02-16-2013, 09:15 AM | #67 | |
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From a price/performance point of view, B3 is the best choice among 335i and M3. |
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02-16-2013, 09:35 AM | #68 |
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Alpina and BMW have an agreement that prevents additional Alpina models being sold in the US. An M3 and B3 would be too close for comfort especially in price comparison.
Alpinas success is down to its exclusivity. Performance In a tailor made suit. Whereas the equivalent M is the mass produced designer suit. An Alpina customer knows that he won't see the same car on the next street.
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02-16-2013, 10:06 AM | #69 | |
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They assembly parts like the cooling package into kits and truck it to where it is being built (Dingolfing for example) where the Alpina is assembled and painted on the regular line- the rest as I noted above is completed at Alpina. Alpina is considered a manufacturer in Germany because they create their own engines and they have a Tüv approved emissions lab (where they certify cars like Weissman). They also ALWAYS use the BMW Roundel on the hood and trunk. The ZF transmission they currently use (8HP) has patented components and methods that are Alpina exclusive so they are not used elsewhere. This engine is based on the N55 and is based on advances M had made with the S55... (Below is bench testing the 8HP, the cooling packs being crated for shipment and a B6 that returned from BMW to have the aero/exhaust and wheels swapped out). and yes they reuse the base components that get swapped out over and over again!!!)
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Last edited by mapezzul; 02-16-2013 at 10:17 AM.. |
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02-16-2013, 10:25 AM | #70 |
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They get the "code" from BMW and work their own as well as developing their own solutions for the power and how they obtain it. They have a state of the art engine development center and test the snot out of these things all over the place/ BMW facilities and leased rights elsewhere. They truly build these things rock solid.
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02-16-2013, 11:37 AM | #71 | |
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We talking current M3? Next gen M3? Next gen M3 would hose this car. |
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02-16-2013, 12:37 PM | #72 | |
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0-100 km/h: 4.5 sec / 4.5 sec 0-200 km/h: 15.4 sec / 15.6 sec 1/4 mile: 12.68 sec / 12.67 sec l/100 km: 11.0 l / 13.0 l Base price: € 61.200 / € 66.400 Sachsenring: 1:40.93 min / 1:40.52 min Source: Auto Bild Sportscars Nr. 11, 2010 Nough said. |
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02-16-2013, 12:43 PM | #73 | |
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SOLD: 2012 335i Mineral Gray M Performance Exhaust/Brakes/Suspension/LSD|Bav Stage 1/AMP||ER CP/IC/DP/OC | Dinan CAI/N55 PWG BIG TURBO|BMWF30.com |
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02-16-2013, 03:06 PM | #75 | |
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02-16-2013, 08:02 PM | #76 | |
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02-17-2013, 03:01 AM | #77 |
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Your are saying the M3 E9X was a bad car, that is why the B3 E9X was so close to it, but now the M3 F8X will be a good car, so the B3 F3X will not be that close to it?
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02-17-2013, 05:21 AM | #78 |
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I thought only the B7 was only available in North America?
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02-17-2013, 05:32 AM | #79 | |
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And Alpina does not only work on the engine, but the whole package (engine, cooling, interior, trim, exterior, transmission, ...) plus you get something exclusive, AND YOU GET FACTORY WARRANTY !! So I would care ! |
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02-17-2013, 07:08 AM | #80 |
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You are correct.
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02-17-2013, 11:11 AM | #81 | |
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Let's be clear, the F30 Alpina B3 only gains 10hp over the previous model with more or less the same engine/power delivery profile, and the car doesn't weigh substantially different from the previous version most likely. A low 5500rpm horsepower peak indicates boost is being tapered off at higher rpms. It does however get the 8 speed tranny which will help performance a tad no doubt. The new F8x M3 will have a completely different engine setup and power delivery profile than the previous M3, not to mention they're targeting a noticeable weight reduction for the car. There's no reason this car can't come in 150-200lbs lighter than the Alpina. With all these changes, and a still unknown final power figure, it's an apples to oranges comparison, but also premature right now to say that because the E9x B3 was better bang for your buck than say the e9x M3, the same will be true with the F3x B3 vs. the F8x M3. |
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02-17-2013, 12:49 PM | #82 | |
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I said that in regard to those discrediting the Alpina. It is a better choice than a 335i if you can get it. No tuned 335i will be better than the Alpina, so let alone comparing 335i to M3. (taking about F30/F80) |
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02-17-2013, 12:59 PM | #83 |
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trying to understand the point of the apples and oranges comparison, that's all...
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02-17-2013, 01:30 PM | #84 |
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02-17-2013, 02:52 PM | #85 | ||
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Also, we don't know that it will be the same engine as the N54. No details about the engine have been released yet, but there are rumours that it is based on the F80 M3 engine which will most likely be a N54 with valvetronic and twin scroll, i.e. a mixture between the N54 and N55 engines. Alpina will certainly not re-use the N54, as this engine is not efficient enough any longer and fuel efficiency is something that Alpina is prioritizing due to marketing strategies. A straight six biturbo engine with valvetronic and twin scroll will be stronger than the N54 and have better fuel efficiency. IMO it will probably boil down to a similar situation as we are already seeing right now with the M5 / B5 Biturbo, which are very similar in power but differentiate themselves mainly through suspension and clutch setups. Quote:
I disagree with you that the new M3 F80 will be substantially lighter than the F30 Alpina. They will share the same chassis, and without heavy use of carbon fibre (which is excluded for cost reasons) a substantial weight reduction seems very unlikely for me to achieve. Granted, the new M3 biturbo engine will be lighter than the previous V8 (but also have to feature a water-to-air intercooler and other mechanics for the two turbos), and as previously they'll use a CF roof and lots of aluminium in the suspension. But that *might* gain 100lbs if compared to a 335i / Alpina B3, which in this weight class is negligble. Just look at the M3 CRT - even with the use of carbon fibre the weight reduction was almost non-existent. I'd love to be pleasantly surprised, but the last few years have not given any indication that BMW sees weight reduction on mass-production cars as a priority (at present). Alpina_B3_Lux
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02-17-2013, 03:03 PM | #86 |
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02-17-2013, 03:29 PM | #87 | ||||
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Carbon fiber has gotten a lot cheaper of late, so I wouldn't be surprised to see BMW increasing its use of it....and BMW is currently partnering with BMW to improve carbon fiber manufacturing/recycling techniques. Quote:
From that linked article: Quote:
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02-17-2013, 03:32 PM | #88 |
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