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Originally Posted by johnung
"Tap them once" does not mean every time that you want to stop! "Tap them once" means when you first start the car and start moving when it's like 20 degrees outside. The first time you touch the brakes the Hawk 5.0 pads are ice cold so maybe they work at 80% the very first time that you touch them, then they warm up instantly. Then they are at 100% for the remainder of your drive until you park again for hours and hours in sub freezing temperatures. Nothing about this is unusual for any brake pads when they have been sitting over night at 20 degrees
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Most performance pads need to be at least warm before they equal stock pads for bite in my experience, which is why I'm asking the question. I actually found the friction/temp chart for Hawk pads after you posted and from what I can see the 5.0 are very much not the pads for me, with the friction rating below 50c of c0.2 being virtually useless, in line with most ceramic pads. In fact the HP Plus would appear to be the best they offer for cold bite. Now granted, the 5.0 does improve rapidly with temperature but that's still not what I want in this car. In another car they may be the perfect pad but absolute stone cold performance is what I need. Performance brake pads are fantastic, but if you've barely touched the brakes in five miles then they are going to be cold. Maybe not 5c, but they're certainly not going to be 100c, and that's where performance pads start to work better.
Now what I would be interested in is some charts showing friction of OEM pads from cold (rather than the performance pad charts which frequently start at 100+c) as they're frequently touted as 0.3-0.4 but given there's no quantification of this data it's hard to know whether they're talking about the pads from a Nissan Micra or a Nissan Skyline!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddamoo
If you want B-Road blast brakes that will stop you dead in an emergency, some well branded stock pads surely cannot be beaten. Brembo, Jurid, Textar, Febi Bilstein, Bosch are my goto's.
Every single fast road pad ive ever tried has always been completely crap when cold, and was just a question of 'how much' warmup you needed to get them working! As Ennoch says tho, Mintex and Ferodo are great for that provided you add a little heat. The Mintex emit disgusting brown dust like crazy.
Wouldnt touch EBC with a barge pole. Bought several cars with them and seen many where the pad material has separated or disintegrated.
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Yup, I'm with you on EBC. The reason I went for another set of Oranges on the Impreza when I rebuilt the brakes a few years ago with new seals etc was because the first set was brilliant. And the reason I had them was they were so cheap they were worth the risk. I'll try the blues but I still suspect I'll be going elsewhere. Their biggest issue is consistency.
I had actually forgotten about how bad the dust was on the Mintex, I had the 1155's in the AP's on my Vectra years ago and that thing had white wheels.
Ultimately I think the problem is that as soon as soon as you start talking about braking performance everyone goes on about back road hoons and smoking brakes. I simply don't care about that type of driving in this car, I have another for that. Don't get me wrong, this car still gets driven quickly but it simply doesn't suit being last of the late brakers and so I can drive around deficiencies in areas like fade and autobahn speed stops. I reckon a set of stock OEM spec Ferodo's may be getting ordered here. If they're worse than OEM then I'll reconsider my options but it does seem that my prior experience of fast road pads has been confirmed and that if you want greater high speed friction you need to put up with less when cool. And I'm not willing to put up with that on this car. At the end of the day every user has slightly different requirements, and in any case the biggest thing with this brake change will be getting fresh stuff on the front axle to replace the crusty mess on there just now.