F30POST
F30POST
2012-2015 BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > 2012-2019 BMW 3 and 4-Series Forums > General F30 Sedan / F32 Coupe / F36 Gran Coupe Forum > Reality Check - F30 road trip
ARMA SPEED
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-07-2016, 10:33 AM   #1
sygazelle
Brigadier General
11091
Rep
3,404
Posts

Drives: 2014 328i M-Sport, 2019 X5 40i
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: San Francisco

iTrader: (0)

Reality Check - F30 road trip

Just got back from a road trip in my F30 with a buddy of mine that owns a TL that is a few years old. Before this trip my buddy teased me about owning a BMW and wondering what all the fuss was about. He can afford whatever he wants so it wasn't a jealousy thing at all.

Anyway, we took this road trip from the Bay Area to Mammoth and Death Valley. I offered to let him drive and at first he was reluctant. When we left Mammoth I offered to let him drive again and he finally accepted. In a matter of a few miles he went from an annoying non-BMW guy to a gusher. He used the word awesome so much I thought I was listening to Jeff Gordon praise his team, owners, sponsors and fans after a NASCAR victory; awesome, awesome, awesome!

He loved the different settings from Eco to Sport + and kept switching to feel the noticeable difference. He loved the adaptive suspension, the power, the transmission, the HK sound, the sport seats, the M-sport steering wheel.

From that point on he could not get enough of it. He drove most of the remaining 500 miles of the trip. I had to sit there and keep hearing the word awesome and look at that sh*t-eating grin on his face. I reminded him all cars have gotten better since his TL was new and downplay the BMW thing a bit. He wasn't buying it.

We get back to his house and his wife asked how the trip went and he turned into a BMW salesman going on and on about how amazing the car is an how he wants to go get one. His wife gave me that look

To all the enthusiasts that think BMW has lost its way and the ride and steering are not the same as the beloved E90, I get that. There is a lot of truth there. BMW is not the same experience as previous generations. So, by comparison the F30 may be lacking. But to my buddy who comes from another model, the F30 is awesome. So while BMW is losing some enthusiasts to other brands there are guys like my buddy that can't wait to get their hands on one.
Appreciate 9
      03-07-2016, 10:38 AM   #2
Victorious
Second Lieutenant
10
Rep
256
Posts

Drives: BSM F30
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: MD

iTrader: (5)

awesome story, way to convert another enthusiast
__________________
ACZakka325i: Men age like wine. Women age like milk.
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 12:28 PM   #3
canukgtp
First Lieutenant
canukgtp's Avatar
Canada
107
Rep
333
Posts

Drives: 2018 M3
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: New-Brunswick

iTrader: (0)

good stuff...coming from an E90 and E92, I know what people mean, but honestly the F30 is a great car, don't feel less of an enthusiast by having one.
__________________
2018 F80 M3 6MT (current)
2014 F31 328i Touring (sold)
2008 E92 M3 6MT (sold)
2011 E90 335xi (lease up)
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 12:30 PM   #4
nicknaz
Lieutenant General
nicknaz's Avatar
3183
Rep
10,509
Posts

Drives: C6Z
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NorCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sygazelle View Post
To all the enthusiasts that think BMW has lost its way and the ride and steering are not the same as the beloved E90, I get that. There is a lot of truth there. BMW is not the same experience as previous generations. So, by comparison the F30 may be lacking. But to my buddy who comes from another model, the F30 is awesome. So while BMW is losing some enthusiasts to other brands there are guys like my buddy that can't wait to get their hands on one.
Cool story!! glad you had a great trip


but...the cynic in me is thinking this is exactly what BMW had in mind with the softer F30.. to convert Lexus and Acura types.

If you had an E90 M3 I suspect your friend would have been complaining of the harsh ride and hard to turn steering wheel.

An "hardcore enthusiast" honda owner would have an AP1 S2k with a suspension mods worth as much as the car, or an engine swapped civic. Was your friend's TL even a 6MT type S or was it an automatic base TL?

Don't mean, to come off negatively, just truly curious because when some colleagues get into my F80 M3 they are like WTF are these cloth seats and why is the car so bumpy?! So it seems like the sport aspects of BMW that we all love actually are a turn off to some
Appreciate 1
      03-07-2016, 12:36 PM   #5
goj
Brigadier General
goj's Avatar
United_States
2252
Rep
3,622
Posts

Drives: 2016 EBII 340i 6-MT
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by canukgtp
good stuff...coming from an E90 and E92, I know what people mean, but honestly the F30 is a great car, don't feel less of an enthusiast by having one.
Exactly. I actually chuckle when people even on here are constantly complaining. It's still a fantastic drivers car
__________________
BMW CCA Member #516012
2016 340i, Estoril Blue, Manual Transmission, MPE, MPBBK, HRE FF04
Instagram: @brandons340i
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 12:41 PM   #6
the_phew
Lieutenant
352
Rep
556
Posts

Drives: '17 GTI 6MT, was 320i ZSP/ZMT
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: United States

iTrader: (0)

All I know is that I'd trade the 6MT in the F3x for Honda's 6MT from the TL without second thought. I drove a 6MT TSX for a decade before my F30, and the transmission is what I miss most. The Acura also had better cabin materials and of course my only repair in a decade was the cruise control switch. FWD sucks though!

Honda made/makes the best 6MT of all time, especially the box in the S2000. That thing feels exactly like a bolt-action rifle. Second-closest is probably Porsche, but they are a distant second.
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 01:17 PM   #7
mike@x-ph.com
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor
mike@x-ph.com's Avatar
United_States
23784
Rep
190,103
Posts


Drives: 07-335/12-328/18-M4/21-M4CP
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Las Vegas

iTrader: (23)

the BMW driving experience is one of a kind
__________________
Check out our current sale by clicking on this link!
https://x-ph.com/sale/

Phone number 702-494-9435
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 03:18 PM   #8
sygazelle
Brigadier General
11091
Rep
3,404
Posts

Drives: 2014 328i M-Sport, 2019 X5 40i
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: San Francisco

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
Cool story!! glad you had a great trip


but...the cynic in me is thinking this is exactly what BMW had in mind with the softer F30.. to convert Lexus and Acura types.

If you had an E90 M3 I suspect your friend would have been complaining of the harsh ride and hard to turn steering wheel.

An "hardcore enthusiast" honda owner would have an AP1 S2k with a suspension mods worth as much as the car, or an engine swapped civic. Was your friend's TL even a 6MT type S or was it an automatic base TL?

Don't mean, to come off negatively, just truly curious because when some colleagues get into my F80 M3 they are like WTF are these cloth seats and why is the car so bumpy?! So it seems like the sport aspects of BMW that we all love actually are a turn off to some
I don't think its cynical at all. I've been mentioning on this forum, probably more often than true purists (whoever they are) care to hear, that BMW needs to expand its market to survive as a company. No car company can afford to stay one thing and expect to grow. Car companies either grow or they get eaten. Very few can stay niche and get away with it.

My buddy has the TL with an automatic transmission.

Those that have a problem with BMW catering to a broader audience either 1) don't know anything about running a business, 2) think BMW exists for their own personal use, or 3) I can't think of a third although I want to keep the category there in case a member responding to this post thinks of another one.

And your point about cloth seats and a bumpy ride is spot on. Not everybody understands and appreciates or wants an M3 or any performance-oriented vehicle. That okay. That's why successful car companies build so many types of vehicles. If you think about it, its a great time for car buyers/leasers. The choices and options are amazing and cars have never been cheaper in terms of price/performance/functionality/features.

Enjoy your M3. I am properly jealous, cloth seats or not
Appreciate 1
      03-07-2016, 03:28 PM   #9
sygazelle
Brigadier General
11091
Rep
3,404
Posts

Drives: 2014 328i M-Sport, 2019 X5 40i
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: San Francisco

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_phew View Post
All I know is that I'd trade the 6MT in the F3x for Honda's 6MT from the TL without second thought. I drove a 6MT TSX for a decade before my F30, and the transmission is what I miss most. The Acura also had better cabin materials and of course my only repair in a decade was the cruise control switch. FWD sucks though!

Honda made/makes the best 6MT of all time, especially the box in the S2000. That thing feels exactly like a bolt-action rifle. Second-closest is probably Porsche, but they are a distant second.

It's a shame for those MT drivers like you than BMW isn't offering a competitive MT transmission.

I drove stick for most of my life and hated AT. While I still occasionally long for a MT, the 8-speed ZF in the F30 is so good I really don't think about MT anymore. I guess I've gone to the dark side.
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 03:29 PM   #10
sygazelle
Brigadier General
11091
Rep
3,404
Posts

Drives: 2014 328i M-Sport, 2019 X5 40i
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: San Francisco

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
the BMW driving experience is one of a kind
AND SO ARE YOUR ADS.
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 03:37 PM   #11
sygazelle
Brigadier General
11091
Rep
3,404
Posts

Drives: 2014 328i M-Sport, 2019 X5 40i
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: San Francisco

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by goj View Post
Exactly. I actually chuckle when people even on here are constantly complaining. It's still a fantastic drivers car

I don't fault the complainers too much since I used to be one. I was a multiple e39 owner and felt that it was the best sedan ever made. When the E60 bangled flame surface thing came out, I hated it and kept my beloved E39 instead of buying something that wasn't worthy in my humble view. I saved $60k and continued to drive a car I loved instead. I complained, but on the E39 forum. What I didn't do was go on the E60 forums and tell the E60 owners how unworthy their cars were. What's the point of that?
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 03:41 PM   #12
eluded
2JZ-GTE
eluded's Avatar
Bulgaria
2959
Rep
3,948
Posts

Drives: 340 6MT, 50e, others
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Sofia

iTrader: (0)

The MT in the BMW isn't that bad. Sure its not the S2000 but nothign is

Actually i find the STI tranny closest to the S2K. Porsche gears are spaced farther than say, Chevy SS or ATSV to name a few, and thus don't feel as good. I'd say porsche is at least a distant 4th place.


Quote:
Originally Posted by the_phew View Post
Honda made/makes the best 6MT of all time, especially the box in the S2000. That thing feels exactly like a bolt-action rifle. Second-closest is probably Porsche, but they are a distant second.
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 03:49 PM   #13
tturedraider
Major General
tturedraider's Avatar
United_States
4938
Rep
6,218
Posts

Drives: 2018 340i M Sport
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Chicago, Edgewater (via Texas & Tennessee)

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
Cool story!! glad you had a great trip


but...the cynic in me is thinking this is exactly what BMW had in mind with the softer F30.. to convert Lexus and Acura types.

If you had an E90 M3 I suspect your friend would have been complaining of the harsh ride and hard to turn steering wheel.
If the initial comparison here is BMW F30 to Acura TL I'm not sure I understand why you switch to an E90 M3 rather than an E90 with sport package. What does comparing to the most extreme E90 show when compared to a normal TL?
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 04:03 PM   #14
goj
Brigadier General
goj's Avatar
United_States
2252
Rep
3,622
Posts

Drives: 2016 EBII 340i 6-MT
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sygazelle
Quote:
Originally Posted by goj View Post
Exactly. I actually chuckle when people even on here are constantly complaining. It's still a fantastic drivers car

I don't fault the complainers too much since I used to be one. I was a multiple e39 owner and felt that it was the best sedan ever made. When the E60 bangled flame surface thing came out, I hated it and kept my beloved E39 instead of buying something that wasn't worthy in my humble view. I saved $60k and continued to drive a car I loved instead. I complained, but on the E39 forum. What I didn't do was go on the E60 forums and tell the E60 owners how unworthy their cars were. What's the point of that?
And for that, the normal people on the forums thank you
__________________
BMW CCA Member #516012
2016 340i, Estoril Blue, Manual Transmission, MPE, MPBBK, HRE FF04
Instagram: @brandons340i
Appreciate 1
      03-07-2016, 04:19 PM   #15
nicknaz
Lieutenant General
nicknaz's Avatar
3183
Rep
10,509
Posts

Drives: C6Z
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NorCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sygazelle View Post
My buddy has the TL with an automatic transmission.

Those that have a problem with BMW catering to a broader audience either 1) don't know anything about running a business,

Not everybody understands and appreciates or wants an M3 or any performance-oriented vehicle. That okay. That's why successful car companies build so many types of vehicles.


Enjoy your M3. I am properly jealous, cloth seats or not
+1 on all counts. It's a win win.. F30 can convert more people to BMW, BMW can afford to afford F8X of all sorts, everyone gets what they want

Thanks. the f80 is pretty awesome. I'm pretty much in love with it as a daily driver/toy combo pack. BUT in full disclosure, there was a huge storm in socal today, and RE11 tires + S55 turbo power were a bit of a stressful combo. I could have used N20 + all season RFT + parking cameras + blind spot assistance, etc etc (or the wife's porky 3900lb X135 awd hatch).
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 04:23 PM   #16
nicknaz
Lieutenant General
nicknaz's Avatar
3183
Rep
10,509
Posts

Drives: C6Z
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NorCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by __ View Post
If the initial comparison here is BMW F30 to Acura TL I'm not sure I understand why you switch to an E90 M3 rather than an E90 with sport package. What does comparing to the most extreme E90 show when compared to a normal TL?
My personal belief is that the F30 is meant to convert "normal" people who value soft ride, luxury features, etc. And that those normal people would be turned off by things that "enthusiasts" (like many of the people on this forum who complain about F30 steering etc) value

There are many posts that ask why don't people have sport suspension in their F30, or why do people pay $65k+ for loaded F36 instead of base F80 , and I now feel those aren't fair comments, since F30 is purposely meant to target "normal people".

As an aside, I offered my F80 to my wife many times to take on as her daily to replace her F30 335, but she flat out refused it, since she didn't like the firmer suspension, or the heavier steering feeling. I GUESSED that OP's TL driving friend would have a point of view similar to my wife and preferring the softer F30

Last edited by nicknaz; 03-07-2016 at 04:29 PM..
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 04:38 PM   #17
tturedraider
Major General
tturedraider's Avatar
United_States
4938
Rep
6,218
Posts

Drives: 2018 340i M Sport
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Chicago, Edgewater (via Texas & Tennessee)

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
I understand for the most part, but the Acura TL's target market was basically 3 Series oriented drivers who valued higher reliability (perceived or otherwise) and more "bang for their buck" than 3er buyers. They were looking for a sporty handling and driving car at less than a 3 Series price. They weren't Accord and Camry buyers.

There are also a lot of consumers who have a low opinion of BMWs and BMW owners. They view BMW owners as conceited a-holes and BMW cars as overpriced extravagances. Many have zero interest in even test driving a BMW to see if all the fuss is justified. And, as with the OP's friend, many of them have the same reaction after driving a BMW. And that was true before the F3x hit the market.

Last edited by tturedraider; 03-07-2016 at 04:46 PM..
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 05:49 PM   #18
nicknaz
Lieutenant General
nicknaz's Avatar
3183
Rep
10,509
Posts

Drives: C6Z
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NorCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by __ View Post
I understand for the most part, but the Acura TL's target market was basically 3 Series oriented drivers who valued higher reliability (perceived or otherwise) and more "bang for their buck" than 3er buyers. They were looking for a sporty handling and driving car at less than a 3 Series price. They weren't Accord and Camry buyers.
Are you sure the TL buyers weren't people who looked at Camry or accord with v6 and leather and saw they could get a "luxury brand" acura for not much more money?



By the way, I agree with you, the 3er range is so broad there are so many reasons why people want it.
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 06:44 PM   #19
Marty P
Private
11
Rep
52
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW 328i //M
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Stockton ca.

iTrader: (0)

Great story..I call that being born again..... Christian humor lol
Appreciate 1
      03-07-2016, 07:12 PM   #20
tturedraider
Major General
tturedraider's Avatar
United_States
4938
Rep
6,218
Posts

Drives: 2018 340i M Sport
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Chicago, Edgewater (via Texas & Tennessee)

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
Are you sure the TL buyers weren't people who looked at Camry or accord with v6 and leather and saw they could get a "luxury brand" acura for not much more money?



By the way, I agree with you, the 3er range is so broad there are so many reasons why people want it.
I'm quite sure of the goal of Acura's establishment as a brand in 1986. They wanted to focus on engineering excellence. You might notice their logo resembles a measuring caliper.

This for free. The center of the Infiniti logo is looking down "the road to infinity".
Attached Images
   
Appreciate 0
      03-07-2016, 07:24 PM   #21
NOGBMW
Private
NOGBMW's Avatar
United_States
34
Rep
61
Posts

Drives: 2024 i4 M50
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (0)

I am a former TL owner of 8 years that just got a 2013 335 and I must tell you while the TL is a solid car it can't touch the shear thrill and joy I get from driving my 335 everyday. I know your friend shit eating grin all too well because it's what my face looks like from the minute I pull out the driveway until I return home.
__________________
2024 i4 M50
DRAVIT GREY

Appreciate 2
      03-07-2016, 09:03 PM   #22
python
Enlisted Member
United_States
10
Rep
33
Posts

Drives: 340i M-Sport
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: So Cal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by __ View Post
I'm quite sure of the goal of Acura's establishment as a brand in 1986. They wanted to focus on engineering excellence. You might notice their logo resembles a measuring caliper.

This for free. The center of the Infiniti logo is looking down "the road to infinity".
I always thought the Acura logo was just the Honda logo pinched at the top to make it look like an A. The fact that it looks like calipers might be serendipitous.
Appreciate 1
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:39 AM.




f30post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST