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      03-24-2011, 01:49 PM   #23
antzcrashing
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And what is next, a 1 series sedan? To compete with Audi's A3 sedan that they are rumored to be making... What will Audi do to compete with the 4 series? They already used the A5 for their true coupe, will there be an Audi A4.5? Or Audi A5 Sedan?
there is probably going to be a 2 series. I think BMW is just trying to accomplish every number from 1 to 7.

But I do like the looks of the rendering
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      03-24-2011, 01:56 PM   #24
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there is probably going to be a 2 series. I think BMW is just trying to accomplish every number from 1 to 7.

But I do like the looks of the rendering
oh yeah now I remember, rumor is already there of a 1 series sedan and coupe, FWD though which is why they are going to use the 2 series for the RWD Coupe... Maybe the 3 series sedan will be FWD as well and thats why they are making a 4 series sedan to offer RWD and be the sport version.

hmmm, maybe they should have made the 6 series coupe the 8 series, but then there would be no number for an actual 2 door coupe priced above the 7 series sedan,

So its going to be an every number from 1-8 by 2015 as the goal! Audi will follow, oh wait have they already acheived that? I can never be sure because in the US we don't get all their products
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      03-24-2011, 02:22 PM   #25
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By all means there is no definite answer to how it can progress , all you see is actually the aspects of discussions and it is something I did mention here previously in regards to a 3er Gran Coupe.

The name is not fully compliant yet, in regards to the 6er Gran Coupe that remains a 6er and we still have not decided on the 1er/2er yet.

The idea is that a car can be born on an existing platform like introducing a Gran Coupe of the 6er, a car that actually happened by chance when the designer added extra doors to his sketch of a Coupe.

There was a sense of potential and more importantly a cost-effective opportunity to enter the mid-line Coupe Sedan segment or the CLS Segment as it is known as. Well the 3er Coupe is on a similar stage to which again nothing is final because they have ,again designed a very beautiful car, again from the ideas of the E92 it stands out from the sedan and gives it a very unique identity, just what you would expect from the designer who has penned it.

If you look at the Vision Connected Drive from the rear of the car and the side, especially at that line that runs diagonally across the body from the rear deck that is something you will see with the new car. So once again they have added "extra doors" and they are looking at it.

But it gets interesting for the 1er Gran Coupe which again is moving through the design stages with no confirmation for production.
That has been designed as a stand alone concept sharing no visual appearance with either the 1er Sporthatch or Coupe.

It's all made possible by BMW investing in modular structures that will allow several model to spun off one platform which can use the modular function to shorten , lengthen and widen for a range of models.
To break down the platform philosophy it is like Mecanno or Lego. You start with base and build and add , add and subtract.

Another point is that having the car based off the 3er matrix it is again positioned within the Premium Entry class.
Which is one of the main segments that will see more growth within this decade. Having an entire range of models is not only the wish of BMW but everyone has realigned their focus to include an expansion of models for the important segments.

Market demands for more downsized luxury cars are going to continue , BMW have realised this and now Mercedes-Benz and Audi are moving to develop expansive models from the A/C-Klasse and the A3/A4 respectively.

Within the UKL, Premium Compact and Premium Entry Class you will see a full range of automobiles covering every segment from several premium manufacturers.

If the approval for a 3er Gran Coupe goes ahead then you get your M3 Sedan replacement.
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      03-24-2011, 02:24 PM   #26
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oh yeah now I remember, rumor is already there of a 1 series sedan and coupe, FWD though which is why they are going to use the 2 series for the RWD Coupe... Maybe the 3 series sedan will be FWD as well and thats why they are making a 4 series sedan to offer RWD and be the sport version.

hmmm, maybe they should have made the 6 series coupe the 8 series, but then there would be no number for an actual 2 door coupe priced above the 7 series sedan,

So its going to be an every number from 1-8 by 2015 as the goal! Audi will follow, oh wait have they already acheived that? I can never be sure because in the US we don't get all their products
Well, BMW is lagging now. BMW only has 1,3,5,6,7 and Audi has 1,3,4,5,6,7,8
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      03-24-2011, 02:26 PM   #27
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hopefully this is just a bump on the road and not something that's going to be prevalent in the future.
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      03-24-2011, 03:51 PM   #28
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If the approval for a 3er Gran Coupe goes ahead then you get your M3 Sedan replacement.
Thanks for the input, I for one have never had an issue with all these models, I think more choices is better for all consumers, its only the hard core purists that complain everytime something other than the basics from the 80s and 90s is revealed.

I believe you are 100% correct on the move to smaller luxury/sport cars all over the world. But they need to offer the nicer options in these cars as well, why not offer something like Nappa leather in the 3 series, if people want the smaller car but all the luxuries of the 5 series and will pay for it, don't make them go up to the 5 series for that! Also if people want smaller cars again, why does every generation of cars get bigger? Its funny to see an old X5 on the road or a 5 series from the 90s because it looks like the size of a modern 3 series.

I really love the size of my C63, its not as small as I would like for sport driving (in the past I have owned a Z3M and Z4M) but now that I have kids and once in a while need to put them in my car this works perfectly. To this point I was really dissapointed when I heard there will probably not be another M3 Sedan in the future, as I wanted to make the move back to BMW as I like the handling better than the Merc and Audi just never competes in the same price range (RS).

I would be 100% okay with a M3GT or M4 though. M5 being $30K+ more than the M3 is just way out of my price range and if there is no M3 Sedan, I guess I won't be buying a BMW until my kids are older
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      03-24-2011, 04:07 PM   #29
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Anyone else thinks the MB SLS on the cover is hawt?
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      03-24-2011, 04:08 PM   #30
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Quote:
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Thanks for the input, I for one have never had an issue with all these models, I think more choices is better for all consumers, its only the hard core purists that complain everytime something other than the basics from the 80s and 90s is revealed.
+1
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      03-24-2011, 04:38 PM   #31
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+1
Totally agree. Give your sedan nice lines with some headroom and be done with it instead of making two different models.
This seems like it's meant to be one of those CLS style cars that have pretty much no back seat. It's a practical coupe-sedan. I like the idea because the 3 is becoming too "economy" and commonplace. I actually WANT to drive something that isn't practical... At 2.3" lower, this car is going to be menacing.

I bet its going to be a PREMIUM vehicle that comes in only a 50i iteration and an M iteration.
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      03-24-2011, 05:01 PM   #32
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I have no problem with BMW making cheaper cars to appeal the wider range of people. I am not a snob to think only few people should afford BMWs.
As long as BMW makes the best cars in whatever category they are developing for then i'll be happy.
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      03-24-2011, 06:31 PM   #33
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why don't they make the sedan more like coupe in design and be done with it?
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      03-24-2011, 06:52 PM   #34
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It's always good to have plenty of options for varying taste, I like the idea!
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      03-24-2011, 07:09 PM   #35
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I have no problem with BMW making cheaper cars to appeal the wider range of people. I am not a snob to think only few people should afford BMWs.
As long as BMW makes the best cars in whatever category they are developing for then i'll be happy.
+1
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      03-24-2011, 07:53 PM   #36
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does this mean a M4
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      03-24-2011, 07:56 PM   #37
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why don't they make the sedan more like coupe in design and be done with it?
Thats silly. The majority of entry-level BMW customers want a sedan like the 3 series that is practical, sporty, and luxurious. Making it like a coupe takes away the practicality factor.

I sold Volkswagen cars and the biggest complaint about the CC was that it has no headroom and the back seat was cramped. That's a 4 door coupe and they have it as a compliment to the Passat. They wouldn't replace the Passat with the CC...
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      03-24-2011, 09:40 PM   #38
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Thanks for the input
+ 2

I like the idea of a 1 gran coupe as the 1 series is a bit tall, and M3 sedan replacement is much welcomed - because I won't be able to afford an M at least until I need 4 door practicality
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      03-24-2011, 09:58 PM   #39
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If the approval for a 3er Gran Coupe goes ahead then you get your M3 Sedan replacement.
Thanks for the insights SCOTT. I remember your previous posts about about the e90 m3 being replaced with a 3er GT model. The GT would be more practical, but I prefer the aesthetics of an M3 3er Gran Coupe.

BMW could charge a premium over the regular 3er line and I suspect they will still find many buyers.
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      03-24-2011, 11:01 PM   #40
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if I could buy this or the same thing but called the 3-er Gran-Coupe, I would do it immediately.
yeah dont mind the name...this is a brilliant idea. a grancoupe for every size
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      03-25-2011, 12:32 AM   #41
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I wish someone knew.....I wish I had an answer....I am loving the watering down of the brand.
watering down the brand? this is happening across the board, everyone is trying to grow, Audi, Mercedes, even Porsche! 15 years ago no one would have thought Porsche would have a SUV, huge 4 door sedan, and mini 911s (cayman and boxster) plus plans for another smaller SUV and maybe a smaller Panamera.

Audi puts its S Line on everything and the S engines are CRAP, which barely keep up with standard BMW engines, and their RS lines are way overpriced.

Mercedes puts out an AMG version of almost every single car they make, when that is totally uncalled for and defeates the original purpose of AMG (G Wagon, really?)

BMW is just following so they can continue to compete. BMW makes money on everything they do, if they don't they stop doing it (Z4 Coupe), so you may see it as watering down, but they are just trying to stay with their competition, they don't want to lose customers because they don't have that one niche segment so they go for it all.

What car company isn't watered down? other than the mega expensive ones?
I agree 100 percent.
Even freaking Ferrari is "watered down".

Look how many versions of " cheerios" are made. Look how many Scents shampoo come in? How many Mountain Dew varieties there are. How many flavors of pringles chips, Doritos? Sandwiches at McDonalds? How about your favorite beer company?

Consumers today want variety. PERIOD.
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      03-25-2011, 05:03 AM   #42
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It's a fascinating backlash at what would seem to be something that benefits BMW consumers...choice.

If BMW has the resources to manage all these models, that is great. And due to the modular nature of modern car platforms, the engineering requirements for new models are less, whilst still avoiding a "different badge for the same platform" nonsense...GM and VW/Audi probably being the bigger offenders. But in fairness, coming from an A3 and TT, I do feel those cars are distinct from what a Golf offers, which especially in the A3, is not an easy trick to pull off. But, to me, it is different enough in the looks and feel to be considered a different car.

I hope that managers at BMW have given some thought to the Toyota debacle...its growth at all costs approach stretched its engineering and management resources too thin and created a brand damaging/customer relationships nightmare....even if the problem largely comes down to American drivers getting confused by the brake and accelerator pedals! (Audi knows a little about how this can hurt sales.)

Niche products are the upshot of leaner supply chains and more flexible manufacturing processes. My next BMW will be a custom ordered car specced to my tastes and I want it in 2 months...not the car sitting on a dock somewhere that customer research indicates X percentage of buyers will settle for. I hope BMW can deliver THAT!
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      03-25-2011, 05:26 AM   #43
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Well, i'd say, dump the 3 GT, and move on with a 3'er sedan coupe style, like VW has in the CC, which is a great design.
To move away from the 3 series badge... i'm not to sure of though, 4 series or the number 4 is like 13 in Europe and the western world, so i don't see it happening either.
Anyway, a bad move imo.
Call it a 3'er CS or something, and dump the 3 GT, it's fugly imo.
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      03-25-2011, 06:12 AM   #44
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More strangeness.
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