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BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > 2012-2019 BMW 3 and 4-Series Forums > General F30 Sedan / F32 Coupe / F36 Gran Coupe Forum > 2012 BMW F30 3-series Production Begins November 2011 - as 335i and 328i Models
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      06-13-2011, 06:31 PM   #23
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So according to this, no xdrive models for 2012?
According to my dealer the x-drive and the touring will come in September 2012.
So xdrive models would be 2013 then because EOP on the 2012 is June of 2012?
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      06-13-2011, 06:49 PM   #24
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Today an idiot that was kind of in a rush punched the gas in his X1. Needless to say the 4 cylinder engine note is terrible it sounded like a Dodge Caliber. I've owned Audi/Vw 1.8T/2.0T and they were pretty underwhelming...it's not that bad in the GTI due to it's noise pipe and lighter weight. BTW Bmw will have no problem selling that car to yuppies or badge whores. Just yesterday I was remembering how smooth my 135 engine was(I'm not a F/I guy) but geeez what is Bmw thinking. They should offer that 4 banger in the 323I, offer the N/A in the 328 and F/I 335. But like an other guy mentionned earlier it wouldn't surprise me if Bmw change the engine line up by next year. Personally I don't want a 4 cylinder Bmw nor other heavy cars(like my old a4 was).
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Its because a lot of BMW owners are housewives or business professionals and know little about cars other than BMW's are a status symbol in their own circles so that have to have one. But exotic car owners know cars, that's why they are willing to spend for a killer car and they know something different when they see one.
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      06-13-2011, 06:50 PM   #25
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It's going to be interesting to see if we actually see a change from 335i -> 340i and maybe even 328i -> 330i. Probably less likely the 328i will change because they just promoted the new 2.0T as 28i moving from the former 30i in the Z4 and X3.
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      06-13-2011, 07:17 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by mtla4 View Post
Today an idiot that was kind of in a rush punched the gas in his X1. Needless to say the 4 cylinder engine note is terrible it sounded like a Dodge Caliber. I've owned Audi/Vw 1.8T/2.0T and they were pretty underwhelming...it's not that bad in the GTI due to it's noise pipe and lighter weight. BTW Bmw will have no problem selling that car to yuppies or badge whores. Just yesterday I was remembering how smooth my 135 engine was(I'm not a F/I guy) but geeez what is Bmw thinking. They should offer that 4 banger in the 323I, offer the N/A in the 328 and F/I 335. But like an other guy mentionned earlier it wouldn't surprise me if Bmw change the engine line up by next year. Personally I don't want a 4 cylinder Bmw nor other heavy cars(like my old a4 was).
If it was just up to BMW, I doubt they would go this route. But remember there are governments and industry groups that have set MPG and emission targets and they are making those incremental changes to meeting those targets in the years ahead.

Be prepared to see this type of "downsizing" including more hybrid/electric cars from all car manufacturers.
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      06-13-2011, 08:08 PM   #27
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sweet as, looking forward to read more about the n20 engine soon!!
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      06-13-2011, 10:02 PM   #28
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      06-13-2011, 11:21 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by hchaniar View Post
If it was just up to BMW, I doubt they would go this route. But remember there are governments and industry groups that have set MPG and emission targets and they are making those incremental changes to meeting those targets in the years ahead.

Be prepared to see this type of "downsizing" including more hybrid/electric cars from all car manufacturers.
Really sad. Only if we could go back in time remember Mazda produced a 1.8 V6 for the Precidia and a 2.0 V6. I wouldn't mind a small 6 with a low pressure turbo.
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Its because a lot of BMW owners are housewives or business professionals and know little about cars other than BMW's are a status symbol in their own circles so that have to have one. But exotic car owners know cars, that's why they are willing to spend for a killer car and they know something different when they see one.
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      06-14-2011, 02:31 AM   #30
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i cant wait for official pics! almost a year till it comes out...going to be a LONG year
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      06-14-2011, 11:20 AM   #31
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Good times ahead for Audi/Merceds if the next generation 3-series looks like this......
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      06-14-2011, 03:13 PM   #32
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Good times ahead for Audi/Merceds if the next generation 3-series looks like this......
I think this rendering follows 5-Series styling queues a little too closely.

The 3-Series is typically the new design leader for the 5 and 7 eventually. Except for the E60's design which was a dumb move on its own design motif never to be resurrected again in the future I hope. The current 5 looks a heck of lot like an E92.

I wouldn't give up hope yet that the new 3-Series will establish new design cues that will be used in the other models.
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      06-14-2011, 04:25 PM   #33
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i dont care about anything until i can see an M-sport pkg

then i can decide whether BMW has done a worthy job of winning back my business or not ...
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      06-14-2011, 09:13 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Jblack4083 View Post
It's going to be interesting to see if we actually see a change from 335i -> 340i and maybe even 328i -> 330i. Probably less likely the 328i will change because they just promoted the new 2.0T as 28i moving from the former 30i in the Z4 and X3.
Don't think they would go with a 340i because ramping up the 335i would make it too close to the M3. I don't think power is going to go up as much as it has in the past, but the engines will get smaller for same output. A -40i tune on the 3.0l TT for the 7 series still makes sense though.
Don't think they would take it so far as calling a 2.0T a 330i (but who knows further out). 328i for the top tune 2.0l makes perfect sense. Maybe the -30i designation is dead for a while.
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      06-15-2011, 08:25 AM   #35
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what was the difference between the 328i, 328i S, and 328i SA? SA was explained as South African production ....

also curious to know if there was going to be that second model year engine upgrade. ie... the 325->328 for E90 (which I read somewhere occurred for the E46 too)
Actually the correct explanation is the 328i S = SULEV, for certain states all vehicles sold have to be SULEV to meet emission requirements and 328i SA is South African Production.

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      06-15-2011, 10:42 AM   #36
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Don't think they would go with a 340i because ramping up the 335i would make it too close to the M3.
The power output and numeric badge are not interdependent, though. So, a theoretical, new 340i might have only 10% more power than an outgoing 335i. That's still not going to touch an F32 M3, which will likely have about 450hp.

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Don't think they would take it so far as calling a 2.0T a 330i (but who knows further out). 328i for the top tune 2.0l makes perfect sense. Maybe the -30i designation is dead for a while.
It does seem the 330i badge is going to go dormant for now. But as you say, in the future, it could come back. If it does, it is actually pretty likely it will indeed be N20B20 powered, perhaps with a bump in power (say 260hp or so).
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      06-15-2011, 10:17 PM   #37
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The power output and numeric badge are not interdependent, though. So, a theoretical, new 340i might have only 10% more power than an outgoing 335i. That's still not going to touch an F32 M3, which will likely have about 450hp.
So true. Then the question is do they want to have a 340i as the top model ex.M. Given the 550i and 760i, i guess it wouldn't be too much for the 3, if they have a 135i even.

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It does seem the 330i badge is going to go dormant for now. But as you say, in the future, it could come back. If it does, it is actually pretty likely it will indeed be N20B20 powered, perhaps with a bump in power (say 260hp or so).
Do you think they would ever let the N20B20 grow to 260hp? It's not far from where its starting out, and the audi'S' and 'M' models really push it way higher, but why is the MB 1.8l T still at 204hp top tune (in the -25 designation)? I don't know much about engines.. but I wonder why the 335 starts at 300hp and doesnt stray too far above it (max 340 for '1M') on a 3.0l, why do they push the 2.0l relative much more, or is the technology much advanced so its actually not stressing it very much?
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      06-16-2011, 07:18 AM   #38
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So true. Then the question is do they want to have a 340i as the top model ex.M. Given the 550i and 760i, i guess it wouldn't be too much for the 3, if they have a 135i even.
Well, they already have a 740i and 640i powered by the same basic I6 engine(s) used in the 5 series and 3 series (and others). So its not a stretch to imagine a 540i on the horizon soon, and once that happens the engine/badge will likely migrate down to the 3 as well. Basically, in the ever-present quest to one up the preceding generations of the car, the marketers wil continue to nudge the model designation higher and higher.

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Do you think they would ever let the N20B20 grow to 260hp?
I don't think it is at all far-fetched. Of course that doesn't mean it will happen. They might wait for the next generation I4 that will share an architecture with the next generation I6, and a new I3.

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It's not far from where its starting out, and the audi'S' and 'M' models really push it way higher, but why is the MB 1.8l T still at 204hp top tune (in the -25 designation)?
Mercedes has simply opted to favor a little better economy/emissions with their four cylinder models vs. a little higher performance. This doesn't necessarily mean they are more efficient than the competition, but they are more efficient than they'd be if they ran more boost.

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I don't know much about engines.. but I wonder why the 335 starts at 300hp and doesnt stray too far above it (max 340 for '1M') on a 3.0l, why do they push the 2.0l relative much more, or is the technology much advanced so its actually not stressing it very much?
The N20 is a newer design than the N54/N55. In time, especially with the next generation of engines I mentioned above, the I6 will make a lot more power. Rumor has it they are targeting as much as 133hp/L. So that would mean a 200hp 1.5L 3cyl, a 266hp 2.0L 4 cyl, and a 400hp 3L 6cyl.
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      06-16-2011, 12:17 PM   #39
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Mkoesel,
Very informative, thanks.
Can't wait to see them take the 3.0l T/TT to 400hp.. and not have it break it on them! Fingers crossed.
Actually, on the f10 i can see the final LCI being 520i,530i,540i,550i ..if just to give people a little more performance in the late cycle on the same engine, in the 530i and 540i.
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      06-20-2011, 01:56 PM   #40
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Just hope itīs not gonna look like a smaller 5 series..
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      06-24-2011, 11:43 AM   #41
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Just hope itīs not gonna look like a smaller 5 series..
It will
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      06-26-2011, 05:11 PM   #42
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thoughts?
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      08-21-2011, 09:28 AM   #43
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I talked to my salesman yesterday and he announced that I could get in line for the new 3er now and so I did. I think it would be nice with 335i and wise to get one of the first cars delivered hopefully!
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      08-21-2011, 09:45 AM   #44
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I talked to my salesman yesterday and he announced that I could get in line for the new 3er now and so I did. I think it would be nice with 335i and wise to get one of the first cars delivered hopefully!
First of our members to announce they're officially in line for the F30.

Congrats! We can't wait to see your delivery, which will certainly be one of the first.
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