[jetbill]

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[jetbill]

Alignment specs.
I've got about 5mm up front of clearance to the fender. Dialing back some front camber to about 1.8-2.0 would be about the limit.

I've been scrubbing these tires in during daily driving this week for a weekend event and surprisingly with 2.75 degrees up front at 0 toe it's very "street-able".

[Dog Face Pony Soldier]

Not a track setup per-Se...

Michelin PSS on OEM 400m wheels:

18x8" ET34 225/45-18 front
18x8.5" ET47 255/40-18 rear

Added BMS spacers at 12mm front/15mm rear

Stock springs and DHP dampers/steering.

M Sport brake upgrade option. Adding Challenge braided hoses, race fluid (Motul?) and probably R4S brake pads.

For track use... I definitely prefer to NOT run my rear tires with higher pressure than the fronts. I found myself bleeding air out of my rear tires all day while experimenting at the track... I even added a bit to the front compared to BMW's 100MPH+ recommendation.

The rear of my 335 is lighter than the front... Why run more pressure in the rear anyway?

[DVC]

Originally Posted by jetbill

Alignment specs.
I've got about 5mm up front of clearance to the fender. Dialing back some front camber to about 1.8-2.0 would be about the limit.

I've been scrubbing these tires in during daily driving this week for a weekend event and surprisingly with 2.75 degrees up front at 0 toe it's very "street-able".

Do you ever think of going for more rear camber?

[jetbill]

Originally Posted by DVC

Do you ever think of going for more rear camber?

I do, but all relative to what I can get out of the front for camber.

I've found the type of tire you run and wether or not you run a LSD are two major factors on car setup.

I try to keep about 1.5 degrees of separation between front and rear camber for balance (depending on running staggered or square).

Yesterday the car ran the best it has ever based on about 80 autocross runs and 4 HPDE's in the last 8 months.

Now that I've got a LSD, Id like to find a thicker rear bar to help with more initial turn in and rotation in the rear.

275 (RS3's are an amazing tire btw) square setup makes the car a little less "sensitive" to change direction with DHP and Dinan springs with Dinan software. My guess is that KW setup will be the way to go as far as sway bars. As long as there's some sense of adjustability, KW doesn't need to be perfect.

[shivaswrath]

Originally Posted by DVC

Lots of good info here regarding wheel/tire choices, etc - but I haven't seen any info on tire pressures.

What PSI front/rear are you guys running at the track? I think I had my stock Conti RFTs a little too high yesterday, and they got a bit greasy by the end of the second session...

Once warmed up and hot, 40 psi is max in the front (I was doing best at around 39-40)....I bled off a lot.

In the rear, I was happiest at 38psi.

40psi all around wouldn't kill...I'll try it next track day.

[jetbill]

That's exactly were I also found was the sweet spot..

[Polo08816]

Originally Posted by Geezer

My car is coming with staggered summer setup and I bought another set of staggered wheels for it. Planning on using the 8s for winter and the 8.5s for summer. Much cheaper than buying a set of aftermarket wheels and I prefer the stock look. Thanks for the help I may try 12mm front and 15mm rear thinking about it the 3mm shouldn't have any real effect on how the car drives.

I'm trying to procure another set of staggered 400m wheels before the winter but it seems like the prices aren't that appealing. Where did you get yours?

[utenigma]

Originally Posted by jetbill

Alignment specs.
I've got about 5mm up front of clearance to the fender. Dialing back some front camber to about 1.8-2.0 would be about the limit.

I've been scrubbing these tires in during daily driving this week for a weekend event and surprisingly with 2.75 degrees up front at 0 toe it's very "street-able".

Bill am I reading your sheet right - you've got 0.21 total toe out on the rear?

Usually toe out's represented as a negative number and yours reads positive (which would denote toe in), but the tire graphics look like they're depicting toe out so I'm confused.

[jetbill]

Originally Posted by utenigma

Bill am I reading your sheet right - you've got 0.21 total toe out on the rear?

Usually toe out's represented as a negative number and yours reads positive (which would denote toe in), but the tire graphics look like they're depicting toe out so I'm confused.

The symbolic (graphical) representation is confusing.

It's a total of 0.21 toe in.

[Forgiven]

Originally Posted by jetbill

Those looking to run 275 square (RS3's) setup, yes it's possible.

These are on a set of 18x9.5 with an offset of 45 with a 10mm spacer up front. No spacer is required in the rear. Dinan springs.

This is amazing!

[Forgiven]

Originally Posted by jetbill

Those looking to run 275 square (RS3's) setup, yes it's possible.

These are on a set of 18x9.5 with an offset of 45 with a 10mm spacer up front. No spacer is required in the rear. Dinan springs.

I tried 17x9.5 35et 275/40 Nitto Nt-01 on front and it is rubbing the strut. I am putting 3mm spacers to clear it out.
I guess it's because r-compound run little wider than street tires.

[Yuqi]

Originally Posted by jbass524

Hey DVCperformance,

There's a fitment article here: http://www.f30post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=874148.

A heavily staggered setup like this, 8.5"/245mm and 10"/275mm, is not good for a BMW on the track. You would do much better with 8.5" front and rear. Just because you can fit a wide tire doesn't mean you should.

The reason for the same sizes - square setup - is that BMWs are a little heavier in the front (nothing like an AUDI) so they need every bit as much rubber up there as they have in the back. BTW, a square setup is the best handling mod you can do and should be the first one.

The next handling mod should camber. Here's an excerpt from the above linked article:

Benefits of Negative Camber[/SIZE]
Additional negative camber balances a BMWs handling and significantly increases its performance. Racers typically run an additional -1 degree of camber on the front compared to the rear, sometimes more. From the factory, BMWs typically have +2 degrees more camber in the front compared to the rear. Although this is done to give you early warning in the front tires when you’re going a little too fast in corners it biases grip to the rear tires. By adding negative camber to the front you can more perfectly balance a BMW’s handling by creating similar levels of grip, front and rear.

Wider front tires also contribute to perfectly balanced handling on a BMW. If you want to run aggressively wide tires in the front, negative camber (commonly referred to as “more camber”) is almost always necessary to help clear the front fender by tucking the wheel under it.

JMK007 and I have both taken our F30s to the track and we both drove them hard. He has a review of his and I think I posted my thoughts also. I won't be competing with mine but JMK007 will. He and I have talked on the phone and I can see he knows what he's talking about and I would pay attention to what he has to say.

My car is an AWD 335, if I track my car a lot should I go with the square set up even its AWD? What do you recommend 18x8.5 or 18x9 all around? Is same off set better? What tire size well be great? Thanks in advance!

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by jetbill

That's exactly were I also found was the sweet spot..

Did the tire pressure on the display come with your car, or did you code that? My 2013 doesn't have that and I'd really like to have that

Thanks for the info on the hot tire pressures for the stock RFT. My car was around 44-46psi and that was too much. Car was understeering everywhere. And the tires (contisportcontact5) started chunking after 1 session

[DVC]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

Did the tire pressure on the display come with your car, or did you code that? My 2013 doesn't have that and I'd really like to have that

Thanks for the info on the hot tire pressures for the stock RFT. My car was around 44-46psi and that was too much. Car was understeering everywhere. And the tires (contisportcontact5) started chunking after 1 session

You have to get it coded to display tire temps/pressures. BMW likes to reserve this info for their 7 series - what a waste on a car that will never see the track.

Definitely keep those run flats under 40psi hot.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by DVC

You have to get it coded to display tire temps/pressures. BMW likes to reserve this info for their 7 series - what a waste on a car that will never see the track.

Definitely keep those run flats under 40psi hot.

Thanks for the info.

The main take away was I'm not going to bother tracking the 335 anymore.

It is my wife's daily, and it is a "sport line" car without the extra cooling, so the oil got to 280F+, car felt like it was going into power reduction, and the tires had so little grip (and I am not going to risk leaving her stranded by switching to non RFT)

Pretty disappointing, but not unexpected.

If I was going to order a 335 for myself, I would definitely get the m sport package with m sport brakes and switch out the tires ASAP (to the Dunlop ZII star spec, etc)

[drob23]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

Thanks for the info.

The main take away was I'm not going to bother tracking the 335 anymore.

It is my wife's daily, and it is a "sport line" car without the extra cooling, so the oil got to 280F+, car felt like it was going into power reduction, and the tires had so little grip (and I am not going to risk leaving her stranded by switching to non RFT)

Pretty disappointing, but not unexpected.

If I was going to order a 335 for myself, I would definitely get the m sport package with m sport brakes and switch out the tires ASAP (to the Dunlop ZII star spec, etc)

M-sport brake upgrade is one of the best options (for the value that is) I've seen on a sporty car in a while.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by drob23

M-sport brake upgrade is one of the best options (for the value that is) I've seen on a sporty car in a while.

Agreed. The cost of bigger brakes + more cooling from the aftermarket makes it almost like you are getting a free body kit and wheels from BMW

[Cyberdemon]

Bumping this -

What would you guys suggest as a starter track tire for an 18x8" wheel vs 8.5"? I already have them from my snow wheels so I am thinking to re purpose them as track rims rather than buying another set or trying to use the staggered 19's on my Msport.

Are 245/40/18's too wide for the 18x8s at the limits?

[Burnt C6]

I'm running Apex 18x9 et 42 on mine also. I have Dinan Springs installed so she is .75" lower than stock. Auto X I run 255/35 18 Dunlop Zll's with a 5mm spacer. No problem with my M Brakes clearing at all.
pic just sitting still


on the track in the Slalom section



The Sway Bars are not installed yet.

[Expert@ApexWheels]

Originally Posted by Cyberdemon

Bumping this -

What would you guys suggest as a starter track tire for an 18x8" wheel vs 8.5"? I already have them from my snow wheels so I am thinking to re purpose them as track rims rather than buying another set or trying to use the staggered 19's on my Msport.

Are 245/40/18's too wide for the 18x8s at the limits?

The 245/40/18 tires would be quite wide for an 8" width wheel, and depending on your tire's make and model, may cause the sidewalls to bubble out a bit, leading to the steering to feel a bit sloppy. We'd recommend the 245 on at least an 8.5" width wheel, and a 235 on the 8" wheel instead.

[Cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by David@ApexRaceParts

The 245/40/18 tires would be quite wide for an 8" width wheel, and depending on your tire's make and model, may cause the sidewalls to bubble out a bit, leading to the steering to feel a bit sloppy. We'd recommend the 245 on at least an 8.5" width wheel, and a 235 on the 8" wheel instead.

Thanks, do you think there are any 245's that might work better (with a stiffer sidewall?) just wondering if I can get away with it without buying a new set of wheels.

For 235's would you go with a 40 profile or 45? Looks like the 45 profile is closer to stock in terms of size but looking on Tire rack it seems to have much fewer options for the extreme performance summers.