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      02-02-2012, 12:27 PM   #23
J3FF3RSON
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Not impressed with the 0-60 times at all, considering the E9x 335's could achieve that speed half a second faster.
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      02-02-2012, 12:46 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by J3FF3RSON View Post
Not impressed with the 0-60 times at all, considering the E9x 335's could achieve that speed half a second faster.
we all know the actual times are faster ... dont read into this at all. expect the C&D test to prove they are identical to the e90 if not .1 faster due to lighter weight and better gearing
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      02-02-2012, 12:58 PM   #25
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Question

Wait, isn't the F30 328i supposed to be 88 lbs lighter than the E90 328i? How come the curb weight of an automatic F30 328i is 3461 lbs when the 2011 E90 328i is 3362 lbs? This better be a mistake because I find the E90 to heavy for my liking. I'm getting a manual F30 328i and even that is heavier at 3406 lbs. What gives?
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      02-02-2012, 01:06 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by wagz0627 View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the 19" Style 401 wheels are 225 front/255 rear. At least that's what my dealer told me when I ordered them.
I just checked BMWUSA.com. It is still staggered 225/255.
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      02-02-2012, 02:23 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Sumithb13 View Post
Wait, isn't the F30 328i supposed to be 88 lbs lighter than the E90 328i? How come the curb weight of an automatic F30 328i is 3461 lbs when the 2011 E90 328i is 3362 lbs? This better be a mistake because I find the E90 to heavy for my liking. I'm getting a manual F30 328i and even that is heavier at 3406 lbs. What gives?
+1

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      02-02-2012, 02:55 PM   #28
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The turning circle got bigger again!? This sucks for us who live near city centres. The E46's was around 34 ft; E90 went up to 36; F30 is now at 37. It's as bad as FWD cars now.
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      02-02-2012, 03:15 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by BH_Fanaticos77 View Post
Final drive is the same for AT for both 328 and 335
I noticed that too, and it surprised me much more than the transmission gear ratios being the same. The latter is pretty common for cars with different engines (see E9x 335i and E9x M3 for example), but typically the final drive is used as the equalizer. I guess the N20 and N55 are similar enough in power delivery that they can use the exact same ratios from the engine to the wheels. What's interesting though, is that for the manual transmission, everything is different. Even the transmission itself is totally different between the two (not even the same manufacturer, apparently). Seems a little strange given how similar the respective AT-equipped cars are.
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      02-02-2012, 04:38 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Robin Hood View Post
Exactly. Only 50kgs difference.(328iA vs 335i 6MT)
Biggest difference with the weight is that the 335 falls in a bit more expensive weight class in the Netherlands, as you might know. The difference is about a 100 euro a year in road taxes (wegenbelasting). For people looking to save money in the mileage, they probably also look to this part.
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      02-02-2012, 05:51 PM   #31
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Its as big as an e39?

WTF?

Why? Why does every car from every MFG have to get BIGGER each generation?

Please make us a 1er sedan BMW, about the size of my e46 ZHP would be great. Thanks!
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      02-02-2012, 07:03 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Hood
Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Your not saying the F30 328 auto will do 0-60 in 6.3, are you? because that is wrong.
No sir.

I'm saying the 328i A US spec(on that sheet above) does 0-100kmh (62mph) in 6.3 seconds. Look at that sheet. The EU spec(www.bmw.de) 335i 6MT & 8AT do 0-100kmh(62mph) in 5.5 seconds. Which is a difference of 0.8seconds. Almost ONE second. The US spec 335i 6MT does 0-100kmh(62mph) in 5.7(0.2s slower than the EU spec 335i)

Don't confuse 0-60mph with 0-100kmh please.



Cheers
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I'm confused as to why you are rationalizing upgrading to the 335i by comparing US-spec 328i to Euro-spec 335i. You also show clearly that the US-spec is .2 seconds slower than the Euro-spec 335i.

3/5 of a second is a lot less than "almost one second."
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      02-02-2012, 07:08 PM   #33
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im confused as well...throwing out eruo numers was confiusing...

the only difference i see is 0-60 and 0-62(0-100kmh) which might require an additional shift...
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      02-03-2012, 11:30 AM   #34
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not staggered, I am still putting my staggered wheels on it.
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      02-03-2012, 11:54 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Imola.ZHP View Post
Its as big as an e39?

WTF?

Why? Why does every car from every MFG have to get BIGGER each generation?

Please make us a 1er sedan BMW, about the size of my e46 ZHP would be great. Thanks!


a 135i sedan with the overall size of an e46 would be money. i'd buy one tomorrow if it was available
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      02-03-2012, 12:07 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay60642 View Post
I'm confused as to why you are rationalizing upgrading to the 335i by comparing US-spec 328i to Euro-spec 335i. You also show clearly that the US-spec is .2 seconds slower than the Euro-spec 335i.

3/5 of a second is a lot less than "almost one second."
Imo 0.8 seconds is almost ONE second. But sorry to get you confused. Maybe because I bought the lesser more expensive car (So they say...)I'm a bit defensive.
J/K
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      02-03-2012, 01:42 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumithb13 View Post
Wait, isn't the F30 328i supposed to be 88 lbs lighter than the E90 328i? How come the curb weight of an automatic F30 328i is 3461 lbs when the 2011 E90 328i is 3362 lbs? This better be a mistake because I find the E90 to heavy for my liking. I'm getting a manual F30 328i and even that is heavier at 3406 lbs. What gives?
This happens quite often. The manufacturer claims that the new car is lighter when similarly equipped, but that is a very vague statement as it doesn't have to mean that the statement holds for every possible configuration, or even that the new car can be similarly equipped to the old one at all in their definition of "similar".

So we expected the new 328i to be 88lbs lighter, when in fact it is ~40lbs heavier for both manual and automatic. That 120lbs is hard to explain just based on the upsized rims or iDrive hardware. I wonder in what way it is not similarly equipped to an iDrive E90 with 17 inch rims, which likely weighs similar to the base F30, not 88lbs heavier?
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      02-03-2012, 02:40 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Propagator View Post
This happens quite often. The manufacturer claims that the new car is lighter when similarly equipped, but that is a very vague statement as it doesn't have to mean that the statement holds for every possible configuration, or even that the new car can be similarly equipped to the old one at all in their definition of "similar".
Agree.

It's why I was a little skeptical when the claims of a lighter car were made in some of the early press material. I'm sure that they employed plenty of techniques to save weight in everything from the unibody to the suspension to the interior parts and electronics, and this is a commendable effort. It at least means the car is lighter than it otherwise would have been, which is a good thing. But if the end result is that, in the typical factory configuration, the car is heavier than the one it succeeds, then the significance of all the work they did ends up being somewhat diminished in the grand scheme of things.

I don't think we are going to see any revolutionary turnaround to vehicle weight until BMW's CFRP process becomes affordable enough to permeate into the bulk of their product range. The good news is that this is rumored to be starting in the next decade or so. Even the next M3 will reportedly make use of carbon fibre throughout the car (i.e. not just the roof). But don't expect another sub 3400 pound 3 Series before the next generation, and maybe not until after that one.
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      02-03-2012, 04:23 PM   #39
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Agree.

It's why I was a little skeptical when the claims of a lighter car were made in some of the early press material. I'm sure that they employed plenty of techniques to save weight in everything from the unibody to the suspension to the interior parts and electronics, and this is a commendable effort. It at least means the car is lighter than it otherwise would have been, which is a good thing. But if the end result is that, in the typical factory configuration, the car is heavier than the one it succeeds, then the significance of all the work they did ends up being somewhat diminished in the grand scheme of things.

I don't think we are going to see any revolutionary turnaround to vehicle weight until BMW's CFRP process becomes affordable enough to permeate into the bulk of their product range. The good news is that this is rumored to be starting in the next decade or so. Even the next M3 will reportedly make use of carbon fibre throughout the car (i.e. not just the roof). But don't expect another sub 3400 pound 3 Series before the next generation, and maybe not until after that one.
The F30 IS bigger, so they must've done a good bit of work to make the weight at least similar to the E90. But I agree it's unlikely we'll see a substantially lighter car any time soon, barring a major break through.

I also noticed that the C&D review mentions "surprising amount of tire noise". If you look at new cars that succeeded in weight reduction, you often find that noise insulation has been somewhat reduced. For example you can look at the recent Hyundai models, like the Sonata and the Elentra, both of which are actually lighter than their predecessors, but also somewhat noisier. So it seems possible to me that the F30 may be slightly noisier than the E90.

Regarding this "similarly equipped" claim, it seems to me that there is a lot of ambiguity in what counts as an "equipment". I think wheels and tires are certainly equipments, but what about the brakes? Exhaust system? Stereos? Seats? etc etc. They might have more of an engineering definition of the term equipment.
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      02-03-2012, 05:18 PM   #40
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4k+ lb
225 tires

what?
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      02-03-2012, 06:05 PM   #41
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hmm so much for the weight loss. also wierd rear tire size for the 335i. i predict a lot of new rims for tuned 335i owners.
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      02-03-2012, 06:58 PM   #42
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There was a lot of weight reduction talk, but seems like not much follow-through. 3400lbs for the 328 gives no reason to go with that engine size for performance oriented folks. With less than 170lb upcharge to 335. Makes the 3280lb E46 330i look feather light.
Yes. While the performance overall of the F30/N20 looks good, too bad that BMW could not have knocked another 50Kg off the weight.

Go read the Cadillac message boards regarding the upcoming ATS. They are going to bring the (originally fat) Alpha platform ATS in under 3400 lbs with 50/50 weight distro. Supposedly, Cadillac engineers targetted the E46 as the best example of outstanding handling in 3 series and worked to equal or beat it. Gonna have to wait for the tests to see how this goes, but they deserve credit for sweating the details to get the tonnage off this car to try to make it competitive.
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      02-03-2012, 07:11 PM   #43
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Why would i believe cadillacs "claims" Bmw came in over weight, i doubt the cadillac ends up being the same weight they are forecasting
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      02-03-2012, 07:18 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by bryce View Post


a 135i sedan with the overall size of an e46 would be money. i'd buy one tomorrow if it was available
to this day, i am still waiting for a true/real successor to the E30 formula...

The 135i/1M is the closest thing we got, but i would like to have something of a 4 door for more nerdiness... look to the touring for ultimate nerd driving machine!

the Audi A3 sedan was almost it... and by the look of it, Cadillac is on to something with the ATS ...


Instead of inventing new categories of car such as the 3GT etc ...
couldn't they have done a Neo-E30 version ??

I have been waiting for it for 10 years already ...

it's not that difficult... I will sign right away ... especially with the N20 engine!
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