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      04-03-2012, 06:46 PM   #1
stampchez
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Do you hate your steering?

The reviews of the steering have been all over the place so I would like to hear what other F30 owners think.

Let us know what you think of your car's steering. Also please post what suspension/tires you have.

I really don't think it's that bad. It is the best electric set up I have driven. I felt that it was a bit light at first but I have gotten used to it. The feedback isn't as good as a hydraulic set up but I don't feel like there is any trouble with placing the car on line or feeling when to make corrections.

Is it as good as a hydraulic set up? Of course not, but electric is what we're stuck with for fuel economy and emissions reasons. Is it a deal breaker? Certainly not. It's just a different feeling to get used to.

Adaptive M/19" Bridgestone S001

I will be interested to hear what everyone else thinks.
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      04-04-2012, 02:49 AM   #2
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The Sportsteering in comfort mode feels a bit remote and really electric(which it is off course) not really BMWish, but I already got used to that for the last 1.5 years in my ex F10 5 series.

On the other hand, the sport mode is the BMW way to go and doesn't differ very much from the hydraulic steering my former BMW's had. Actually it's very very good. It's beefy, direct and gives you a connected feel to the front wheels, very unelectric imo, very BMWish.

I have the Adaptive suspension, 19"and the Bridgestones fwiw.
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      04-04-2012, 10:14 PM   #3
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I love the steering. Had an e90 sport 335i and now a F30 335i - sport mode in the F30 is very comparable. I'm often in comfort and it's still awesome. I have adaptive M suspension, active steering, and 19's with bridgestones.
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      04-05-2012, 07:51 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin_NL View Post
The Sportsteering in comfort mode feels a bit remote and really electric(which it is off course) not really BMWish, but I already got used to that for the last 1.5 years in my ex F10 5 series.

On the other hand, the sport mode is the BMW way to go and doesn't differ very much from the hydraulic steering my former BMW's had. Actually it's very very good. It's beefy, direct and gives you a connected feel to the front wheels, very unelectric imo, very BMWish.

I have the Adaptive suspension, 19"and the Bridgestones fwiw.

I agree completely with this assesment. Steering in comfort mode took a little getting use to and I'm okay with it now. But, in sport mode the steering feels just like my E90 felt.

I have the Variable sport steering, adaptive suspension, 20" and the Pirellis. fwiw
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      04-05-2012, 09:01 AM   #5
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The variable sport steering really helps a lot, without it, the steering feels worst than the E90's, even in sport mode.
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      04-05-2012, 09:09 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ramendenhall View Post
I agree completely with this assesment. Steering in comfort mode took a little getting use to and I'm okay with it now. But, in sport mode the steering feels just like my E90 felt.

I have the Variable sport steering, adaptive suspension, 20" and the Pirellis. fwiw
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      04-05-2012, 09:11 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The X Men View Post
The variable sport steering really helps a lot, without it, the steering feels worst than the E90's, even in sport mode.
How do you feel like the variable steering helps feel?
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      04-05-2012, 09:20 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin_NL View Post
The Sportsteering in comfort mode feels a bit remote and really electric(which it is off course) not really BMWish, but I already got used to that for the last 1.5 years in my ex F10 5 series.

On the other hand, the sport mode is the BMW way to go and doesn't differ very much from the hydraulic steering my former BMW's had. Actually it's very very good. It's beefy, direct and gives you a connected feel to the front wheels, very unelectric imo, very BMWish.

I have the Adaptive suspension, 19"and the Bridgestones fwiw.
My thoughts exactly. I'm, still waiting on my 328( well , its actually gonna be me wifes car. But she's had track days and done some autocross). We ordered a sportline. I was fortunate enough to have a new sportline 328 for a week while one of my other cars was in for service.I drove the car almost exclusively in sport mode. It seemed to go right where i pointed it . I 'd say if there was anything letting the car down , it was the tires giving up before the suspension or chassis,but thats an easy fix.It didn't seem to matter how I put it into a corner. NIce and clean, A little jerky and dive bomb it sideways, or trail brake through the corner to get the rear around and squeeze on the gas. So if anyone is worried about the steering,,,,,don't believe the hype
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      04-05-2012, 09:45 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stampchez View Post
How do you feel like the variable steering helps feel?
I should say the variable sport steering makes the F30 handle better, but the steering feel is definitely better as well.
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      04-05-2012, 03:00 PM   #10
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Grouphug.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Reznick View Post
My thoughts exactly. I'm, still waiting on my 328( well , its actually gonna be me wifes car. But she's had track days and done some autocross). We ordered a sportline. I was fortunate enough to have a new sportline 328 for a week while one of my other cars was in for service.I drove the car almost exclusively in sport mode. It seemed to go right where i pointed it . I 'd say if there was anything letting the car down , it was the tires giving up before the suspension or chassis,but thats an easy fix.It didn't seem to matter how I put it into a corner. NIce and clean, A little jerky and dive bomb it sideways, or trail brake through the corner to get the rear around and squeeze on the gas. So if anyone is worried about the steering,,,,,don't believe the hype
You can toss the F30 around like an idiot. Just like I did with my former 3 series E36/46/90 etc.
Understeer is very far away(also depending on the tyres) , and my Bridgestones almost don't shreek at all. Not like the tyres of let's say a decade ago. But still you just feel what the F30 is going to do. Anytime.
Slalom, autocross, trackdays(well not exactly, I'd choose a 1M for that). Some daily fun when traffic allows it:Roundabouts and flyovers. In sportmode it just feels alright. Like the former 3 series I had.

What's the point in hating? My ex E90 M3 was maybe 200lbs heavier than my current F30 335i and it too was a marvel around corners/trackdays as well(for it's size/weight and the competition). Only the damn brakes were gone after 5 laps at Assen Moto GP I recall....
About the F30 competition:
Try to toss an A4 around the things I mentioned above. Hate to say it, but it will get boring after 5 minutes for sure. A C350 maybe, after half an hour you think the same thing as in the Audi( I'm not talking RS/AMG stuff here, just the bread and butter F30competition)

ANY F30 is a great car for its purpose: To go from A to B in a rather sporty way. This time with more space/comfort and more electronic gadgets.

And with one push of the button...tadaa.

Cheers
Robin
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      04-05-2012, 08:44 PM   #11
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I know steering "feel" is a hard term to pin down, so I'll ask what I'm really wondering: does the variable sport steering add any weight or other feedback to the steering? From what I've read, it only changes the ratio.

In response to the original question, the steering on our F30 is not as good as either our previous 2009 wagon or our current 2011 coupe. It's not bad, but compared to the E9x cars, it's more distant, less weighty and the feedback is not as well defined.
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      04-05-2012, 08:47 PM   #12
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bringing my car in tomorrow because the steering wheel shakes between 45-70..
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      04-05-2012, 09:00 PM   #13
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bringing my car in tomorrow because the steering wheel shakes between 45-70..
Same! i already had it in and they rebalanced the tires but still shakes, nothing to crazy but noticeable, let me know if they fix it and what it is. thx
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      04-05-2012, 09:15 PM   #14
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I have Sport line standard suspension w/ 18" Goodyear tires. I think the steering is excellent. I have had an E46, and an E90, and this car handles as well or better, and the steering feel is as good or better, since now I can adjust via the COMFORT vs. SPORT settings...
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      04-05-2012, 09:17 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simianspeedster View Post
I know steering "feel" is a hard term to pin down, so I'll ask what I'm really wondering: does the variable sport steering add any weight or other feedback to the steering? From what I've read, it only changes the ratio.

In response to the original question, the steering on our F30 is not as good as either our previous 2009 wagon or our current 2011 coupe. It's not bad, but compared to the E9x cars, it's more distant, less weighty and the feedback is not as well defined.
Switching from COMFORT to SPORTmode not only changes the ratio but also adds weight; makes the steering heavier, a stronger force feedback in race sim terms.
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      04-05-2012, 09:58 PM   #16
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Switching Comfort to Sport changing weighting regardless of steering option.

Variable Sport Steering only changes the steering ratio, not the weight.
At low steering angles (few degrees, it is same ratio as standard, then, from there to 90 deg steering ration progressively increases.
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      04-05-2012, 10:03 PM   #17
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Quote:
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Switching Comfort to Sport changing weighting regardless of steering option.

Variable Sport Steering only changes the steering ratio, not the weight.
At low steering angles (few degrees, it is same ratio as standard, then, from there to 90 deg steering ration progressively increases.
You're right, I read the question differently.
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      04-06-2012, 10:13 AM   #18
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Do you like VSS?

I have 335i Sport on order with Adaptive suspension and just changed order from 8AT to 6MT but not sure about how VSS will feel. Sounds like the steering may take a while to get used to and then once I acclimate, could feel un-natural when I drive our other car.
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      04-06-2012, 10:21 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin_NL View Post
Grouphug.




You can toss the F30 around like an idiot. Just like I did with my former 3 series E36/46/90 etc.
Understeer is very far away(also depending on the tyres) , and my Bridgestones almost don't shreek at all. Not like the tyres of let's say a decade ago. But still you just feel what the F30 is going to do. Anytime.
Slalom, autocross, trackdays(well not exactly, I'd choose a 1M for that). Some daily fun when traffic allows it:Roundabouts and flyovers. In sportmode it just feels alright. Like the former 3 series I had.

What's the point in hating? My ex E90 M3 was maybe 200lbs heavier than my current F30 335i and it too was a marvel around corners/trackdays as well(for it's size/weight and the competition). Only the damn brakes were gone after 5 laps at Assen Moto GP I recall....
About the F30 competition:
Try to toss an A4 around the things I mentioned above. Hate to say it, but it will get boring after 5 minutes for sure. A C350 maybe, after half an hour you think the same thing as in the Audi( I'm not talking RS/AMG stuff here, just the bread and butter F30competition)

ANY F30 is a great car for its purpose: To go from A to B in a rather sporty way. This time with more space/comfort and more electronic gadgets.

And with one push of the button...tadaa.

Cheers
Robin

Exactly!

This car just puts a smile on my face everytime I get behind the wheel.
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      04-06-2012, 12:53 PM   #20
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But the E90 beat the competitor such as the A4 and C350 as well, to say the F30 is a big improvment over the E90 is a stretch at best. Also keep in mind that most of the competitors in this segment are due for redesigns pretty soon.
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      04-06-2012, 04:58 PM   #21
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I'm still curious about this topic. It sounds like we've established the following:

Changing any F30 from the default Comfort setting to Sport changes the weight of the steering (i.e. effort required to steer).

Adding Variable Sport Steering also changes the responsiveness of the steering (i.e. steering ratio) but doesn't change the weight.

Because all F30 steering is electric, it's unlikely that either feature can adjust the feedback of the steering (i.e. how much "road noise," kickback, etc. you feel in the steering) -- that's probably defined by the decoupling of the steering input from the rack. Does that sound about right?

And that last part that's puzzling to me: looking at various features and options on the E9X line, I don't find any mention of steering changes that come from adding the Sport or M-Sport Packages. Of course different suspension and wheels/tires can have a significant difference on steering feel (especially effort and feedback), but it seems like all E9X cars used the same basic steering mechanism, not counting the rare Active Steering option.

Does this sound accurate or is there some suggestion that the steering was modified on various E9X models or trims?
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      04-06-2012, 05:27 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simianspeedster View Post
I'm still curious about this topic. It sounds like we've established the following:

Changing any F30 from the default Comfort setting to Sport changes the weight of the steering (i.e. effort required to steer).

Adding Variable Sport Steering also changes the responsiveness of the steering (i.e. steering ratio) but doesn't change the weight.

Because all F30 steering is electric, it's unlikely that either feature can adjust the feedback of the steering (i.e. how much "road noise," kickback, etc. you feel in the steering) -- that's probably defined by the decoupling of the steering input from the rack. Does that sound about right?

And that last part that's puzzling to me: looking at various features and options on the E9X line, I don't find any mention of steering changes that come from adding the Sport or M-Sport Packages. Of course different suspension and wheels/tires can have a significant difference on steering feel (especially effort and feedback), but it seems like all E9X cars used the same basic steering mechanism, not counting the rare Active Steering option.

Does this sound accurate or is there some suggestion that the steering was modified on various E9X models or trims?
You are absolutely correct!

The steering "feel" is the same in all modes as far as communication goes- the weight is what changes (less electric assist). The communicative feedback is limited until the wheels are about to break loose; there is enough info to to feel the car and safely correct.

The F30 chassis unlike the E46 and E90 is more neutral from the start as the engineers did not need to dial in understeer for the "safety" of the masses as DSC is now standard and that takes care of inducing understeer. The car is much more tossable and the balance point in a slide is where it was in the E90 M3 which is ideal for a sedan, right behind the front seat. (Get rid of the staggered tires and it helps greatly!)

The chassis is very impressive. Many have said BMW cheapened the suspension by going to steel in the rear- the real reason was increased stiffness and added weight to the rear for ideal weight balance.

Do I like the new EPS- yes and no. What many think of road feel (in most cars) is really noise- it doesn't provide you with any needed information (like being in a room with the Fan humming), and what the steering now communicates is the information you need to make a driving adjustment (Fan is clunking so you better duck or get out of dodge). What this means is that it provides you with enough to do what you need to but that is about it- I'd prefer a more progressive nature to it, a bit more communicative change like the change in the hum rather than going to the clunk.

It is leaps and bounds over the F10 but it is also a different customer- the Z4 35IS has the best EPS rack and if they replicate that in the F30 it would be sensational.

-M

E9X line only had the different rack steering with the M3 and the horrendous Active Steering system.
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