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      03-25-2011, 03:19 AM   #45
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Hope the bootlid is a mock-up, thing looks hideous. The rest of the car looks very nice i must admit. Even though it's still covered in the psychadelic carwrap. Let's see this car in the right colour and wheels!
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      03-25-2011, 07:01 AM   #46
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Why are people so averse to new things? If BMW had been so stuck in rut with with their thinking the range would have never diversified to give us a 4 door 3 series, a convertible 3 series, or a tourer... or even an M3..

Too many people seem to have the attitude that because they don't like a car that nobody else should be able to buy it. BMW are offering choice, and they are not taking away their core products in order to do it - whats the problem?

My biggest fear is that the 3 series in general will just be ugly... that will affect all models, not just the GT.
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      03-25-2011, 07:06 AM   #47
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THERE WONT BE AN M 3er GRAN TURISMO, M-SPORT PACKET- PROBABLY BUT NO FULL M.

So stop getting hysterical.

Quote:
"I am very scared. I dont care about 335, what I do care about is the M3. Because they won't make a sedan M3, they will make GT M3. And thats basically going to have to be my new car unless I dont buy my E90 M3 when the lease is up.

BMW, can you please drop this, just have sedan and coupe, make the new M3 perfect, and of course dont stop making M3 sedans.

Why are you changing things? When has ever any model you made had a GT version? BMW makes sedan, coupe, wagon. Period. SUV was one thing but this is too much"
As I have mentioned on countless occasions. M3 Sedan is not meeting sales targets , Plans for the M3 brand expansion aside from Coupe and Cabrio continues in related 3er platforms - X3M and very probably 3er Gran Coupe which will replace the M3 Sedan with an M Variant with four doors. 3er Gran Coupe like the 6er Gran Coupe is a 3er coupe with extra doors, several inches lower than the sedan.

There will not be a 3er GT M. So Relax.

Contrary to the enthusiast population... BMW does know what it is doing..
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      03-25-2011, 08:24 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
Contrary to the enthusiast population... BMW does know what it is doing..


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      03-25-2011, 09:35 AM   #49
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I personally like the 5GT so the thought of a 3GT is something I'm looking forward to seeing.

I saw that Audi Gran Coupe at the Auto Show and thought it was stunning (but I'm still too loyal to the BMW brand to move over).
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      03-25-2011, 09:37 AM   #50
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Not that I totally despise the country I live in, but this car makes me hate my fellow US consumers. As a wagon-lover, I unfortunately realize this will probably be the death of the 3er wagon in the US...
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      03-25-2011, 09:50 AM   #51
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SCOTT, I recall some past discussion:

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=445536

Of course, nothing was confirmed but you seemed to hint that an M3 GT was at least possible. However, yes, an M3 (M4?) Gran Coupe would probably fit the M formula better and be more marketable than an M3GT. So I am all for that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
THERE WONT BE AN M 3er GRAN TURISMO, M-SPORT PACKET- PROBABLY BUT NO FULL M.

So stop getting hysterical.



As I have mentioned on countless occasions. M3 Sedan is not meeting sales targets , Plans for the M3 brand expansion aside from Coupe and Cabrio continues in related 3er platforms - X3M and very probably 3er Gran Coupe which will replace the M3 Sedan with an M Variant with four doors. 3er Gran Coupe like the 6er Gran Coupe is a 3er coupe with extra doors, several inches lower than the sedan.

There will not be a 3er GT M. So Relax.

Contrary to the enthusiast population... BMW does know what it is doing..
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      03-25-2011, 11:13 AM   #52
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Nothing sleek about that thing. Disappointed
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      03-25-2011, 11:24 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
THERE WONT BE AN M 3er GRAN TURISMO, M-SPORT PACKET- PROBABLY BUT NO FULL M.

So stop getting hysterical.



As I have mentioned on countless occasions. M3 Sedan is not meeting sales targets , Plans for the M3 brand expansion aside from Coupe and Cabrio continues in related 3er platforms - X3M and very probably 3er Gran Coupe which will replace the M3 Sedan with an M Variant with four doors. 3er Gran Coupe like the 6er Gran Coupe is a 3er coupe with extra doors, several inches lower than the sedan.

There will not be a 3er GT M. So Relax.

Contrary to the enthusiast population... BMW does know what it is doing..
So essentially there will not be a M sedan besides the M5?
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      03-25-2011, 11:50 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
Contrary to the enthusiast population... BMW does know what it is doing..
Scott don't generalize. Some of the enthusiast population is empathetic - if you ready back not all comments are wildly negative - some are positive some are constructive criticism.
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      03-25-2011, 11:51 AM   #55
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Quote:
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So essentially there will not be a M sedan besides the M5?
He said M gran coupe which is a 4-D car in the sleekness of a coupe.
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      03-25-2011, 11:58 AM   #56
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Do I see 4 pot brembos on the front?
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      03-25-2011, 01:44 PM   #57
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It almost looks like a mustang with that camo covering the rear windows.
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      03-25-2011, 01:55 PM   #58
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I love the dinky little trailers they haul these things on.
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      03-25-2011, 04:21 PM   #59
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That's the exact color I want.
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      03-25-2011, 06:58 PM   #60
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You know what, I take back any reservations I had about this car...

I've been staring at these pictures for 2 days now on and off, and now that my eye has adjusted to the 'fastback' shape more, the shape comes off really well, and i'm actually really digging it... Sort of a smaller sedan with the X6 silhouette.

I'm officially interested in where this car goes
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      03-25-2011, 08:35 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antzcrashing View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuerza View Post
So essentially there will not be a M sedan besides the M5?
He said M gran coupe which is a 4-D car in the sleekness of a coupe.
So in the new 3 series platform there with be a 328, 335, M3, 3GT, 3 Grand Coupe. Will the 3GT and 3GC be anything like the 3 series? 5 different "models" of the same platform seems excessive. And that doesn't account for coupe, sedan, convertible variations.
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      03-25-2011, 09:58 PM   #62
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Let s wait and see the final results. A grand coupe M3 might be a very good thing
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      03-26-2011, 05:39 AM   #63
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The X6, the 5GT, and this 3GT are the Pontiac Aztecs of German vehicle design. Or, dare I say it, the AMC Pacers of BMW.

It is this sort of pandering to the perversities of American taste that may lead BMW down the path of ruin. First SUVs, then these AztecPacer clones probably soon to be followed by family vans and electrics. And then cars with NAMES: BMW Bandit. BMW Boulevard BMW Biarritz. BMW Blizzard.

I cannot believe that anyone with any sense of style or perspective could see the BMW Ami 6s of late as anything but abominations. BMW builds lovely coupes, delightful sedans, and USED to build some gorgeous shooting brakes ('station wagons' to the unwashed).' Now, because some fools wanted SUVsedan-cum-flyingboatcarhouses, BMW trots out these hermaphroditic, fat-arsed monstrosities. Oh, the humanity!

And if BMW 'knew what it was doing,' they'd never have hired Chris Bangle in the first place.

Y'don't see Mercedes-Benz building anything like these contraptions, do ya?
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      03-26-2011, 08:57 AM   #64
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Quote:
The X6, the 5GT, and this 3GT are the Pontiac Aztecs of German vehicle design. Or, dare I say it, the AMC Pacers of BMW.
Quote:
It is this sort of pandering to the perversities of American taste that may lead BMW down the path of ruin. First SUVs, then these AztecPacer clones probably soon to be followed by family vans and electrics. And then cars with NAMES: BMW Bandit. BMW Boulevard BMW Biarritz. BMW Blizzard.

I cannot believe that anyone with any sense of style or perspective could see the BMW Ami 6s of late as anything but abominations. BMW builds lovely coupes, delightful sedans, and USED to build some gorgeous shooting brakes ('station wagons' to the unwashed).' Now, because some fools wanted SUVsedan-cum-flyingboatcarhouses, BMW trots out these hermaphroditic, fat-arsed monstrosities. Oh, the humanity!

And if BMW 'knew what it was doing,' they'd never have hired Chris Bangle in the first place.

Y'don't see Mercedes-Benz building anything like these contraptions, do ya?

First of all BMW is a global brand. A BMW must perform in all markets there is no specific model built for a particular market apart from an engine variant.
BMW models although despised in the US such as Sporthatches and the Touring models are more successful in other markets.

The demographic for downsizing into smaller luxury packages is increasing and in this decade alone it is a segment which will produce high growth.
It is the same with the MINI/UKL class , Premium Compact and Premium Entry classes. BMW have invested heavily within these segments to produce a modular structure which can accompany a whole line of models on the respective 1er/3er matrix.

This is effective for BMW in the long run because each model becomes more profitable, and customers are wanting more variety from their vehicles.
A supercar is not profitable and to some manufacturers who have invested in them are scrambling to catch up in regards to the future segments earmarked for growth. You would be surprised what "vanity" projects are actually unprofitable for their company.

The automobile world changes everyday , The question we ask ourselves at BMW and we have a think tank for this is "Where will the luxury car be in 20-30 years time? Will it be the same size as a luxury car today? or will it be smaller?

With Chris Bangle , BMW hired him when they saw the Fiat Coupe , BMW realised that the one look different size image was becoming stale.
But Bangle brought more to BMW than just design , he brought inspiration and he took the company away from it's secretive era of design and brought it into the open. Today you now know the name of the person who designed your car , tested the seat , devised color and trim. That was Bangles direction - he opened car design up to the world , he made car design a very focal talking point and he brought BMW into a new level , Bangles creativity brought BMW to the forefront of product design , other manufacturers sat back and watched. Which led BMW to expand it's portfolio and overtake premium rival Mercedes-Benz as the worlds no1 automobile manufacturer.

Even now BMW is seen as a more innovative company , We invested in Efficient Dynamics , they developed supercars. In Europe BMW have to reach their emission targets by 5% , BMW's competitors have about 20-30%.
BMW has pioneered alternative drive trains in a real world environment (MINI-E) they have not. BMW is the leading automobile manufacturer in sustainability , plus we are bringing the future of the automobile with the BMWi brand and showcasing who mass produced CFRP will be able to be cost effective to add to other BMW models in the portfolio.

Customers want more variety from their vehicle but they dont want the particular typical concept. BMW in the case of the 5er GT developed the car from the inside out it was to give customers a similar level of luxury at this side of a luxury segment choice.

You may say that Audi and Mercedes-Benz are not doing the exact same but they are. They both have GT-esque models in development and they are working on more choices for premium customers.

If you take for example the X6. Audi are developing a Q4 and a Q6 , Mercedes-Benz have a GLC in both the compact and luxury segments.
And the Porsche Cajun is more a X6 type of concept than a SAV.

Enthusaists might not like it but in the end it is down to customer demand , demand might not be solely in the US but it is coming from other markets.
The markets are changing , BMW realised this a long time ago, that is why they are ahead of the curve.
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      03-26-2011, 12:20 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuerza View Post
So in the new 3 series platform there with be a 328, 335, M3, 3GT, 3 Grand Coupe. Will the 3GT and 3GC be anything like the 3 series? 5 different "models" of the same platform seems excessive. And that doesn't account for coupe, sedan, convertible variations.
Actually, you are sort of mixing body styles with trim levels. But, yes, if the 3-based GranCoupe is approved for production there will be 5 body styles in the US - sedan, coupe, convertible, hatchback, and four door coupe. Each will be available as either a 28i model with an N20B20 engine or 35i model with an N55B30 engine. I don't think this is too many since we already have four today (we've got the first three plus the wagon, but that won't come to US going forward).

I have a feeling the 3 GT is going to look a lot better than people are expecting, and I also think the 4 GC will look stunning. I'll bet these models are going to have a lot of people back pedaling on their first impressions and becoming converts once we see the final results.
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      03-26-2011, 02:02 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
"First of all BMW is a global brand. A BMW must perform in all markets there is no specific model built for a particular market apart from an engine variant.
BMW models although despised in the US such as Sporthatches and the Touring models are more successful in other markets."

Americans are a rather tasteless lot, given that they won't buy Tourings but will buy X6s. That is our national shame; Why cater to it? There is a place for honour and integrity in automobile design; Making aberrant vehicles just because some jackwagon wants a vehicular manbearbig is automotive prostitution.

"The demographic for downsizing into smaller luxury packages is increasing and in this decade alone it is a segment which will produce high growth.
It is the same with the MINI/UKL class , Premium Compact and Premium Entry classes. BMW have invested heavily within these segments to produce a modular structure which can accompany a whole line of models on the respective 1er/3er matrix."

Don't forget bicycles. And powered wheelchairs.

"This is effective for BMW in the long run because each model becomes more profitable, and customers are wanting more variety from their vehicles.
A supercar is not profitable and to some manufacturers who have invested in them are scrambling to catch up in regards to the future segments earmarked for growth. You would be surprised what "vanity" projects are actually unprofitable for their company."

No, I wouldn't. It's the conundrum of building something for a market that screams, "Build this, and we'll buy it in droves!" and who then buy something else instead. As in manual transmissions in upscale sedans.

"The automobile world changes everyday , The question we ask ourselves at BMW and we have a think tank for this is "Where will the luxury car be in 20-30 years time? Will it be the same size as a luxury car today? or will it be smaller?"

Yes, it will be smaller. But it doesn't have to have a big fat butt and look like an Aztec.

"With Chris Bangle , BMW hired him when they saw the Fiat Coupe , BMW realised that the one look different size image was becoming stale.
But Bangle brought more to BMW than just design , he brought inspiration and he took the company away from it's secretive era of design and brought it into the open. Today you now know the name of the person who designed your car , tested the seat , devised color and trim. That was Bangles direction - he opened car design up to the world , he made car design a very focal talking point and he brought BMW into a new level , Bangles creativity brought BMW to the forefront of product design , other manufacturers sat back and watched. Which led BMW to expand it's portfolio and overtake premium rival Mercedes-Benz as the worlds no1 automobile manufacturer."

I don't CARE who designed my seats, or the battery cover. I care that the vehicle works, lasts, and looks good. I care that Mr. Bangle couldn't design the rear end of a sedan if his life depended upon it.

"Even now BMW is seen as a more innovative company , We invested in Efficient Dynamics , they developed supercars. In Europe BMW have to reach their emission targets by 5% , BMW's competitors have about 20-30%.
BMW has pioneered alternative drive trains in a real world environment (MINI-E) they have not. BMW is the leading automobile manufacturer in sustainability , plus we are bringing the future of the automobile with the BMWi brand and showcasing who mass produced CFRP will be able to be cost effective to add to other BMW models in the portfolio."

I cannot argue with this; It's nice props for BMW. No one questions BMW's commitment--only, at times, their taste.

"Customers want more variety from their vehicle but they dont want the particular typical concept. BMW in the case of the 5er GT developed the car from the inside out it was to give customers a similar level of luxury at this side of a luxury segment choice."

Back to ManBearPig. Just because a customer wants a flyinghouseboatcar, doesn't mean that BMW has to build one.

"You may say that Audi and Mercedes-Benz are not doing the exact same but they are. They both have GT-esque models in development and they are working on more choices for premium customers."

Shame on them.

"If you take for example the X6. Audi are developing a Q4 and a Q6 , Mercedes-Benz have a GLC in both the compact and luxury segments.
And the Porsche Cajun is more a X6 type of concept than a SAV."

Monkey see, monkey do. Doesn't make it right. If all of your automotive friends are cutting off their virtual design cojones and making hydrogen-electric-biodiesel family minivans, do you join in?

"Enthusaists might not like it but in the end it is down to customer demand , demand might not be solely in the US but it is coming from other markets.
The markets are changing , BMW realised this a long time ago, that is why they are ahead of the curve.
I rest my case. Enthusiasts do not buy ManBearPigs. It is sad to see BMW indulge in this self-mutilation.

Last edited by Sandydog; 03-26-2011 at 02:08 PM.
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