[wmandra]

Not sure how many others are tracking their BMW's with the N20, but figured I'd share some of my findings as it relates to oil pressure. I track my Z4 pretty heavily and in July had a bit of a surprise when running the Pocono Southeast course during MPACT when the car threw several codes related to intake and exhaust camshaft / crankshaft correlation faults. These codes are sets when the camshaft is not in the correct position due to a timing issue. The most common cause is a problem with the VANOS system. Since I hadn't seen these errors thrown previously, I decided to clear them and see if they reappeared under normal driving conditions (which they did not). This let me to believe that the most likely cause was a drop in oil pressure which caused the VANOS solenoids to be "late" vs what the DME had expected. Also, given that Pocono Southeast is comprised of mostly left turns unlike just about every other track in the Northeast, it seemed plausible that the root of the problem was caused by not enough oil in the pan at the pickup location while hard left hand cornering.

Since Pocono, I fitted an oil pressure sensor to the N20 and wired it up to my AIM MXL data logger. Then took the car out for a bit of testing at NJMP Thunderbolt to see if I could confirm my theory. I've attached images of the oil pressure sensor install (which is actually in the same location where BMW would have put a sensor in the oil filter assembly) along with screenshots of the AIM analysis measures and plots.

The first is x/y plot is oil pressure vs lateral acceleration (negative numbers are left turns), second is oil pressure vs longitudinal acceleration (negative numbers are braking) and the third is oil pressure vs RPM. These show oil pressure dropping off when either heavy breaking or turning left, I think it's coincidental that rpm's also happen to be below 3500 at the same time.

I'm not overly concerned about this as the number of samples below the 1.5 bar minimum operating oil pressure is rather low, but still planning on a solution for late November. I'll be working with a vendor that fabricates a good number of parts for BMW's on creating an oil pan baffle for the N20. The biggest challenge I think will be the fact that on non-Xdrive cars the oil pan is actually plastic, but hoping they can come up with something that will work without having to go through the effort (and expense) of manufacturing aluminum oil pans. With any luck once the prototype is fitted and tested in my car, they will start offering them for sale to anyone else who might be interested.

[JamesM3M5]

If you can get a hold of the BMW training document on the N20 engine, there is a lot of info on the pendulum sliding vane oil pump and MAP control of oil pressure and delivery rate. Additionally, the oil pump houses the balance shafts and has large plates that act as a baffle. I don't think a baffle will be very easy to fit among all that.

You may be better served using Motul 300V and maybe even a 2 or 3 quart Accusump. I always overfill the oil, as well, since there is practically no chance of oil hitting the crankshaft until you're WAY overfull. Higher sustained revs pushes more oil into the head, so overfilling is even more important when tracking.

[rustyminded]

Originally Posted by JamesM3M5

If you can get a hold of the BMW training document on the N20 engine, there is a lot of info on the pendulum sliding vane oil pump and MAP control of oil pressure and delivery rate. Additionally, the oil pump houses the balance shafts and has large plates that act as a baffle. I don't think a baffle will be very easy to fit among all that.

You may be better served using Motul 300V and maybe even a 2 or 3 quart Accusump. I always overfill the oil, as well, since there is practically no chance of oil hitting the crankshaft until you're WAY overfull. Higher sustained revs pushes more oil into the head, so overfilling is even more important when tracking.

how many quarts or liters do you put in the N20 ?! I am confused some technical data says to put 5 liters and some 5.75 liters !!

[rustyminded]

Interesting post, thanks for sharing !

[wmandra]

Originally Posted by JamesM3M5

If you can get a hold of the BMW training document on the N20 engine, there is a lot of info on the pendulum sliding vane oil pump and MAP control of oil pressure and delivery rate. Additionally, the oil pump houses the balance shafts and has large plates that act as a baffle. I don't think a baffle will be very easy to fit among all that.

You may be better served using Motul 300V and maybe even a 2 or 3 quart Accusump. I always overfill the oil, as well, since there is practically no chance of oil hitting the crankshaft until you're WAY overfull. Higher sustained revs pushes more oil into the head, so overfilling is even more important when tracking.

Accusump is not a possibility due to competition rules. I don't think it will be an issue to fit baffles into the pan to help feed the pickup. I have the N20 documentation and while the area around the pump itself is tightly packed, that isn't really where the issue is. Could just add extra oil, but that just doesn't seem like the "right" way to fix it.

[wmandra]

Originally Posted by rustyminded

how many quarts or liters do you put in the N20 ?! I am confused some technical data says to put 5 liters and some 5.75 liters !!

I routinely put in 5 quarts which shows as Full on the display.

[Stubok]

Did you ever get baffles made for the n20?

I'm very interested in getting some for my n20.

[mge92]

The issue was know before esp when it comes to cornering hard to the left. The n20 was never designed to be a track engine and even though that shouldn't be an excuse, this is def one of the flaws of the n20 engine. It will be interesting if someone does baffles for the n20.

[Stubok]

Yes GSR Technik did a lot of work setting up an N20 228i for racing and this was one of their findings. I remember asking them back then what they were going to do and dry sump or baffles were the potential answers.

Looking at the sump it's quite a complex plastic piece, so I doubt a dry sump will ever happen.

I've also heard that accusump would help, but it's not legal for racing.

I think some baffles would be the quickest and most cost effective solution. I'd definitely buy them.

[STR8-6IX]

Originally Posted by rustyminded

how many quarts or liters do you put in the N20 ?! I am confused some technical data says to put 5 liters and some 5.75 liters !!

I believe it is 5.2L.

[STR8-6IX]

At what intervals do you change your oil?

if you track your car often, 6000KM oil changes would be optimal

oil pressure issues related to BMW's lengthy OCI interval are well known on this forum.

[Stubok]

My oil change interval when my car returns from the dealer annual maintenance is 8000miles, but it quickly drops to 7000. I think the DME determines what it should be based on driving style.

I have been adding a change half way also.

I just went Stage 2 Turbo, so Now I I'm about to change the BMW LL01 0W-30 for Motul 8100 X-Cess 5W-40 (also BMW approved LL01). I'm pretty much using the stock oil as a flush. Plan to drive 1000 miles on it and dump it and then go to new Motul every 3000. So BMW LL01 + 2 Motul changes makes my up 7000mile replacement.

At about $100 for each replacement (oil + Filter/seal kit) it's well worth it.

I'm going to eventually go Forged bottom end, and will keep this oil routine up.

wmandra I still would also like to know if you ever had baffles made?

[D041987]

Any news on the Baffles?

[e90reborn]

following up

[bbnks2]

Buy a $50 3gpm oil pump and use it to pump oil from the front of the pan to the rear like BMW does on the M-cars.

A baffle would help too but not as much as the pump will. Definitely run 1qt over at the track too since oil drainage will always be an issue with the forces you see at the track.

[qualicas]

I just recently bought an F10 538ix with a toasted engine. Timing chain skipped over the intake sprocket and rounded it off. Digging deeper I find that the intake cam bearings are badly scored. Intake cam won't turn over when I slowly turn engine over with a wrench. Pulling oil pan off I found the oil pick up screen plugged with sludge and small plastic bits. The previous owner was just driving on the highway and got low oil pressure light and engine stopped.
Does anyone realize that the oil pick up screen on these engines is 1" in dia! (size of a quarter) I have never seen anything that small. Then if you do 15K miles between oil changes and any sludge collects, it will plug that tiny screen and it is new engine time. Plus the screen has a lip around 3 sides so oil can only get in one way, from the back. I don't know if that lip sits on the bottom of the oil pan or if it is some distance above. I will check. No matter though the screen is pathetically small. I found this post as I was looking for someone that makes a larger aftermarket pick up!

[sspade]

@qualicas

Keep us posted on engine overhaul. Maybe start your own thread and share photos along the way (if you dont mind).

[rjd_F30]

Originally Posted by sspade

@qualicas

Keep us posted on engine overhaul. Maybe start your own thread and share photos along the way (if you dont mind).

+1 I would love to see your engine rebuild get it's own thread if you're willing

[take1step]

Originally Posted by qualicas

I just recently bought an F10 538ix with a toasted engine. Timing chain skipped over the intake sprocket and rounded it off. Digging deeper I find that the intake cam bearings are badly scored. Intake cam won't turn over when I slowly turn engine over with a wrench. Pulling oil pan off I found the oil pick up screen plugged with sludge and small plastic bits. The previous owner was just driving on the highway and got low oil pressure light and engine stopped.
Does anyone realize that the oil pick up screen on these engines is 1" in dia! (size of a quarter) I have never seen anything that small. Then if you do 15K miles between oil changes and any sludge collects, it will plug that tiny screen and it is new engine time. Plus the screen has a lip around 3 sides so oil can only get in one way, from the back. I don't know if that lip sits on the bottom of the oil pan or if it is some distance above. I will check. No matter though the screen is pathetically small. I found this post as I was looking for someone that makes a larger aftermarket pick up!

I'm currently rebuilding my engine for a different reason, but thought it would be relevant to post a picture of the stock oil pick up. I'm still looking for a solution for this problem as well, it seems like more frequent oil changes is the solution (other than a dry sump system $$$$).

[Stubok]

Originally Posted by take1step

I'm currently rebuilding my engine for a different reason, but thought it would be relevant to post a picture of the stock oil pick up. I'm still looking for a solution for this problem as well, it seems like more frequent oil changes is the solution (other than a dry sump system $$$$).

I got to speak to Steve Dinan about the n20 built race engines they have for sale and he told me that they came up with an oil pan design that has 2 extra quarts capacity, baffles and a lengthened and repositioned oil pickup that prevents any starvation.

I asked if we could setup a production run for the pans and pickup tubes but never heard back.

If you want to call them and ask the same question, maybe we can setup a reasonable group buy.

If not, perhaps they would share some info on the design... one can hope.

[take1step]

Originally Posted by Stubok

I got to speak to Steve Dinan about the n20 built race engines they have for sale and he told me that they came up with an oil pan design that has 2 extra quarts capacity, baffles and a lengthened and repositioned oil pickup that prevents any starvation.

I asked if we could setup a production run for the pans and pickup tubes but never heard back.

If you want to call them and ask the same question, maybe we can setup a reasonable group buy.

If not, perhaps they would share some info on the design... one can hope.

I spoke to them a few months ago as well, when I was trying to decide what route I was going to take with my build. The conversation was short lived because firstly, they don’t have any of these built engine left and second, when I asked about their baffled oil pan, they told me it was designed only for the RWD cars, I have an X drive.

It might be worth a call back. It was unclear whether they were interested in selling them. Yes, some more information on the design would be great as well.

[lonecitizenfour]

I'm in!