01-28-2013, 06:56 PM | #133 | |
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01-28-2013, 07:01 PM | #134 | ||
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It's a drivers race at the end of the day, 2s is so close that a mistake from any driver will change the result significantly. You can't go wrong with either one. Can't believe it took me two Infiniti Gs to join the twin turbo party lol.
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01-28-2013, 07:12 PM | #135 |
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Your car is a single turbo, a twin scroll. The n54 was a twin turbo.
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01-28-2013, 07:26 PM | #136 | |
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e36 - length 174.5 in e46 - length 176.0 in e92 - length 178.2 in f30 - length 182.0 in For reference the e39 5 series was 185.8 in Appears like the car is getting bigger and more luxurious. Whether this is a good or bad thing is for another debate.
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01-28-2013, 07:50 PM | #137 |
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BMW are mainly built as RWD and AWD is added as after thought (though may be at pretty early stage). So it has advantages of RWD car with good front / rear weight distribution. AWD may not add much to dynamics unless there is traction issue (eg at launch) and add to wt. of the car at front axle
Audi has much to gain from AWD as its models are usually front heavy and sending power to rear helps it drive like RWD But I doubt quattro is more performance oriented as compared to xdrive since they are both full time all wheel drive always providing some power (40% to front axle in quattro and if I remember correctly 30% in xdrive) to front axle and changing it as needed. The sports differential at rear (clutch based ) is an added option and is not standard in S models. It definitely give advantage when coming out of corners as it transfer power to outer wheel. At the end of the day S4 is more powerful which alone explains the performance advantage. |
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01-28-2013, 07:53 PM | #138 | |
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01-28-2013, 08:02 PM | #139 | |
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01-28-2013, 08:07 PM | #140 | |
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In general, a torque sensing differential is preferable to an electronic one, which require more advanced controller implementations that normal vehicle ecu's don't provide. Piggybacking the AWD controller on the ABS computer is not going to work very well in performance situations. The "advanced" AWD control systems often find themselves on expensive dedicated platforms, such as GT-R, Evo, STI - where people are paying a premium for AWD. I don't think that quattro is really in the category with those, but I do think it's superior to xdrive and other clutched awd systems commonly seen like haldex.
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01-28-2013, 08:57 PM | #141 |
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This is like comparing g37 to 335i, instead it's in the other direction. You can get a g37 for much less than a 335i, and a 335i for much less than an s4. (This is at least true for socal, each being a $6k price diff.)
Things you'll still have to trade off though: 1) Fuel Economy (18/28 vs 23/33) 2) Smaller back seat 3) Reliability (ref. consumer reports) 4) Depreciation (ref. consumer reports) BMW is more well rounded now. So what if it can't beat an s4 on the track, it does everything else way better. If i wanted a track car i'd get an M3, I need a DD. Which is why BMW won me over. |
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01-28-2013, 09:21 PM | #142 | |
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01-28-2013, 09:35 PM | #143 | |
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I was just going off of what Consumer reports had listed since they have easy side by side comparo's which is unbiased and very critical. |
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01-28-2013, 10:29 PM | #144 | |
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Also like I said BMW uses the S4 type AWD on it's X6M with the sport diff and if BMW's M division acknowledges a mechanical AWD system is better than BMW's Xdrive it should be good enough for you to accept it. If you don't than that is your problem. |
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01-28-2013, 11:02 PM | #145 |
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Before my e92 I had an 07 A4. Had it for 6 years was an excellent car and got basically 50% of its value back when it was sold. The BMW is a great car but the audi was really well built and had a quality feel you notice after driving many cars. People will have lemons regardless. You buy a car for your needs, BMWs drive different then Audis and thats ok there both great cars!
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01-28-2013, 11:27 PM | #146 | |
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2. The difference between quatrro vs xdrive comes down to how fast xdrive acts and nobody has hard facts on that except their own expert opinion. 3. My point was xdrive is unlikely to provide advantage to 3 series unless there is left/right torque vectoring which will help in cornering. S4 need for awd and that optional rear sport deferential is more because of poor wt distribution front/back. Can you also provide reference regarding your M division quote. Last edited by addm; 01-28-2013 at 11:48 PM.. |
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01-29-2013, 08:08 AM | #147 | |
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With that said, it is a well known fact that the biggest performance barrier for an AWD car is understeer. The rear sports differential in the S4 and X6/MX5/MX6 is a pretty cool way to combat this. Does it turn the S4 into an M3 sans V8? No way, it's still an AWD car. It really all comes down to personal preference. I live in the snow belt and need AWD because I can't afford a DD and weekend toy. The BMW IMO should be driven in the RWD variant, so I ultimately went with the S4. If I was still in college down in SoCal (ugg do I miss the SB beach), I'd probably be driving a 335i. Was this based on scientific fact, of course not, just how I felt about it. Now this doesn't mean that I don't enjoy the after the fact debate , it's fun learning about this and doing the research - just wish there was better information out there.
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01-29-2013, 08:45 AM | #148 | |
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01-29-2013, 09:00 AM | #149 |
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[QUOTE=nal13;13388509]Not really sure where consumer reports getting those resale values from. Its hard to touch a good used B8 S4 for less then 40 K. Just went on kelly blue book at checked my cars value against one of my buddies who has the same year 335 x drive sedan. The sticker on my car was just over 52 K and that includes all the options listed in my signature. My buddy bought a fully loaded 335 x drive with a sticker of 58K, paid 52K. Assuming both cars are in very good condition, the blue book on my S4 37.5K and his BMW is 30 K even. The audi had a depreciation of 28.5% from MSRP compared to 48.3% on the BMW. That is huge!!! The S4 holds it value better.[/QUOTE]
Probably because of BMW reliability (lack of) and their constant discounting, particularly at year end. |
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01-29-2013, 09:05 AM | #150 | |
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[QUOTE=335BBS;13390594]
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01-29-2013, 09:35 AM | #151 |
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[QUOTE=shivaswrath;13390616]Good point. Probably right. I just tried to bail out of my lease...new ones are cheaper!! BMW residual was out by about $8000 too. I sold it and ate the difference. No more BMW.
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01-29-2013, 11:13 AM | #152 | |
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Try Canadian Black Book which is much more accurate for used car values. This is the reference used by most dealers. Audi has for years suffered faster depreciation than BMW in Canada. The Audi market is much smaller along with their dealer network.
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01-29-2013, 12:19 PM | #153 |
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Wouldn't a 335i xDrive have a lower center of gravity than a 335i RWD since the extra drivetrain weight is low in the car?
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01-29-2013, 01:37 PM | #154 |
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Unfortunately the xi isnt offered with sport suspension. It sits higher on softer suspension than the S4. As mentioned earlier, xi was originally developed as a foul weather aid. I'mm really surprised they didnt address this with new model.
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