F30POST
F30POST
2012-2015 BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > Technical Forums > N20, N26, B46, B48 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > My N20 died at 72k miles
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-20-2017, 07:32 AM   #353
2012328i
Enlisted Member
United_States
4
Rep
46
Posts

Drives: 2012 328i
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: East coast

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamb1t View Post
This is one of the best thread on this forum. Investigative crowd sourcing FTW!
I'm over at the x3 forum and they have a number of timing chain issues there. I wonder the x3 drivers are more into ASS...

Can you post the link?
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2017, 02:53 PM   #354
F30ed
Private First Class
18
Rep
114
Posts

Drives: F30 328i tech
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Chicago

iTrader: (0)

Just a historical side turn: Nothing new under the Moon, something similar has happened just not far back: Mini Cooper (made by BMW ) 2007-2011 had very similar problem with timing chain and tensioners. It took a class action lawsuit to make BMW to recognize the problem and compensate those who suffered. We may expect something similar with N20 next year or so. BTW lawyers made $2.3M on that case, so if someone knows someone who wants to make some money - this may be a clear case.

http://blog.autoworkstx.com/mini-coo...-chain-issues/
Appreciate 1
      03-05-2017, 10:21 AM   #355
utjeffc
Registered
0
Rep
4
Posts

Drives: 2016 JB 328i
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by F30ed View Post
If the above theory is correct (sounds logical to me), chain stretch and plastic guides destruction is a function of number of engine starts. If you start the car and drive for 8 hours every day without stop, you can make N20 to 200,000 miles without a single problem. If you use ASS(auto-start-stop), you may damage your chains dozens time a day, and failure may occur much much sooner. This may sort of explain why some people make to 110K with no problem and some have chain ripped at around 50K, and why some have chain noise and some not.
Similarly, I wonder if it has to do with how soon you accelerate after starting. I've had my 328i for only a couple months, and in the first days when I was becoming familiar with auto start stop, I noticed that my normal driving habit from a stop was to quickly move my foot from brake to gas and accelerate. Driving that way with ASS, I felt more vibration and hesitation from the engine briefly. Perhaps it is the combination of low oil pressure in the tensioner when accelerating that prematurely wears the guides and chains. Meaning, ASS on its own may contribute to wear from additional engine starts, but it is stepping on the gas too soon that leads to catastrophic failure.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2017, 11:36 AM   #356
Sinmastah
New Member
0
Rep
14
Posts

Drives: 2014 320i xdrive
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Iowa

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by utjeffc View Post
Similarly, I wonder if it has to do with how soon you accelerate after starting. I've had my 328i for only a couple months, and in the first days when I was becoming familiar with auto start stop, I noticed that my normal driving habit from a stop was to quickly move my foot from brake to gas and accelerate. Driving that way with ASS, I felt more vibration and hesitation from the engine briefly. Perhaps it is the combination of low oil pressure in the tensioner when accelerating that prematurely wears the guides and chains. Meaning, ASS on its own may contribute to wear from additional engine starts, but it is stepping on the gas too soon that leads to catastrophic failure.
I've noticed this too, and definitely might be a factor. I usually look a couple cars ahead at a red light lets say, when their brake lights turn off I let my foot off the brake. That way the engine gets a couple seconds idle before I take off.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2017, 11:41 AM   #357
Delija
VIP
Delija's Avatar
2
Rep
12
Posts

Drives: F30 328i xDrive M Sport
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: NS

iTrader: (0)

If you are thinking about that while driving - you should sell your car ASAP
__________________
Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take but by the moments that take your breath away...
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2017, 11:43 AM   #358
bimmer456
Lieutenant
67
Rep
587
Posts

Drives: 340i
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Pasadena, CA

iTrader: (0)

There must have been a lingering problem due to manufacturing that finally caused a failure. Maybe a bad link in the timing chain. BMW should honor the fact that it's a defect and cover it. There's a word for that but I can't recall what it is. I myself have the 100k coverage for 6 years.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2017, 12:49 PM   #359
Sinmastah
New Member
0
Rep
14
Posts

Drives: 2014 320i xdrive
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Iowa

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delija View Post
If you are thinking about that while driving - you should sell your car ASAP
So you don't care about keeping your car running as smoothly as possible for as long as possible? This isn't something that takes minutes to think about. Just anticipate when you are going to take off like normal and take some pressure off the brake pedal a couple seconds before that. Takes no thought at all
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2017, 03:46 PM   #360
D041987
Second Lieutenant
United_States
40
Rep
205
Posts

Drives: 2012 328I 6speed
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Lynnwood, WA

iTrader: (0)

ASS has been known to contribute to premature wear on the bearings of the crank shaft and many mechanics recommend to code that off. You can ask your Dealership to code this off for you when you get your next oil change. Also change your oil every 5K miles. 15K intervals are a joke and are designed to make the engine last up to warranty after that its on you. Also it was a cost benefit analysis and a marketing strategy to have low oil changes to justify the high price tag for cars. Yet again BMW Germany states and for that matter any real mechanic will say go up to 5 to 7K at most for oil changes.

Sludge build up is a real thing and lack of fresh clean oil will put more strain on parts and create heat. Oil gets dark not because of age, it's because of metal to metal wear. The darker your oil the more metal it has in it.

The new design/update of these components seems to have fixed the issue as we do not hear about it any more from the new models but than again that might be because of the new engine design as well. There is a reason BMW scrapped the N20/n26 is such a short period of time.

Last edited by D041987; 03-10-2017 at 03:56 PM.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2017, 06:32 PM   #361
etinifni
Captain
etinifni's Avatar
60
Rep
767
Posts

Drives: 2012 328i Modern Line
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: NC

iTrader: (1)

I think BMW used n20 owners as guinea pigs with their first turbo 4cyl.
__________________
:wave
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2017, 09:21 AM   #362
mysticwizard
Private
2
Rep
55
Posts

Drives: BMW F32 428i
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Belgium

iTrader: (0)

My 428i (april 2014) has 60.000km on the clock and last week the oil pump and timing chain have been replaced. I had luck that I heard a high pitched noise the last couple of weeks, which wasn't normal and was I just on time to replace the parts. Otherwise an engine blow wouldn't have been far away...
Luckily all of this (3 days of work + parts) have been covered under warranty by BMW, altough my car is almost 3 years old and the standard warranty is already expired.
With the new improvements on this timing chain, this problem should be solved... Crossing fingers...
Appreciate 0
      03-13-2017, 01:40 AM   #363
davitd
Enlisted Member
3
Rep
34
Posts

Drives: bmw 325 e90
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Georgia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticwizard View Post
My 428i (april 2014) has 60.000km on the clock and last week the oil pump and timing chain have been replaced. I had luck that I heard a high pitched noise the last couple of weeks, which wasn't normal and was I just on time to replace the parts. Otherwise an engine blow wouldn't have been far away...
Luckily all of this (3 days of work + parts) have been covered under warranty by BMW, altough my car is almost 3 years old and the standard warranty is already expired.
With the new improvements on this timing chain, this problem should be solved... Crossing fingers...
Did they replace the oil pump with balance shafts or only the oil pump? Did you hear the whine only when the car was cold or also when it was warm?

Could you report back if the whine noise returns? because I replaced the chains with the oil pump and shafts and the whine returned in a few thousand kilometers
Appreciate 0
      03-13-2017, 01:48 AM   #364
bimmer456
Lieutenant
67
Rep
587
Posts

Drives: 340i
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Pasadena, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by focal View Post
threads like this that make me hesitant to even get the Dinan. I want my N20 car to last. I usually keep my cars 7-12 years depending on reliability. Most make it to 10.
A friend of mine has an e46 with 300k miles still looks and runs like new.
Appreciate 0
      03-13-2017, 02:51 AM   #365
mysticwizard
Private
2
Rep
55
Posts

Drives: BMW F32 428i
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Belgium

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by davitd View Post
Did they replace the oil pump with balance shafts or only the oil pump? Did you hear the whine only when the car was cold or also when it was warm?

Could you report back if the whine noise returns? because I replaced the chains with the oil pump and shafts and the whine returned in a few thousand kilometers
Actually I really don't know about the balance shaft. Only thing I know is that they replaced the oil pump and timing chain. They said that there were improvements made to the chain...
I only heard the noise when the engine was cold.
Appreciate 0
      03-13-2017, 10:45 AM   #366
madmortar
Second Lieutenant
32
Rep
239
Posts

Drives: 2013 BMW 328i M-Sport
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Savannah, GA

iTrader: (0)

This is so sketchy..
Appreciate 0
      03-13-2017, 02:25 PM   #367
natesi
Private
8
Rep
58
Posts

Drives: 2016 328i xDrive
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Portland, OR

iTrader: (0)

Which people here, that have had this problem, use ASS?
Appreciate 0
      03-14-2017, 03:53 AM   #368
mysticwizard
Private
2
Rep
55
Posts

Drives: BMW F32 428i
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Belgium

iTrader: (0)

When I start my car, I always turn of ASS immediately! The ASS function has never been used on my 428i.
Appreciate 0
      03-18-2017, 02:08 PM   #369
hashrock
Registered
0
Rep
3
Posts

Drives: 2013 BMW 328i
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Raleigh, NC

iTrader: (0)

Recently purchased a 2013 328i with 72k miles so as you might imagine - I'm a little concerned. So in reading through this thread along with others on the web about this issue, what exactly fails causing the engine to grenade? To me it looks like it's one of 3 things, but i'm not sure which one?

1) the orange plastic chain guide breaks, perhaps as a result of oil pump failure causing too much friction from lack of lubrication?

2) timing chain snaps because of faulty tensioner and/or defective chain?

3) oil pump chain snaps because of defective manufacturing?

4) combination of above or something else?

It seems that BMW recognized one of these was the issue since all the pieces were replace with N20's built after 01/2015. Secondary question, how much should it cost to replace the entire timing chain mechanism? I was quoted 4k by dealer and that did not include oil pump. Given the cost of materials, that adds up to about 3.5k in labor which sounds absurd. Is this something that can be done by a competent mechanic? Thanks in advance.
Appreciate 0
      03-18-2017, 03:05 PM   #370
KGB_123_99
Captain
Canada
140
Rep
767
Posts

Drives: '13 328iX Sport, '14 F-Type
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Montreal, QC

iTrader: (0)

For this money I would get an extended or 3rd party warranty. It will cost less than proactive complement replacement and will also cover other things. Chances are your engine will be just fine.
Appreciate 0
      03-23-2017, 01:38 AM   #371
EmEm
New Member
1
Rep
7
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW 328i Sport Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Oman

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kronk View Post
Bingo. I was so thrilled when I bought this car and the european delivery experience was incredible. I thought I'd be a "BMW lifer." I was planning on buying a 5 series or X5 in the next few months.

This entire experience has turned me off BMWs completely. The product is partly to blame, but mostly it's because of the way the company has handled this entire situation.
Don't blame the Manufacturer as it's mainly the dealer's attitude that ruins the whole experience. I face the same issue with our Local Dealer here in Oman as well. they are so arrogant and ignorant at the same time. I always find a hard time dealing with them even for small things.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:37 PM.




f30post
f30post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST