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      07-17-2012, 08:17 AM   #1
LAnderson23
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Long Term Effects of A.S.S. System

Is anyone else concerned about the long term effects of the Auto Start Stop (A.S.S.) system? I realize that BMW built the starter to withstand the extra bear of all the extra on/off cycles, but what about the engine itself? This is kind of un-chartered territory, right? Do we have any idea how engines handle this kind of wear over time? Has BMW taken that into account?

I like the idea of the feature, and I don't mind how it is implemented (in the MT, at least) but I am worried that in 7 or 8 years I could have serious engine problems. Maybe I'm worried over nothing, but a new feature like this could have serious ramifications over the long-haul if BMW didn't take the necessary precautions.

Is there any official line from BMW as to how they engineered the engine to withstand this kind of wear & tear? (Independent of the starter) If I'm not mistaken, the 335 uses the same engine as the 390 335, and that engine wasn't built for A.S.S. so it makes me think they just threw on the feature without actually seeing how it effects the engine over the long term.
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      07-17-2012, 08:33 AM   #2
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It would seem virtually impossible to NOT add some long term stress to the components of the starting system. I am going to get in the habit of turning it off as soon as I start the car ( unless someone comes up w/ a better work around).

Its one of the first things I intend to show my wife. I know I will be "getting the call" when she uses the car the first time and it "dies" at a stop light.

Last edited by emtrey; 07-17-2012 at 08:39 AM.
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      07-17-2012, 08:51 AM   #3
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I would be fairly confident that BMW has carried out extensive testing both in real cars and 'on the rig' to ensure that ASS does not have a negative impact on engine/starter motor longevity.

Could be that I'm naive in that respect, but my assumption is that BMW don't want to be hit with lots of claims saying the engine/starter wasn't up to the job?
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      07-17-2012, 09:13 AM   #4
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This is not the first car in the world with this system.
I know of at least 10 year old cars with this system and I haven't heard anything related to the engine on those.
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      07-17-2012, 09:23 AM   #5
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BMW put a significantly stronger starter motor in the F30. I remember reading that when it first came out. I'll try to find the article.
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      07-17-2012, 09:26 AM   #6
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Haven't Europeans been using ASS for like over 20 years?
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      07-17-2012, 09:41 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerjph View Post
BMW put a significantly stronger starter motor in the F30. I remember reading that when it first came out. I'll try to find the article.
I know they have a stronger starter motor, that's not what I'm worried about, but the actual engine itself.
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      07-17-2012, 09:48 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LAnderson23 View Post
I know they have a stronger starter motor, that's not what I'm worried about, but the actual engine itself.
The engine won't be off long enough for the oil to drain to the oil pan. THere should be a good amount of lubrication left to protect the engine components. That's about the only issue I would see with stopping and starting.
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      07-17-2012, 10:09 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ric124 View Post
Haven't Europeans been using ASS for like over 20 years?
As I said, I know of several models going back at least to the 90's that has ASS. So the problems that might occur are well known.
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      07-17-2012, 10:27 AM   #10
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Quote:
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Haven't Europeans been using ASS for like over 20 years?
Yes and I heard they like A.S.S. because of the fuel savings.
BMW has been giving A.S.S. to Europe for many years now and I am sure if there were issues we would have heard about it and they would not bring the A.S.S. to the US...
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      07-17-2012, 11:04 AM   #11
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I think you might be a little on the old man approach here. As the other guys have said here, A.S.S. has been around in cars for a long time. Most all hybrid cars use it.

As someone else said, the starter is much bigger, so no worries there, but also, the transmission also has a different pump, that can accomodate the lubrication needs of that. It can pump the transmission fluid up into the transmission much faster than the standard non-A.S.S. ZF transmission can.

So, yes, its obvious they have done their homework. BMW has also been working with other car manufactures (GM, Citroen, Peugeot) for a while now on hybrid systems, so its not like this is a new venture for them.
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      07-17-2012, 11:28 AM   #12
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I'd turn it off, at least with an automatic, just because of how rough and shaky the startup is.

Might be better w/a stick, but I've never tried it, so I don't know.
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      07-17-2012, 02:39 PM   #13
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They say history repeats itself.

Not as much or as often as some forum threads, it seems!!
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      07-17-2012, 02:43 PM   #14
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Ok, sounds like I'm worried about nothing then. Thanks for all the replies!
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      07-18-2012, 03:13 PM   #15
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Has anyone driven the new car with A S S? I was a passenger in one and found it annoying especially in trying to drive across town. The restart is not smooth and often thought that if anyone attempted a carjacking, we'd be screwed!
Can this feature be turned off?
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      07-18-2012, 03:33 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonrick1 View Post
Has anyone driven the new car with A S S? I was a passenger in one and found it annoying especially in trying to drive across town. The restart is not smooth and often thought that if anyone attempted a carjacking, we'd be screwed!
Can this feature be turned off?
Both my 328i and my Porsche 911 Carrera S has ASS. While you can hardly tell when the Porsche shuts down and restarts, the BMW does give a violent jerk when restarting. I read an article in one of the auto magazines that BMW is using the oldest technology with their ASS, which caused the magazine to rate it the lowest among all car manufacturers currently using ASS. One of the reasons that they are using old technology is because BMW was a pioneer of the technology and has been perfecting it for quite some time. However, it looks like there are better ways of doing it, as most other cars do not have the jerk when restarting that BMW has.

Living in Florida, I usually turn the ASS off because my car has to restart usually within 10 seconds because of the heat and the need for the car to maintain cabin temperature. When it gets cooler in the fall and winter, I will probably use ASS a lot, as I do a lot of city driving. Personally, the jerk doesn't bother me a bit, but I have had some passengers become annoyed with it.
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      07-18-2012, 05:11 PM   #17
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I hope someone will alert BMW to the possibility that this system might cause more engine starts. I'm sure that idea has escaped them until now.
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      07-18-2012, 05:34 PM   #18
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Quote:
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?..and I am sure if there were issues we would have heard about it and they would not bring the A.S.S. to the US...
Yea, BMW would never do that. They never issue recalls. And I have 100% faith in the employees at BMW.

From the sound of it, I'm guessing some of you people have never worked in a product development and manufacturing environment.
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      07-18-2012, 05:49 PM   #19
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There is no real issue with BMW ASS. The engine is completely new and can withstand the constant on/off with no issue. The jerky starting of the engine for the ASS is annoying but inevitable. The engine is so efficient and powerful + the F30 is so light that the engine start jerk could not be contained without reducing its amazing 2.0L I4 performance. This is the true BMW way of thinking Performance is Priority. Remember the 4 door hatch GTI MK2 16v weighed 1130kg. This 4 door luxury saloon weighs 1545kg and is powered by the same size engine.
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      07-18-2012, 07:55 PM   #20
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Funny this has been brought up as it was a recent NATOPS discussion regarding proper aircraft engine shutdown procedures. The bottom line is that the issue lies within the ball bearings, and hot oil cooking and pitting them over time. Years ago I had a 3000GT VR-4 and installed an HKS "turbo timer" which essentially keeps your engine running for a set time after you've locked up and left the vehicle. This allows the the oil to cool off, preserving the life of the bearings.
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      07-20-2012, 03:43 AM   #21
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I honestly like BMW A.S.S's on both f25 and f30. Just need to know where and when to apply it
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      07-20-2012, 06:14 AM   #22
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Lol, you guys are killing me with this acronym. Why can't you just call it start stop or SS?
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