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      01-31-2013, 12:10 PM   #1
shivaswrath
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Thumbs up Autoweek: Furious 3 Review/Update, interesting residual value numbers

I get autoweek on my iDevice, and was surprised to see the 2/4 update give some fascinating stats on the 335i (modern):
60-0 braking was 112.1 feet (I always wondered why people upgraded to the M Performance brakes given how strong my 335i ones felt!)
0-60: 5.2 seconds (slow?)
5 year residual: $16,510!!

That last little stat was most fascinating...I'm planning on owning her for 6 years because I got the extended warranty, but it makes me wonder when I hit 100k, my car will be worth more than likely at the most $10k!
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      01-31-2013, 12:24 PM   #2
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Buying cars new has never been a smart financial proposition, it's got more to do with the luxury of being the first one to fart on the leather seats.
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      01-31-2013, 12:30 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shivaswrath View Post
I get autoweek on my iDevice, and was surprised to see the 2/4 update give some fascinating stats on the 335i (modern):
60-0 braking was 112.1 feet (I always wondered why people upgraded to the M Performance brakes given how strong my 335i ones felt!)
0-60: 5.2 seconds (slow?)
5 year residual: $16,510!!

That last little stat was most fascinating...I'm planning on owning her for 6 years because I got the extended warranty, but it makes me wonder when I hit 100k, my car will be worth more than likely at the most $10k!
How many E90 335s do you see on the market available at those prices? It seems fairly accurate for most 5/6 year old cars over 100K.
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      01-31-2013, 02:02 PM   #4
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what do you expect? when buying you expect below invoice pricing but then you expect the resale to stay high? sorry, doesnt work like that most times unless the car becomes in higher demand for some reason than when it sold new.
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      01-31-2013, 02:33 PM   #5
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I just sold my 2006 E90 325i for 10k private party. 107k miles. Exactly 7 years old.
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      01-31-2013, 02:37 PM   #6
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Buying a new car is financially stupid.
Buying a new car is emotionally heavenly.
Nice to be stupid in Heaven.
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      01-31-2013, 02:48 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by kobechrome View Post
I just sold my 2006 E90 325i for 10k private party. 107k miles. Exactly 7 years old.
Just curious. What was your purchase price new?
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      01-31-2013, 02:48 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by F30AM View Post
Buying a new car is financially stupid.
Buying a new car is emotionally heavenly.
Nice to be stupid in Heaven.
+1 lol.
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      01-31-2013, 02:53 PM   #9
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Just curious. What was your purchase price new?
I think it was around $33,500 (not including taxes/title/fees). It was pretty barebones and I got $500 over invoice.
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      01-31-2013, 03:37 PM   #10
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I can't believe I'm hearing all this talk. Buying a car IS a smarter decision if you plan on keeping it any more than 5 years. Anyone with a little background in finance will tell you that!

Seems like people who are leasing are trying to justify. Leasing is almost ALWAYS worse, unless you run your own business.
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      01-31-2013, 04:16 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkTrigger View Post
I can't believe I'm hearing all this talk. Buying a car IS a smarter decision if you plan on keeping it any more than 5 years. Anyone with a little background in finance will tell you that!

Seems like people who are leasing are trying to justify. Leasing is almost ALWAYS worse, unless you run your own business.
I don't think the argument is lease vs buying. From a pure financials perspective, buying probably wins out every time. I think the point the poster is trying to make is that buying NEW is "stupid" when compared with buying USED. The most economical way to acquire cars is to buy a 3 yr old used car (when depreciation hits hardest) and then drive that thing to its death, into the ground, sputtering, crawling all the way to the car's grave - then repeat cycle.

However this explanation doesn't account for lifestyle, culture, happiness, what people want to do - its just a pure numbers game. If it makes you happy to have new cars, or lease and drive new cars every 3 years - more power to you if you have the financial means. People have the right to spend their $$ however they want to achieve happiness. Plus, the guy arguing against leasing cars surely has other areas in his lifestyle where there is waste/excess - so its all relative and in the end not really that "stupid."
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      01-31-2013, 05:12 PM   #12
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Good post! I bought new even though I know it isn't a good choice financially. Didn't even bother telling my financial planner as he wouldn't approve. Doesn't matter - it gives me pleasure to drive a brand new car optioned out the way I want it and broken in nicely. I'll probably keep it 5 to 8 years and start over. I don't really expect much from the residual and will probably sell it to a friend or family member who will get a really good deal and a very well looked after used car.
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      01-31-2013, 05:19 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkTrigger View Post
I can't believe I'm hearing all this talk. Buying a car IS a smarter decision if you plan on keeping it any more than 5 years. Anyone with a little background in finance will tell you that!

Seems like people who are leasing are trying to justify. Leasing is almost ALWAYS worse, unless you run your own business.
Nah. Buying brand new is never the best option, regardless of how long you keep it. You're eating every penny of the depreciation which is a very big nut. Just try trading your 6 month car to see what I'm talking about. The sweet spot is in the 2-4 year range depending on the car. It allows you to potentially be in a "current generation" model without the upfront costs.

Lease vs. buy has many different metrics that come into the decision with numerous pros and cons for both. It can even make sense if you don't own your own business. Anyone with an actual background in finance will tell you that...
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      01-31-2013, 05:26 PM   #14
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The mitigating aspect at the moment is the very rapid evolution in features in cars, both in safety and performance. Cars from just a few years ago, as far as I know, are not as smart, and link much less smoothly to smart phones. So it costs money, but a 3-yr-old used car is not comparable to a new car.

The corollary is that in few years, the cars will do even much more.
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      01-31-2013, 05:29 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnVidale View Post
The mitigating aspect at the moment is the very rapid evolution in features in cars, both in safety and performance. Cars from just a few years ago, as far as I know, are not as smart, and link much less smoothly to smart phones. So it costs money, but a 3-yr-old used car is not comparable to a new car.

The corollary is that in few years, the cars will do even much more.
True - but in the end those are all creature comforts (of which I myself love) - but from a economics perspective - a car gets you from point A to point B. How comfortable you want to be during that time is up to each person.
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      01-31-2013, 05:34 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by kobechrome View Post
True - but in the end those are all creature comforts (of which I myself love) - but from a economics perspective - a car gets you from point A to point B. How comfortable you want to be during that time is up to each person.
Some of those features - lane changing warnings, automatic high beams, hands-free calling, navigation, contact lists, even dialable mellow driving, improved traction control - have safety and productivity advantages, offering more than just comfort.

But my old car was 17 years old, so maybe I exaggerate the pace of changes.
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      01-31-2013, 05:49 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shivaswrath View Post
I get autoweek on my iDevice, and was surprised to see the 2/4 update give some fascinating stats on the 335i (modern):
60-0 braking was 112.1 feet (I always wondered why people upgraded to the M Performance brakes given how strong my 335i ones felt!)
My guess is the tested car had all season tires, which always result in longer stopping distances compared to summer performance tires.
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      01-31-2013, 06:14 PM   #18
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0-60: 5.2 seconds (slow?)

No, the 4.7 people hang their hat on was not from a standstill.
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      01-31-2013, 08:34 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kobechrome View Post
True - but in the end those are all creature comforts (of which I myself love) - but from a economics perspective - a car gets you from point A to point B. How comfortable you want to be during that time is up to each person.
If your goal is to steer the vehicle from A to B without causing major disaster ... why BMW?

Why not $10,000 cheaper car? I don't get it ...

What I want to say is that economic perspective means nothing. You get what you want, then you justify "needs" for your decision. Or your "smarts". Either way, you just do what you want and no matter the arguments from other people, you are "correct". That's all.
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      01-31-2013, 09:23 PM   #20
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[quote=Mark_K]
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobechrome View Post
True - but in the end those are all creature comforts (of which I myself love) - but from a economics perspective - a car gets you from point A to point B. How comfortable you want to be during that time is up to each person.

We violently agree. I buy a BMW because I want to go from point A to point B in as exciting and as luxurious manner as possible. That being said, facts are facts and economics do matter... Maybe just not to BMW owners.
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      01-31-2013, 09:49 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkTrigger View Post
I can't believe I'm hearing all this talk. Buying a car IS a smarter decision if you plan on keeping it any more than 5 years. Anyone with a little background in finance will tell you that!

Seems like people who are leasing are trying to justify. Leasing is almost ALWAYS worse, unless you run your own business.
Buying is cheaper if you plan to keep your car for 6+ years, not 5, provided you pay for the car in fewer than 5 years.

If you are one who will have a car note every month and then trade in your purchased car, leasing will be cheaper always.

If you buy your car and keep it for 10 years, you are financially better off than in either of the two scenarios above.\

After a certain point, you don't really lose much in car value at all. For example, in 2007, I was offered $5000 for my 1993 318i with 158K miles on it. I paid a bit over $20K for it new in 1993. (I didn't accept the offer, I gave the car to a relative.) I've seen several ads on the Internet where they are still selling for about that price.

So, by simple math, that comes out to around $1000/year in value lost on the car. So, it seems if you keep your car for a very long time, you'll be quite satisfied with the price you can sell it for even when it's very old. I know I would be very happy if in 2021 or so, someone offers me $5000 or $6000 for my E92. Here in 2013, though, $15000-$16000 feels like I'm being ripped off.
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      01-31-2013, 10:01 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_K View Post
If your goal is to steer the vehicle from A to B without causing major disaster ... why BMW?

Why not $10,000 cheaper car? I don't get it ...

What I want to say is that economic perspective means nothing. You get what you want, then you justify "needs" for your decision. Or your "smarts". Either way, you just do what you want and no matter the arguments from other people, you are "correct". That's all.
If economics were the primary factor in buying a car, BMW, and MB and Audi, and quite a few others, would simple be out of business. After all, you can, for the price of one typical BMW 3 series, buy two new cars that'll reliably get you from point a to point b in reasonable comfort. Those two cars will surely outlast our one BMW.

I try to get my BMWs as inexpensively as I can, but that's close toh the end of the economic aspect of my buying decision. I do try not to spend more than I really need to in order to get the things I want, by which I mean, I will check out a 1, 3, 5 and 6 series car and choose the one that costs the least and yet that I like and fulfills all my functional as well as emotional needs. I won't just buy a 5 or 6 because I can afford it and it seems cushier or more this or that if, say, the 3 or the 1 seems perfectly fine to me as well. But that's about how far anything economic gets into my car buying decision.
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