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      10-06-2017, 07:52 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by Mr. Tasty View Post
Fair enough, but anecdotal evidence doesn't make things true, likewise.
One persons actual experience is better than yours that is just plucked out of thin air.

Plenty of enthusiasts in the UK lease because from time to time there are some amazingly deals out there, that just don't exist if you buy. A good example was a couple of years ago where you could lease an Audi S8 for less than 500 a month.

My own experience is that I take the best deal possible at the time for the car that i want, whether that be lease, pcp or cash. All said, it will be the same car sat on my driveway, what do I care which way I pay for it.
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      10-06-2017, 12:49 PM   #90
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Quick side comment - after reading this whole thread it's completely bewildering the arguing and hostility towards somebody choosing a different brand vehicle. For the many years I have been a car enthusiast it meant the appreciation for all cars and alike...not just one brand. I myself have owned many BMW's and M cars over the years but have no problem appreciating other brands, especially the RS models which have a very proven history along with M cars, and AMG models.

I find that generally there's brand snobs and then there's car enthusiasts. Unfortunately, BMW owners get a bad rap because of exactly this...the BMW snobs that walk around with their nose in the air because they have a 328i or 335i (hint: owning the most entry level BMW doesn't make one special). Most commonly those are the people that have something to prove or generally insecure about their purchase. That seems to be about 95% of everyone in this thread.

I myself have always liked the RS3 and RS4, although I never owned one and chose the M3 route instead. However, that goes without saying at least in the climate I live in the AWD is far more advantageous than perfect 50/50 weight distribution. Anyhow, good luck to the OP, considering the fact this car nearly runs neck and neck with an M3 is impressive. Also, the fact with a tune it's already been shown to run 10's damn near stock...this is going to break open a whole new realm of performance.
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      10-06-2017, 01:56 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quick side comment - after reading this whole thread it's completely bewildering the arguing and hostility towards somebody choosing a different brand vehicle. For the many years I have been a car enthusiast it meant the appreciation for all cars and alike...not just one brand. I myself have owned many BMW's and M cars over the years but have no problem appreciating other brands, especially the RS models which have a very proven history along with M cars, and AMG models.

I find that generally there's brand snobs and then there's car enthusiasts. Unfortunately, BMW owners get a bad rap because of exactly this...the BMW snobs that walk around with their nose in the air because they have a 328i or 335i (hint: owning the most entry level BMW doesn't make one special). Most commonly those are the people that have something to prove or generally insecure about their purchase. That seems to be about 95% of everyone in this thread.

I myself have always liked the RS3 and RS4, although I never owned one and chose the M3 route instead. However, that goes without saying at least in the climate I live in the AWD is far more advantageous than perfect 50/50 weight distribution. Anyhow, good luck to the OP, considering the fact this car nearly runs neck and neck with an M3 is impressive. Also, the fact with a tune it's already been shown to run 10's damn near stock...this is going to break open a whole new realm of performance.
I was totally with you until knocking the entry level. There are enthusiasts and snobs at all price points. But I guess no one is special was maybe your point.. ?
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      10-06-2017, 02:28 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by metallicpea View Post
I was totally with you until knocking the entry level. There are enthusiasts and snobs at all price points. But I guess no one is special was maybe your point.. ?
My point is to not knock the entry level...I own an "entry level" 3-series as well. My point was generally the people I see that are most vocal about their brand loyalty or have a snobish outlook on other brands are generally the 3-series owners. I assume because for many years that our 3-series were generally the benchmark and now most brands have caught up or surpassed BMW in this regard. It seems many owners can't fathom this and have to express their hatred towards the other brands and all the short coming they have.

You are right their are snobs at all price point and it's arguably worse the higher you go. I think the 3-series market of $40-60k is probably the most competitive though as they are the highest selling. In this day and age people have the insecurity of trying to prove their purchase to other brand loyalists.

Although, maybe a bad example but in this case the OP went from a 335i to a RS3. For all intensive purposes they are a similarly price vehicle with the RS3 being slightly more expensive and a better performing vehicle. Now take for example M3 or M5 owners that move up to slightly more expensive P-cars...how many forum members do you see having the same reaction? Again, maybe not a perfect example but my point remains that owners in this price point and market seem to have much more to prove compared to many of the true car enthusiasts that appreciate more than one single brand. I think once people have had the opportunity to own each of these performance models (or brands) you find there is strengths and weaknesses to all of them and the division on what's superior becomes a difficult point to substantiate.
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      10-06-2017, 02:31 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metallicpea View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quick side comment - after reading this whole thread it's completely bewildering the arguing and hostility towards somebody choosing a different brand vehicle. For the many years I have been a car enthusiast it meant the appreciation for all cars and alike...not just one brand. I myself have owned many BMW's and M cars over the years but have no problem appreciating other brands, especially the RS models which have a very proven history along with M cars, and AMG models.

I find that generally there's brand snobs and then there's car enthusiasts. Unfortunately, BMW owners get a bad rap because of exactly this...the BMW snobs that walk around with their nose in the air because they have a 328i or 335i (hint: owning the most entry level BMW doesn't make one special). Most commonly those are the people that have something to prove or generally insecure about their purchase. That seems to be about 95% of everyone in this thread.

I myself have always liked the RS3 and RS4, although I never owned one and chose the M3 route instead. However, that goes without saying at least in the climate I live in the AWD is far more advantageous than perfect 50/50 weight distribution. Anyhow, good luck to the OP, considering the fact this car nearly runs neck and neck with an M3 is impressive. Also, the fact with a tune it's already been shown to run 10's damn near stock...this is going to break open a whole new realm of performance.
I was totally with you until knocking the entry level. There are enthusiasts and snobs at all price points. But I guess no one is special was maybe your point.. ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quick side comment - after reading this whole thread it's completely bewildering the arguing and hostility towards somebody choosing a different brand vehicle. For the many years I have been a car enthusiast it meant the appreciation for all cars and alike...not just one brand. I myself have owned many BMW's and M cars over the years but have no problem appreciating other brands, especially the RS models which have a very proven history along with M cars, and AMG models.

I find that generally there's brand snobs and then there's car enthusiasts. Unfortunately, BMW owners get a bad rap because of exactly this...the BMW snobs that walk around with their nose in the air because they have a 328i or 335i (hint: owning the most entry level BMW doesn't make one special). Most commonly those are the people that have something to prove or generally insecure about their purchase. That seems to be about 95% of everyone in this thread.

I myself have always liked the RS3 and RS4, although I never owned one and chose the M3 route instead. However, that goes without saying at least in the climate I live in the AWD is far more advantageous than perfect 50/50 weight distribution. Anyhow, good luck to the OP, considering the fact this car nearly runs neck and neck with an M3 is impressive. Also, the fact with a tune it's already been shown to run 10's damn near stock...this is going to break open a whole new realm of performance.
Quote:
Originally Posted by metallicpea View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quick side comment - after reading this whole thread it's completely bewildering the arguing and hostility towards somebody choosing a different brand vehicle. For the many years I have been a car enthusiast it meant the appreciation for all cars and alike...not just one brand. I myself have owned many BMW's and M cars over the years but have no problem appreciating other brands, especially the RS models which have a very proven history along with M cars, and AMG models.

I find that generally there's brand snobs and then there's car enthusiasts. Unfortunately, BMW owners get a bad rap because of exactly this...the BMW snobs that walk around with their nose in the air because they have a 328i or 335i (hint: owning the most entry level BMW doesn't make one special). Most commonly those are the people that have something to prove or generally insecure about their purchase. That seems to be about 95% of everyone in this thread.

I myself have always liked the RS3 and RS4, although I never owned one and chose the M3 route instead. However, that goes without saying at least in the climate I live in the AWD is far more advantageous than perfect 50/50 weight distribution. Anyhow, good luck to the OP, considering the fact this car nearly runs neck and neck with an M3 is impressive. Also, the fact with a tune it's already been shown to run 10's damn near stock...this is going to break open a whole new realm of performance.
I was totally with you until knocking the entry level. There are enthusiasts and snobs at all price points. But I guess no one is special was maybe your point.. ?
Thanks guys, yes I'm an enthusiast first and always...

Contour SVT-> Mitsu Evo-> had a kid got an Acura RDX-> 335i with all the M performance goodies that really got me into HPDE-> Audi RS3.

I wished the tech and tightness of the RS3 didn't in my opinion surpass this gen of M3, but I'm sure BMW will come strong next G body style.

And yes the fact that a DP and tune could put a stock RS3 into 10s makes it a tuners paradise and modern day RS4. (The inline 5 sound also helps!)

I'll post some pics for the enthusiasts (and to annoy the fan boys!)
.
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      10-06-2017, 02:48 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shivaswrath View Post
Thanks guys, yes I'm an enthusiast first and always...

Contour SVT-> Mitsu Evo-> had a kid got an Acura RDX-> 335i with all the M performance goodies that really got me into HPDE-> Audi RS3.

I wished the tech and tightness of the RS3 didn't in my opinion surpass this gen of M3, but I'm sure BMW will come strong next G body style.

And yes the fact that a DP and tune could put a stock RS3 into 10s makes it a tuners paradise and modern day RS4. (The inline 5 sound also helps!)

I'll post some pics for the enthusiasts (and to annoy the fan boys!)
.
I thought I recognized your username from the EvoM boards? I had a IX MR for about 6yrs when they first came out back in 06. It was such a great car, they just don't make them like that anymore. From a performance and handling standpoint I still feel that car was sublime.

Moved onto my E92 M3 which was an equally awesome car. Had a kid myself so the 2-door had to go and I wasn't quiet sold on the F80's yet. I regret selling both of those to be honest, although the 340i is a great all around car it lacks the sharpness of the true M cars. However, from what I've seen the RS3 seems to be the more expensive new age Evo. The Focus RS tried to fill that roll but not sure it made the impact that Ford had hope for.
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      10-06-2017, 02:59 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by metallicpea View Post
I was totally with you until knocking the entry level. There are enthusiasts and snobs at all price points. But I guess no one is special was maybe your point.. ?
My point is to not knock the entry level...I own an "entry level" 3-series as well. My point was generally the people I see that are most vocal about their brand loyalty or have a snobish outlook on other brands are generally the 3-series owners. I assume because for many years that our 3-series were generally the benchmark and now most brands have caught up or surpassed BMW in this regard. It seems many owners can't fathom this and have to express their hatred towards the other brands and all the short coming they have.

You are right their are snobs at all price point and it's arguably worse the higher you go. I think the 3-series market of $40-60k is probably the most competitive though as they are the highest selling. In this day and age people have the insecurity of trying to prove their purchase to other brand loyalists.

Although, maybe a bad example but in this case the OP went from a 335i to a RS3. For all intensive purposes they are a similarly price vehicle with the RS3 being slightly more expensive and a better performing vehicle. Now take for example M3 or M5 owners that move up to slightly more expensive P-cars...how many forum members do you see having the same reaction? Again, maybe not a perfect example but my point remains that owners in this price point and market seem to have much more to prove compared to many of the true car enthusiasts that appreciate more than one single brand. I think once people have had the opportunity to own each of these performance models (or brands) you find there is strengths and weaknesses to all of them and the division on what's superior becomes a difficult point to substantiate.
Pretty bold statement to say 3 series owners are insecure. I myself was perfectly fine with the OP getting a RS3, hell, I even owned a S4 from my previous car. Just because there are some folks who are brand loyal doesn't make all of us brand loyal and total dicks. I get what you're saying but you could have omitted that part. Doesn't serve your purpose to point and call people out.
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      10-06-2017, 03:07 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quick side comment - after reading this whole thread it's completely bewildering the arguing and hostility towards somebody choosing a different brand vehicle. For the many years I have been a car enthusiast it meant the appreciation for all cars and alike...not just one brand. I myself have owned many BMW's and M cars over the years but have no problem appreciating other brands, especially the RS models which have a very proven history along with M cars, and AMG models.

I find that generally there's brand snobs and then there's car enthusiasts. Unfortunately, BMW owners get a bad rap because of exactly this...the BMW snobs that walk around with their nose in the air because they have a 328i or 335i (hint: owning the most entry level BMW doesn't make one special). Most commonly those are the people that have something to prove or generally insecure about their purchase. That seems to be about 95% of everyone in this thread.

I myself have always liked the RS3 and RS4, although I never owned one and chose the M3 route instead. However, that goes without saying at least in the climate I live in the AWD is far more advantageous than perfect 50/50 weight distribution. Anyhow, good luck to the OP, considering the fact this car nearly runs neck and neck with an M3 is impressive. Also, the fact with a tune it's already been shown to run 10's damn near stock...this is going to break open a whole new realm of performance.
You saying owning a 3 series doesn't make you special.. and I agree. They're all over the place but does owning, say a M car or "not so entry" level car make it ok or more acceptable to be a snob?

People like what they like and it'll always be like that. Doesn't matter if he went from Audi to BMW or Honda to Audi. There will always be diehards.. just seems weird to me that you'd make it a point to target a specific type of car to be held responsible for the negative feelings on this thread. You're on the 3/4 series subsection of the forum.. it's expected to have mostly those owners discuss the topic on here if this is where you're getting your sample for your observations.
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      10-06-2017, 03:16 PM   #97
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Pretty bold statement to say 3 series owners are insecure. I myself was perfectly fine with the OP getting a RS3, hell, I even owned a S4 from my previous car. Just because there are some folks who are brand loyal doesn't make all of us brand loyal and total dicks. I get what you're saying but you could have omitted that part. Doesn't serve your purpose to point and call people out.
I could have omitted it but just search through the first two pages and comments like:

- good luck understeering
- have fun breaking down
- you bought at Audi

Call it whatever you like but the superiority complex from many members is so thick you cut it with a steak knife.

I'm not saying all brand loyalists are dicks...but read the last 5 pages. 80% of the comments are hating on the OP's purchase. Hell, if I were the OP I would be laughing all the way to the checkered flag because short of well driven M3 the RS3 will put any 3-series squarely in their place...this coming from a 340i owner. I'll leave it at that...I don't mean to ruffle feathers but merely to state the obvious.
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      10-06-2017, 03:21 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calvin36 View Post
Pretty bold statement to say 3 series owners are insecure. I myself was perfectly fine with the OP getting a RS3, hell, I even owned a S4 from my previous car. Just because there are some folks who are brand loyal doesn't make all of us brand loyal and total dicks. I get what you're saying but you could have omitted that part. Doesn't serve your purpose to point and call people out.
I could have omitted it but just search through the first two pages and comments like:

- good luck understeering
- have fun breaking down
- you bought at Audi

Those all come from other 3-series owners predominantly. Call it whatever you like but the superiority complex from many members is so thick you cut it with a steak knife.

I'm not saying all brand loyalists are dicks...but read the last 5 pages. 80% of the comments are hating on the OP's purchase. Hell, if I were the OP I would be laughing all the way to the checkered flag because short of well driven M3 the RS3 will put any 3-series squarely in their place...this coming from a 340i owner. I'll leave it at that...I don't mean to ruffle feathers but merely to state the obvious.
I think with anything there would be some messing around and roughing the guy up. I would like to say it's in good fun, but only the poster will know. And this is the F30 subforum so of course it'll be predominantly 3 series owners commenting on it.

Either way, RS3 is a hell of a car. People love all brands and hate all brands. lol I'm sure my S4 is worlds different from the OPs RS3. Glad they came back with the smaller RSs. Wish they would bring back the RS4 though. Loved the B7 RS4.. it was the perfect size for me. and can't go wrong with a NA V8
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      10-06-2017, 03:27 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by Calvin36 View Post
I think with anything there would be some messing around and roughing the guy up. I would like to say it's in good fun, but only the poster will know. And this is the F30 subforum so of course it'll be predominantly 3 series owners commenting on it.

Either way, RS3 is a hell of a car. People love all brands and hate all brands. lol I'm sure my S4 is worlds different from the OPs RS3. Glad they came back with the smaller RSs. Wish they would bring back the RS4 though. Loved the B7 RS4.. it was the perfect size for me. and can't go wrong with a NA V8
100% agree.

Gone are the days are good NA high revving V8's. Now if they would start bringing over the sport backs and avants. The M140i and Sportback RS3 are such nice cars. I've always liked the RS4 Avants as well. That new 2.9L TT seems to be one hell of an engine.
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      10-06-2017, 03:40 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
My point is to not knock the entry level...I own an "entry level" 3-series as well. My point was generally the people I see that are most vocal about their brand loyalty or have a snobish outlook on other brands are generally the 3-series owners. I assume because for many years that our 3-series were generally the benchmark and now most brands have caught up or surpassed BMW in this regard. It seems many owners can't fathom this and have to express their hatred towards the other brands and all the short coming they have.

You are right their are snobs at all price point and it's arguably worse the higher you go. I think the 3-series market of $40-60k is probably the most competitive though as they are the highest selling. In this day and age people have the insecurity of trying to prove their purchase to other brand loyalists.

Although, maybe a bad example but in this case the OP went from a 335i to a RS3. For all intensive purposes they are a similarly price vehicle with the RS3 being slightly more expensive and a better performing vehicle. Now take for example M3 or M5 owners that move up to slightly more expensive P-cars...how many forum members do you see having the same reaction? Again, maybe not a perfect example but my point remains that owners in this price point and market seem to have much more to prove compared to many of the true car enthusiasts that appreciate more than one single brand. I think once people have had the opportunity to own each of these performance models (or brands) you find there is strengths and weaknesses to all of them and the division on what's superior becomes a difficult point to substantiate.
Yep, something to prove is right. I really don't care at all if someone else is impressed with what I drive or not. But you are right, some really do.
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      10-06-2017, 03:48 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calvin36 View Post
I think with anything there would be some messing around and roughing the guy up. I would like to say it's in good fun, but only the poster will know. And this is the F30 subforum so of course it'll be predominantly 3 series owners commenting on it.

Either way, RS3 is a hell of a car. People love all brands and hate all brands. lol I'm sure my S4 is worlds different from the OPs RS3. Glad they came back with the smaller RSs. Wish they would bring back the RS4 though. Loved the B7 RS4.. it was the perfect size for me. and can't go wrong with a NA V8
100% agree.

Gone are the days are good NA high revving V8's. Now if they would start bringing over the sport backs and avants. The M140i and Sportback RS3 are such nice cars. I've always liked the RS4 Avants as well. That new 2.9L TT seems to be one hell of an engine.
RS4 avant was the ultimate for me for a while when I had my S4. Couldn't find one. Such an amazing car.
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      10-07-2017, 01:42 AM   #102
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I test drove Audi's in the past and always didn't like the loose/weird steering and heaviness of the car. The only Audi I liked was the A6. If I buy an Audi, it will be A6 for sure. I didn't like the latest Q7 too.

(Note, I have never driven any R variants, like RS5, R8 etc.)
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      10-07-2017, 03:51 AM   #103
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(Note, I have never driven any R variants, like RS5, R8 etc.)
You need to drive more audis before generalizing
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      10-07-2017, 07:12 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dereksM3 View Post
Quick side comment - after reading this whole thread it's completely bewildering the arguing and hostility towards somebody choosing a different brand vehicle. For the many years I have been a car enthusiast it meant the appreciation for all cars and alike...not just one brand. I myself have owned many BMW's and M cars over the years but have no problem appreciating other brands, especially the RS models which have a very proven history along with M cars, and AMG models.

I find that generally there's brand snobs and then there's car enthusiasts. Unfortunately, BMW owners get a bad rap because of exactly this...the BMW snobs that walk around with their nose in the air because they have a 328i or 335i (hint: owning the most entry level BMW doesn't make one special). Most commonly those are the people that have something to prove or generally insecure about their purchase. That seems to be about 95% of everyone in this thread.

I myself have always liked the RS3 and RS4, although I never owned one and chose the M3 route instead. However, that goes without saying at least in the climate I live in the AWD is far more advantageous than perfect 50/50 weight distribution. Anyhow, good luck to the OP, considering the fact this car nearly runs neck and neck with an M3 is impressive. Also, the fact with a tune it's already been shown to run 10's damn near stock...this is going to break open a whole new realm of performance.
Spot on, except the knock of the entry level part.

I never understood blind brand loyalty, which is a majority of BMW/AUDI/FORD/CHEVY/DODGE owners. People completely blind to anything else out there and buying because of the brand, not what is better (in both looks (subjective), amenities, etc). I jump around to what interests me. I usually come back to BMW, but I have owned other cars that I have loved because at the time, they were the better purchase for my needs/wants.
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      10-07-2017, 09:39 AM   #105
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The RS3 is a fwd economy platform with a lot of goodies. But it's still a FWD platform.

If you don't understand brand loyalty it's hard to explain. Usually boils down to, you have had good luck, you have a good sales and service staff in your area and you are used to how the brand operates. Like the how the switch gear and infotainment work, how the climate controls operate etc. Also how the cars look and feel. There are differences, a lot of people try to boil it down to objective things like measurements and performance number. But even a last place car in the comparo article can still be a better choice if thats what you want.

I was a gm guy for 15 years and the move to BMW was an adjustment.

Last edited by zinner; 10-07-2017 at 09:47 AM.
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      10-07-2017, 01:04 PM   #106
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I'm curious on your feedback, I've always been a big fan on the 5cyl. I have a 340i M-Sport now which is overall a very nice car but wouldn't mind something AWD and bit more raw. Had a MK7 Golf R and it was nice but the 340i drives better. Something in between the Golf R and 340i I think would be perfect.

Also, how is the legroom in the front? I'm 6'3 so I always felt the S3 looked a bit small. The rear seats are not really of concern for me besides sticking a forward facing child seat back there.
Almost went with an S3 and my first non-manual, but back-to-back with an F30 at 6'3 I just felt I had to angle the seat too far back to make my head fit and ended up with 340ix.
Ironically, I'm considering trading it for a Golf R or GTI. The 6-speed/B58 is fantastic, but most of my driving is twisty back roads that beckon for something a little lighter.
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      10-07-2017, 01:37 PM   #107
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The RS3 is a fwd economy platform with a lot of goodies. But it's still a FWD platform.

If you don't understand brand loyalty it's hard to explain. Usually boils down to, you have had good luck, you have a good sales and service staff in your area and you are used to how the brand operates. Like the how the switch gear and infotainment work, how the climate controls operate etc. Also how the cars look and feel. There are differences, a lot of people try to boil it down to objective things like measurements and performance number. But even a last place car in the comparo article can still be a better choice if thats what you want.

I was a gm guy for 15 years and the move to BMW was an adjustment.
True it?s been a little nose heavy...but the snappy DSG, sports exhaust, and virtual cockpit+flat bottom alcantara steering wheel help make up for it ;-)
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      10-07-2017, 01:39 PM   #108
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Yeah it?s nose heavy but I?m getting over it fast :-)

You guys feeling this rally rim look? Need help deciding on wheels (and since there a lot of opinions on this thread figure I?ll get a good voting poll).

HREs vs OZ vs Neuspeed (RSE)
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      10-07-2017, 01:49 PM   #109
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1st, Neuspeed. 2nd, HRE? OZ=NO
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      10-07-2017, 03:30 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zinner View Post
The RS3 is a fwd economy platform with a lot of goodies. But it's still a FWD platform.

If you don't understand brand loyalty it's hard to explain. Usually boils down to, you have had good luck, you have a good sales and service staff in your area and you are used to how the brand operates. Like the how the switch gear and infotainment work, how the climate controls operate etc. Also how the cars look and feel. There are differences, a lot of people try to boil it down to objective things like measurements and performance number. But even a last place car in the comparo article can still be a better choice if thats what you want.

I was a gm guy for 15 years and the move to BMW was an adjustment.
Who cares what platform it comes from when it performs so well?
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