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      01-27-2012, 08:30 AM   #67
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i heard from an owner of a 4 cylinder 528 auto, and he got 38 mpg highway.
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      01-27-2012, 08:44 AM   #68
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Using the new standards that the EPA created in 2008, and comparing the last few vehicles I've owned, I get the EPA-rated combined average MPG. The exception being a VW diesel in which I got a few MPG more than the EPA combined number. With that said, if I can get 27-28 combined MPG in the '12 328i...this just might be my next car! Plus, once the aftermarket gets ahold of the ECU and starts offering tunes, I expect that the N20 will be putting out some significant numbers and getting the same or better MPG.
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      01-27-2012, 09:48 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lawgone View Post
To the guys driving manuals...do you do much stop and go/city driving? If so, doesn't the constant shifting get annoying? I have an hour long commute and half of it is stop and go. Maybe it would help keep me awake to have a manual but it seems like it would be a real hassle at times.
don't notice it... the clutching and shifting just feels natural and I don't think about it.
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      01-27-2012, 09:57 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by ATX78703 View Post
don't need to row my own gears anymore
there's never a "need" to row. it's only the feeling of connectedness between you and your bimmer and the road
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      01-27-2012, 09:57 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul386 View Post
This isn't true. The ZF 8HP has a locking torque converter, only 2 shift elements, and a fancy hydraulic control unit. There are other cool technologies including the hydraulic accumulator that makes start - stop possible. This should be plainly evident by the automatic transmission being more efficient in city and highway driving.



Diesel fuel is expensive in the US because of taxes that are higher than taxes on gasoline. Diesel cars are expensive because of emission requirements.



And cost more....
Put the same car with an auto and with a manual on the dyno and the manual puts more power to the wheels.

The auto is less efficient in terms of losses. Having extra ratios is what allows the transmission to keep the engine revs lower in both city and highway driving hence yielding lower fuel consumption.
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      01-27-2012, 10:34 AM   #72
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Once again it depends on how you drive, if you are mindful of gas usage and are gentle on the gas you may come close to these numbers.
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      01-27-2012, 10:36 AM   #73
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A few months ago German carmag auto motor und sport tested some similar vehicles with manual and autoboxes to compare their REAL LIFE fuel consumpions. As I recall they tested a X1 28 or 35i 6MT vs a X1 28 or 35i 8 autobox. Doesn't matter what engine it was, the verdict was, the 6MT had the same MPG as the 8 auto or sometimes even better. No kidding.

That's the difference between theory and real life I guess. As I already stated here, my N55 535i 8speed auto does less MPG than my ex 2006 335i N54 6MT....for sure...OK I know apples and oranges but similar engines....different boxes...
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      01-27-2012, 10:53 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Hood View Post
As I already stated here, my N55 535i 8speed auto does less MPG than my ex 2006 335i N54 6MT....for sure...OK I know apples and oranges but similar engines....different boxes...
Don't forget the 600+ pounds of extra weight.
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      01-27-2012, 11:12 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lawgone View Post
To the guys driving manuals...do you do much stop and go/city driving? If so, doesn't the constant shifting get annoying? I have an hour long commute and half of it is stop and go. Maybe it would help keep me awake to have a manual but it seems like it would be a real hassle at times.
When you've driven manual all your life you don't even think about it. Sure Auto is nice, but I don't get frustrated or annoyed when I have to shift or engage the clutch in traffic.

And it definitely keeps me awake on long commutes with traffic!
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      01-27-2012, 11:37 AM   #76
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Originally Posted by Rich@GTBPerformance View Post
When you've driven manual all your life you don't even think about it. Sure Auto is nice, but I don't get frustrated or annoyed when I have to shift or engage the clutch in traffic.

And it definitely keeps me awake on long commutes with traffic!
I agree with this assessment. For those of us that have only driven manual, it's not hard to do. It's sort of like asking about folks who have a lot of turns on their drive, do they get tired of turning the wheel? Using a clutch is like walking, it's more work than riding a Segway, but once you've done it a little, you don't really have to think about it.

I've driven in LA and Dallas traffic and never really regretted not having an auto. If fact when I drive the wife's car, it's always shocking how poorly an automatic allows for engine braking. I'm a terrible automatic driver.
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      01-27-2012, 01:48 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BimmerGuyFL
Offical F30 USA MPG ratings from www.fueleconomy.gov

2012 F30 328i 8-speed auto: 24 city / 36 highway.
2012 F30 335i 8-speed auto: 23 city /33 highway.

2012 F30 328i Manual: 23 city / 34 highway.
2012 F30 335i Manual: 20 city / 30 highway.



http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find....n=sbs&id=32175
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find....n=sbs&id=32177
8 speed auto FTW

I am interested to see E90 vs F30 hwy runs. Gearing advantage should be pretty noticeable.
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      01-27-2012, 02:27 PM   #78
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If BMW does what Porsche did with a 7 forward speed manual, then those EPA numbers would put it right on par with the Auto.
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      01-27-2012, 03:02 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bavarian19 View Post
If BMW does what Porsche did with a 7 forward speed manual, then those EPA numbers would put it right on par with the Auto.
very true.... did you catch that Porsche is going tri-turbo as well? BMW going 7 Speed doesn't seem that crazy anymore.

http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsAr...llCars/261107/
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      01-27-2012, 10:41 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neph View Post
there's never a "need" to row. it's only the feeling of connectedness between you and your bimmer and the road
Actually, I did feel that I "needed" the 6mt over the 6at on my 328i. It's a significant performance gain on a engine with 200 lb-ft. And this engine has to be worked a little bit to stay in the sweet spot.

but now with the 8at and the torque getting much higher and the torque curve so flat, the manual has no benefit anymore.
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      01-27-2012, 11:02 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
2012 F30 328i 8-speed auto: 24 city / 36 highway.
2012 F30 335i 8-speed auto: 23 city /33 highway.

1mpg difference city - 4% difference. Ugh.

So a detuned N55 6-cyl. @ 240-260HP (20% less power) would probably match the N20.

4-cyl. turbo = BIG fail.
Agreed! It seems like BMW could have easily made a 328i/330i with the inline-6 that gets similar fuel economy to the N20 328i. Keep the N20 with 218 HP for the 325i.
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      01-28-2012, 02:36 AM   #82
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veryy impressive BMW. Well done! More HP in the 328i, more torque and better gas MPG. Besides the impressive efficiency from all of the reviews seems like the F30 is even more responsive and agile than the E90. This is a no brainer at this point. My 06 325i has over 105k miles and running smooth. Def looking forward to getting an F30 so I can start developing some new interior parts as well as getting better efficiency Win win. love it!
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      01-28-2012, 02:21 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeyO View Post
Well, my wallet will like those numbers for the 4 cyclinder.

How accurate do the gov sticker MPG numbers reflect real life results. I read somewhere that the numbers hardly match real life results and somebody recently was considering revaluating the whole testing procedure.
Well for whatever it's worth, I had a 528i loaner for a few days, which has the same N20 engine, and the thing ROCKED. Had plenty of power and got SICK gas mileage. Especially on the highway. Felt exactly like a smooth inline-6......I was shocked, yet not rally, because I knew BMW wouldn't realize anything but a masterpiece.

That being said, if it was my only car, I would want the more power of the 535i

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      01-29-2012, 09:56 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RussRamz View Post
I seriously doubt the 328i will have better performance compared to the E90 335d
The numbers may be close, but numbers don't tell you seat-of-the-pants feel. Subjectively, a 335d feels like a big block V8 (of course you already know this), but it has lower 1/4-mile numbers vs 335i on paper simply because it shifts sooner.

The new N20 closes the gap somewhat on the old 335d-- but BMW's been busy on their diesels too!

I imagine the newer versions of the I-6 diesel, coupled with the 8-speed tranny, would get high 20's city, and 40+ on the highway. Who needs hybrids?
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Last edited by Thud; 01-29-2012 at 10:02 AM.
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      01-30-2012, 12:03 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thud View Post
Subjectively, a 335d feels like a big block V8 (of course you already know this), but it has lower 1/4-mile numbers vs 335i on paper simply because it shifts sooner.
The 335d is slower because it develops less HP and is heavier. I too am looking forward to the future of BMW diesels in the USA. I am a fan of them after having driven a 335d for 35K miles. Give me a 2 liter diesel in a new 3 Series and I am in daily driver heaven.
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      01-30-2012, 09:42 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by RussRamz View Post
The 335d is slower because it develops less HP and is heavier.
335d still produces more in-gear acceleration than a 335i when gearing and weight are considered-- but the lower HP comes from the lower redline inherent to diesels. So I'm speaking from the seat-of-pants experience: driving a 335d is like driving a big-block V8 that you short-shift at 4500rpm. The 335i will have the edge over the distance though because it will stay in each gear longer. Throw in some turns and shorter stretches of track and it's a wash.

It's just a different kind of satisfaction, that's all.

Quote:
I too am looking forward to the future of BMW diesels in the USA. I am a fan of them after having driven a 335d for 35K miles. Give me a 2 liter diesel in a new 3 Series and I am in daily driver heaven.
I wonder how much more power they can get out of the 2.0L, it probably still has plenty of room to grow.
Other manufacturers have been getting between 210 and 240hp out of their diesel V6's, and BMW is now getting well over 300hp/500tq from the same displacement.
Audi is following suit with their upcoming 300hp 3.0 TDI.

The diesel HP wars are upon us!
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      01-30-2012, 12:31 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matt_335Ci View Post
those fuel ratings are probably with Eco-Pro turned ON.
I don't know that would be assumed. I get great fuel economy on my current e90 328i. I can only imagined that with Eco-Pro you could look at numbers even better than that
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      01-30-2012, 06:28 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AW128i View Post
Using the new standards that the EPA created in 2008, and comparing the last few vehicles I've owned, I get the EPA-rated combined average MPG. The exception being a VW diesel in which I got a few MPG more than the EPA combined number.
Another data point: '02 E46 330 5MT ratings:
21 / 24 / 30
18 / 22 / 27 (revised 2008 testing)

I average 24+ mpg in mixed driving. Wonder if I can expect the same with MT with the turbo engines.
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