01-29-2013, 02:07 PM | #23 | |
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You are right, I don't think I drove the Msport with DHC, so can't comment on that particular variant - but those that have, still say the E90 steering feel and braking is better. The steering may be quicker, but its very light - that's across the board (I drove a sport line/pkg car, and drove it in Sport + mode - felt no difference in the numb feel. The MSPort brakes I believe are quiter, but don't improve braking distance. Again, I use the word 'I believe' because I haven't driven one so equipped - just basing it on what I have read right here on this site. Third, used to be that any variant of the 3er had great brakes - so are we supposed to be satisfied with the fact that bar the staggered set up car, the rest of the lineup exhibits poor braking? I am not saying it is not a good/great sport sedan - in fact, my first piece of advice to OP was that he should drive both, before I got into this 'which is better' argument. My personal opinion (and shared by most professional reviewers) is that the E90 has the F30 beat in the enthusiasm category. There's enough evidence out there, but then again, its to each his own. What may be sport for me may be too stiff for you...therefore the 'drive it yourself' advice which both of us agree on. |
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01-30-2013, 02:10 AM | #24 | |
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A few test drives are, in my eyes, not enough when you clearly are an owner of what you yourself consider to be a legendary and awesome machine (judging by how you talk about your N54 equipped monster). Bias? And for your second point, you´re right, I didnt ask "are you a skilled driver" so why insinuate that I did. I used another way of describing "knowing how to drive" with "being skilled", is THAT hard to comprehend. Trying to catch cheap points or what? Well you dropped the ball on that one as well
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Former: Glacier Ag. F31 328iA RWD M Sport oct. 2012, sold July 2022 | Sport Automatic | Adap. M Susp. | Pano. Moonroof | 20" ATS Racelight Grey w. Michelin PSS| M Sport brakes | Harman Kardon | Elec. Seats | PDC F&R | ACC Stop&Go | 335i MPE | Perf. Parts | Last edited by Vitoco; 01-30-2013 at 02:37 AM.. |
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01-30-2013, 09:08 AM | #25 |
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E90 xDrive cars only came with the base suspension. F30 xDrive cars can get the Adaptive M suspension. So when it comes to xDrives the F30 is the better performance choice, not the antiquated E90.
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01-30-2013, 12:39 PM | #26 | |
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With respect to bias - of course some bais comes in, but I was one who really wanted to like the F30, but couldn't. As you probably read (but obviously not comprehended) - I kept saying 'IMO' before you butted in with your insults. Third - I didn't insinuate anything - you asked me first 'if I knew how to drive' to which I answered 'yes I did', and mentioned my car - and your retort 'does driving an N54 make you a skilled driver?' plus your usual silly emoticons. To that I responded that I never said that I am a skilled driver because I drive an N54 - only that yes, I do know how to drive in the literal sense. Drop the ball anyone? Last - with trying to make cheap points - you are the master of that - from your first post all you are trying to do is score cheap points. |
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01-30-2013, 12:41 PM | #27 | |
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Anyway, this is not an E90 v/s F30 post - just everyone making their suggestions to the OP, before we had a particularly smartass nut jump in. |
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01-30-2013, 01:18 PM | #28 | |
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01-30-2013, 01:32 PM | #29 |
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I have to say, I don't see how you are considering a coupe in one generation and a sedan in the other. That said, as someone noted above, when you use sport mode, the steering feel of the F30 does go up a bit. A coupe will always look sexier than a sedan of the same model.
I have an E92, and I just love the car. It's fun to drive and practical all at once. Also, as it's a coupe, it's going to be a long time before it stops looking good. Check the post that shows all the generations of 3er coupes. The first two do look a bit dated, but still not bad looking. The E36 and E46 still look great, I'm pretty certain that'll be the case with the E92 for some time to come. If you are going to lease the car, definitely get the E92. By the time your lease is up, you can then choose between the F30 and the F32, or you can choose to buy your E92. If you are buying, you just have to drive them both and see which one you are more comfortable living with for the time you'll own it.
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01-30-2013, 01:41 PM | #30 | |
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At reasonable speeds (60 mph) I've only heard 110 feet (give or take) cited as the distance to stop. And based on the few times I've made emergency stops, I'd say that's about right.
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01-30-2013, 02:15 PM | #31 | |
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Having written that, I agree that the E9x cars are more sport focused and it's pretty clear that's so from the moment one first drives one. Having driven a couple F30s -- a pure base model and a 335 sport -- I would also say that the F30 doesn't give up any of the sporting ability to the E9x, it's definitely not a less capable car, but rather it's a less communicative car as to the limits of its capabilities. Now does that matter in every day driving? For 99.9% of people and situations, not at all. And I'd argue that it'd be silly to make a buying decision based on 0.01% of anything. Where it does matter is on the track. The extent to which a car communicates clearly and completely affects directly the driver's confidence and ability to exert the most from the car. In daily driving situations, the driver is going to do what's appropriate and/or presumably called for to/by the situation. Emergency maneuvers are made without regard to the feedback the car gives, but rather with regard to situational exigencies. If an unfortunate outcome is the result, it won't be because the driver didn't try to push the car as much as possible to avoid such a thing happening. It will have had nothing to do with confidence. On a track, in contrast, actions are deliberate. If one feels one can rely on the car's feedback, one will push to that point. If the car doesn't clearly communicate its limits, the driver is uncertain and may not push hard enough or will push too hard, both actions resulting from just not really being 100% sure of the situation at that moment and how the car is responding to it. It's about the car letting the driver know if s/he can dial in a bit more throttle, or whether to brake now or a second later/sooner, or whether to turn this or that direction a bit more or less. If you are indeed a safe driver on public roads, you will never be driving in a way that you'd be deliberately making such calls and planning such limit-treading handling actions that far in advance that it matters. Yet, you may find yourself making the exact same"at the limit" handling moves in a crisis. In the crisis scenario, the F30 is just as capable as the E90 and so you'll crash, or not, with either car depending on whether you exceed the car's ability, again, because you are going to make the car do what you think is necessary as a result of the environmental cues, not as a result of the car's feedback.
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01-31-2013, 03:15 AM | #32 | |
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01-31-2013, 09:26 AM | #33 |
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01-31-2013, 09:27 AM | #34 |
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Car & Driver tested it at 190 feet from 70mph to 0 (C&D's standard braking test is 70-0)
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01-31-2013, 09:29 AM | #35 | |
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01-31-2013, 09:30 AM | #36 |
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01-31-2013, 09:39 AM | #37 |
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01-31-2013, 09:42 AM | #38 |
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I'm pretty sure most people who won't shut up about how the E9x is supposedly the "real enthusiast's" choice base their judgment entirely on the fact that the E9x ride is worse than the F30.
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01-31-2013, 04:04 PM | #39 |
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01-31-2013, 04:10 PM | #40 |
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If I use your logic, should I say that the "enthusiasts: are those that base their judgement that the F30 is better because of a softer ride? And since you can't use polite language - what will it take for YOU (the AWD 'enthusiat') to shut up?
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