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      08-21-2013, 01:46 PM   #1
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M-sport brakes sluggish performance

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First I'd like to say that I've not driven another f30 so can't compare to anything else, but I did own a 2009 135i and I thought the stock brakes were far superior to the m-sport on my f30.

I remember the 1 series brakes engaging as soon as the brake pedal was tapped. On the f30 I find there is about a half an inch of travel to the brake pedal where nothing happens. When I do press the pedal all the way I don't find the brakes as strong in stopping the car as they were on the 1 series.

Can anyone shed some light on this. The people with m-sport brakes, do you have pedal travel as well before the brakes are engaged?
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      08-21-2013, 01:49 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3magine View Post
First I'd like to say that I've not driven another f30 so can't compare to anything else, but I did own a 2009 135i and I thought the stock brakes were far superior to the m-sport on my f30.

I remember the 1 series brakes engaging as soon as the brake pedal was tapped. On the f30 I find there is about a half an inch of travel to the brake pedal where nothing happens. When I do press the pedal all the way I don't find the brakes as strong in stopping the car as they were on the 1 series.

Can anyone shed some light on this. The people with m-sport brakes, do you have pedal travel as well before the brakes are engaged?
I have an E70 X5 35i and msport 335i. No complaints here, both sets of brakes do a solid job of stopping both cars
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      08-21-2013, 02:20 PM   #3
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I haven't received my msport 335 yet, but the sport line versions I drove all had that 1/2" dead zone. Coming from my Infiniti, where the brakes were very strong and sensitive, I also found it unnerving but am hoping it is more that my previous car's brakes were touchy.

By the way, are you talking about stock M Sport line brakes or the $650 option M Sport Brakes? I ordered the latter.
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      08-21-2013, 02:28 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3magine View Post
First I'd like to say that I've not driven another f30 so can't compare to anything else, but I did own a 2009 135i and I thought the stock brakes were far superior to the m-sport on my f30.

I remember the 1 series brakes engaging as soon as the brake pedal was tapped. On the f30 I find there is about a half an inch of travel to the brake pedal where nothing happens. When I do press the pedal all the way I don't find the brakes as strong in stopping the car as they were on the 1 series.

Can anyone shed some light on this. The people with m-sport brakes, do you have pedal travel as well before the brakes are engaged?
How many miles are on the car?
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      08-21-2013, 02:31 PM   #5
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I have the optional m-sport upgraded brakes. The car has around 1500 km on it. I made an appointment at the dealer for the limp mode I've experienced twice now and the brakes. In all honesty I don't like the brakes. I'm not impressed with the performance and the dead zone bothers me a lot. Not what I expected from performance brakes.
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      08-21-2013, 02:49 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by 3magine
I have the optional m-sport upgraded brakes. The car has around 1500 km on it. I made an appointment at the dealer for the limp mode I've experienced twice now and the brakes. In all honesty I don't like the brakes. I'm not impressed with the performance and the dead zone bothers me a lot. Not what I expected from performance brakes.
That sucks. What's the point of 4 piston Brembo brakes and large rotors if they don't feel like an upgrade. I was hoping that dead spot went away if I got the upgraded brakes. Actually it's 2 levels up as the msport gets the better pads already.
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      08-21-2013, 03:00 PM   #7
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Interesting. Brembo brakes may have a certain operating temp requirement for it to work well. I know it great for track and prevents fading.

BMW stock brakes are very well designed, but mSport brakes do look better.
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      08-21-2013, 03:16 PM   #8
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When warm they are quite nice. But when you use them in slow traffic to and from work they are just as the people above describe them.
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      08-21-2013, 04:52 PM   #9
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I have a friend who has complained about the brembos on his STX as well so maybe it's a Brembo thing. I know on my other car, a '14 Huyndai Santa Fe, the brakes are very touchy and it's annoying. You have to be very delicate in order to modulate braking. They may SEEM better because they brake full power as soon as you touch them but this is like the sport throttle, just an illusion.
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      08-21-2013, 08:06 PM   #10
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Could also be a product of the brake regeneration system for the battery.
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      08-21-2013, 08:19 PM   #11
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there certainly is more pedal travel, but the car stops.
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      08-21-2013, 09:06 PM   #12
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Make sure there's no air in the system. Mine had an incredible dead zone. Wasn't right. Took it back and they bled it correctly. Much improved
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      08-21-2013, 09:07 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmerfestool View Post
They may SEEM better because they brake full power as soon as you touch them but this is like the sport throttle, just an illusion.
Not a very good analogy comparing to sport throttle. If the brakes worked like they did on my 135i there would be no travel of the pedal without engaging the brakes. This means that in normal driving as soon as the pedal were pressed the car would start braking. With travel, it requires additional pressure, and therefore time to begin braking. It's irrelevant that OVERALL the braking distance is the same. I want the brakes to engage as soon as they are pressed, and not have any travel (especially as much as they do now) to begin the braking process.

As for the sport throttle, it's not an illusion. Certainly the car doesn't produce more power overall, but at the moment of applying the throttle in sport mode, it's as if you applied more throttle in normal mode, therefore you'll move quicker at that moment.
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      08-22-2013, 03:00 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3magine View Post
Not a very good analogy comparing to sport throttle. If the brakes worked like they did on my 135i there would be no travel of the pedal without engaging the brakes. This means that in normal driving as soon as the pedal were pressed the car would start braking. With travel, it requires additional pressure, and therefore time to begin braking. It's irrelevant that OVERALL the braking distance is the same. I want the brakes to engage as soon as they are pressed, and not have any travel (especially as much as they do now) to begin the braking process.

As for the sport throttle, it's not an illusion. Certainly the car doesn't produce more power overall, but at the moment of applying the throttle in sport mode, it's as if you applied more throttle in normal mode, therefore you'll move quicker at that moment.
The F30 has regenerative braking, which allows about 1/2" of brake pedal travel before the brakes themselves are applied, I've read. This could possibly be the reason for the dead spot everyone talks about.
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      08-23-2013, 12:44 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3magine View Post
Not a very good analogy comparing to sport throttle. If the brakes worked like they did on my 135i there would be no travel of the pedal without engaging the brakes. This means that in normal driving as soon as the pedal were pressed the car would start braking. With travel, it requires additional pressure, and therefore time to begin braking. It's irrelevant that OVERALL the braking distance is the same. I want the brakes to engage as soon as they are pressed, and not have any travel (especially as much as they do now) to begin the braking process.

As for the sport throttle, it's not an illusion. Certainly the car doesn't produce more power overall, but at the moment of applying the throttle in sport mode, it's as if you applied more throttle in normal mode, therefore you'll move quicker at that moment.
You can adjust the break pedal distance, if i recall correctly. Either pumping the break when car is off or something to that extent. I was able to do it on my previous vehicle.
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      08-23-2013, 10:59 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3magine View Post
Not a very good analogy comparing to sport throttle. If the brakes worked like they did on my 135i there would be no travel of the pedal without engaging the brakes. This means that in normal driving as soon as the pedal were pressed the car would start braking. With travel, it requires additional pressure, and therefore time to begin braking. It's irrelevant that OVERALL the braking distance is the same. I want the brakes to engage as soon as they are pressed, and not have any travel (especially as much as they do now) to begin the braking process.

As for the sport throttle, it's not an illusion. Certainly the car doesn't produce more power overall, but at the moment of applying the throttle in sport mode, it's as if you applied more throttle in normal mode, therefore you'll move quicker at that moment.
Actually it's a great analogy. I understood it, at least.

One characteristic of high performance brakes is that the brake pedal feel is linear and progressive. Performance brakes are designed this way so you can ultimately have much more control over how much you slow down when applying your foot to the pedal. Does that make sense? You don't have much control over your braking if gently dipping into the pedal triggers maximum braking power (which is the feel you're after).

The last thing I would want on the track would be the following: I tap the brakes before entering a corner . . . I kill all of my speed because the brakes engage fully at the mere tap of the pedal.

I hope that all makes sense. It sounds like high performance brakes may not be what you ultimately want.

Note: Although the pedal feel is different with high performance brakes, the pedal feel should not be sloppy. There should be a corresponding relationship between pedal travel and bite.
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      08-23-2013, 11:01 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ybbiz34 View Post
Actually it's a great analogy. I understood it, at least.

One characteristic of high performance brakes is that the brake pedal feel is linear and progressive. Performance brakes are designed this way so you can ultimately have much more control over how much you slow down when applying your foot to the pedal. Does that make sense? You don't have much control over your braking if gently dipping into the pedal triggers maximum braking power (which is the feel you're after).

The last thing I would want on the track would be the following: I tap the brakes before entering a corner . . . I kill all of my speed because the brakes engage fully at the mere tap of the pedal.

I hope that all makes sense. It sounds like high performance brakes may not be what you ultimately want.

Note: Although the pedal feel is different with high performance brakes, the pedal feel should not be sloppy. There should be a corresponding relationship between pedal travel and bite.
Your explanation of performance brakes is spot on. I never thought of it this way, but it makes sense. Since I don't track the car, nor ever plan to, I wish the brakes were more sticky, but, first world problems, right.
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      08-23-2013, 11:13 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3magine View Post
Your explanation of performance brakes is spot on. I never thought of it this way, but it makes sense. Since I don't track the car, nor ever plan to, I wish the brakes were more sticky, but, first world problems, right.
I'm glad that my explanation was helpful!

I am confident that you will get used to your new brakes over time. And after you get used to them, I'm sure you will begin to appreciate how much more control they ultimately give you.

Also, out of curiosity, did you bed the brakes in when you received your new car?
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      08-23-2013, 05:34 PM   #19
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You may enjoy installing brake pads with greater initial torque bite. This will provide a sensation of greater responsiveness. There are plenty of aftermarket options.
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      08-23-2013, 05:43 PM   #20
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Quote:
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You may enjoy installing brake pads with greater initial torque bite. This will provide a sensation of greater responsiveness. There are plenty of aftermarket options.
Are there? I was looking for some low dust aftermarket options and I couldn't find any options at all. Please post!
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      08-23-2013, 06:21 PM   #21
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U should try driving non-m sport models hhaha
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      08-23-2013, 06:54 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3magine View Post
Your explanation of performance brakes is spot on. I never thought of it this way, but it makes sense. Since I don't track the car, nor ever plan to, I wish the brakes were more sticky, but, first world problems, right.
If you want to ship them, I'll trade you the normal 2013 msport line brakes +cash
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