...if you cannot line up with confidence...other "feelings" do not matter.

[r3dbimmer89]

Originally Posted by Casey 5

I do not understand?

Is it better to actually go fast or "feel" like going fast.

Did you ever get smoked off the line but say....doesn't matter because it "felt" like I was going faster than you?

Bone stock vs. bone stock the S4 smokes the F30 335i off the line and from a 5mph roll.

Heck the n54 335is smoke the F30 N55 335i.

The F30 335i is not all that much quicker than an F30 328i...

This will change when BMW upgrades the 335i with either the N54 set up in the current E92 335is coupe...or some other set up.

But until BMW really and truly comes out with the next evolution for the 335i (which current F30 335i with N55 is not)....you will not be able to face the S4 at the line with confidence.

That is the test...if you cannot line up with confidence...other "feelings" do not matter.

Number wise the 328i isn't that much slower but it definitely feels much slower when compared to the 335i. I agree with the other guy, the 335i E90 or F30 has this way about it that makes it feel much faster than it really is. The S4 is faster no doubt but it doesn't give you the same sensation..

[Elk]

Originally Posted by Casey 5

That is the test...if you cannot line up with confidence....

Why bother? These cars are far from impressive drag racing machines. Pick your competition carefully; you will otherwise get smoked by a *lot* of cars.

If there car is not truly fast, enjoy that it feels fast.

[SPACEMANRICK]

Just to revive an old thread........I have had three BMW 3 series in a row over the past 10 years and am thinking it may be time for a change but I am not sure. I currently have a 2008 BMW 335xi 6 speed manual and I have not driven either of these 2 new cars yet (the 2013 BMW 335XI will be at the dealer at the end of this summer and the refreshed 2013 Audi S4 also arrives at the dealer at the end of the summer).

The Audi S4 has just had a minor redesign for 2013 since first released 3 years ago. The Canadian MSRP on both models are very close, the 2013 335XI is $53,800 and the 2013 Audi S4 is $53,000. In the premium models for both cars that include navigation, backup camera, improved sound system, adaptive headlights, keyless start the BMW 335XI is $58,300 and the AUDI S4 is $57,800. The Audi S4 in premium package includes blind spot detection when making a lane change which the BMW does not have in it's premium package and the Audi also includes 19" wheels compared to the BMW's 18" wheels.

I would probably buy the car and not lease and I am probably looking for a 6 speed manual......which car would you buy and why?

Any helpful feedback is appreciated!

[martinf79]

Maybe it's just me, but based on the pricing below for an S4, you net out at almost $77K for a similarly equipped S4 (Ontario) vs. 335i M Sport (about $72K). S4 is about $65K + about 3K BS fees + 13% tax = $77K. Not sure if the 5K difference is worth it.

[Maz335i]

Originally Posted by martinf79

Maybe it's just me, but based on the pricing below for an S4, you net out at almost $77K for a similarly equipped S4 (Ontario) vs. 335i M Sport (about $72K). S4 is about $65K + about 3K BS fees + 13% tax = $77K. Not sure if the 5K difference is worth it.

Obviously you wanna add those BS fee's to the BMW as well...or did you?

I'm sure the S4 came out slightly cheaper or even par with the 335i M Sport. Remember the S4 is much more powerful in term of HP....

If I had to make a decision now, I would still go for the 335i M Sport...

If I can wait, I'll get the redesigned S4 for sure...coming out end of next year or mid 2014...

[martinf79]

Originally Posted by Maz335i

Obviously you wanna add those BS fee's to the BMW as well...or did you?

I'm sure the S4 came out slightly cheaper or even par with the 335i M Sport. Remember the S4 is much more powerful in term of HP....

I would still go for the 335i M Sport if I had to make a decision...

BS fee's + taxes have been included in 335 M Sport Pricing = $72K

[r3dbimmer89]

Originally Posted by Maz335i

Obviously you wanna add those BS fee's to the BMW as well...or did you?

I'm sure the S4 came out slightly cheaper or even par with the 335i M Sport. Remember the S4 is much more powerful in term of HP....

If I had to make a decision now, I would still go for the 335i M Sport...

If I can wait, I'll get the redesigned S4 for sure...coming out end of next year or mid 2014...

The B9 S4 isnt coming out until sometime in 2015 for the 2016 model year. The B9 A4 will be out sometime in 2014 for the 2015 MY so you got a while buddy.

[stactum]

Originally Posted by SPACEMANRICK

I would probably buy the car and not lease and I am probably looking for a 6 speed manual......which car would you buy and why?

Any helpful feedback is appreciated!

In US 6MT S4 is actually $1,400 cheaper than S-Tronic, I don't know how it's in Canada.

On another note...

I am dealing with the same decision: 335i xDrive (Sport or M Sport) VS S4

I will have to get automatic for various reasons and:

Even though BMW 8-speed transmission is awesome, my vote goes to Audi dual-clutch, which is basically automated manual.

I heard a lot of people mentioning weight, but I wasn't able to find 335i xDrive weight, I believe 335i RWD is 3,594 lb (auto), but as far as I can tell it's not apples to apples. Does anyone know the weight for xDrive version?

[seis-speed]

I am a manual person, which makes me lean toward BMW. I would love to hear people's thoughts on Audi manual vs BMW manual. I have driven bith but I am so used to the BMW that when I drove the Audi it felt less engaged, the clutch seemed long, I am wondering how it feels after getting used to the car?

[shabadoo25]

Take this for what it's worth, but I was bored the other day and went to 3 separate Audi message boards.

I know people start threads here about issues with the cars, but that was ALL I saw over there. There was a little bit of "look at my new ride," but mostly complaints, complaints, complaints.

[MaX PL]

Originally Posted by shabadoo25

Take this for what it's worth, but I was bored the other day and went to 3 separate Audi message boards.

I know people start threads here about issues with the cars, but that was ALL I saw over there. There was a little bit of "look at my new ride," but mostly complaints, complaints, complaints.

i didnt find that at all. sure, some issues exist, but no more than here.

what i did find, however, was a shit ton more sponsors with threads promoting their parts. kinda annoying.

[Mrcarcrazy]

I didn't find all that many more complaints. however a look @ true delta makes the BMW look superior to Audi.

[Mako]

Just to clear up a few things I saw in this thread:

-Audi S4 just got its facelift for 2013 as did the regular A4, the B9 is 3 years away from going on sale for the A4, probably 4 years for the S4.

-The Audi S4 competes head to head with the 335xi M Sport, build them with the same options and the prices are almost exact (including Audi Care which is $850 in the US). The M335 or whatever it will be called will probably be $5K more.

-The Audi S4 does feel fast, it feels just as fast as my dad's old 335i (N54). Its a turbo fast which does feel different than a C63 or M3 fast but the S4 and 335i feel the same to me as far as speed goes (Automatic at least).

I would love to see a car magazine put these two against each other, I know there was a 335i vs a S4, both manual test a couple years ago, but I want to see a 2013 335xi versus a 2013 S4 with their automatics (which are faster than the sticks). BMW claims 0-60 in 4.8 on the 335xi, Audi claims 4.9 on the S4.

[chrisny]

Originally Posted by justinnum1

there is no a4 3.0 in america, thats why they compare the 335 to the s4(and 335 is putting out closer to 315 horses than 300) and weighs like 300 pounds less so its a good comparison imo

+1

Why do so many people miss that? Audi just does a better job of differentiating the bigger engine using the S vs BMW just changing the number (328/335).

///M competes with RS not S, ie the M3 competes with RS4 not S4. the M performance cars (previously iS cars...) give BMW 2 competitors to S cars and one would think/hope the M335 would be a step ahead of the S4 not on par with it.

[Mako]

Originally Posted by chrisny

+1

Why do so many people miss that? Audi just does a better job of differentiating the bigger engine using the S vs BMW just changing the number (328/335).

///M competes with RS not S, ie the M3 competes with RS4 not S4. the M performance cars (previously iS cars...) give BMW 2 competitors to S cars and one would think/hope the M335 would be a step ahead of the S4 not on par with it.

Also you can't compare a 335i to the S4 and say it weighs 300 pounds less...
you need to compare a 335xi to the S4 still a weight difference but only 150 pounds now. I am sure the next Gen Audi B9s will cut some weight to compete better.

simple fact if you are comparing a S4 and 335xi, they are going to offer the same performance in a straight line and on a track, the price will also be very similar. It just comes down to which design you prefer (personally I don't car for the new 3 series, the A4/S4 is getting dated but to me looks at least as good if not better than the new 3 series, especially the interior of the S4). As far as handling and feel go, that is subjective as well and you really need to test drive the 335xi vs S4, not the 335i as RWD will feel different than AWD. If you like RWD, then why even look at the S4??? audi does have a couple $1200 packages to alter the handling feel and AWD performance (giving it more of RWD handling in corners), make sure you test drive one with those options...

[batislav]

I've driven both a 335i and a S4 and both are good cars and I'm sure anyone who drives either will find them to be quality vehicles. It just comes down to personal preference.

I just think it's a stretch to call the cars competitors. I find it unlikely that Audi or BMW are looking at a 1 : 1 comparison when designing each model. I'm sure they're just as interested in the Mercedes C350 and Infiniti G37, among other cars.

I also think the decision between an A4/S4 and 328/335 is different. I couldn't test drive the S4 because they didn't have one (got to drive my cousin's another time) but I've never had a problem test driving a 335. If you want the S4 you'll probably have to order it and wait, you don't necessarily have to do that with the 335.

I see it like shopping for tomatoes. With the 328/335 its like deciding whether to pay that extra bit for organic, but you can get them both from the same store. With the S4, it's more like having to go to a farmer's market. Just a different type of consumer.

At least that's my experience.

[Mako]

Originally Posted by batislav

I've driven both a 335i and a S4 and both are good cars and I'm sure anyone who drives either will find them to be quality vehicles. It just comes down to personal preference.

I just think it's a stretch to call the cars competitors. I find it unlikely that Audi or BMW are looking at a 1 : 1 comparison when designing each model. I'm sure they're just as interested in the Mercedes C350 and Infiniti G37, among other cars.

I also think the decision between an A4/S4 and 328/335 is different. I couldn't test drive the S4 because they didn't have one (got to drive my cousin's another time) but I've never had a problem test driving a 335. If you want the S4 you'll probably have to order it and wait, you don't necessarily have to do that with the 335.

I see it like shopping for tomatoes. With the 328/335 its like deciding whether to pay that extra bit for organic, but you can get them both from the same store. With the S4, it's more like having to go to a farmer's market. Just a different type of consumer.

At least that's my experience.

Anyone shopping for a 335 or S4 is not looking at a G37 or C350 those cars are not in the same league. BMW and Audi know that, and Mercedes and Infiniti know that. Might as well throw the Volvo S60 R Design in there, sure its a nice car thats cheaper than the 335i and S4 but does it drive the same, NO.

You are right on the availability, although I was just at my Audi dealership and test drove a 2013 S4, they had 3 on the lot! They are not as rare as they used to be (previous gen when the S4 did sort of compete with an M3) but Audi dealers try to make them sound like they are! I can't stand Audi dealers for that reason, all over the world they don't discount, trying to get 3% off is like pulling teeth with them, 5% and they will laugh at you and tell you about how awesome their brand is and its the best Luxury car brand out there (I guess they don't read the actual statistics on sales though). I really like the A4 and S4 but not sure I am willing to deal with Audi