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      11-02-2018, 06:53 PM   #1
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Race prep 335i

Hey everyone, just a quick into. I have been road racing for almost 11 years. Advanced HPDE courses. I used to race my f80 m3 but now I am building a daily/track n55 ewg msport 335i. The 335i seems very balanced. My question is what are the sway bars everyone are running and do you guys really run 245/255 tires? I'm just used to the f80 platform and running big wheels and tires. Any of you guys race with the bm3 tune on track? How does the car handle race sessions with the added boost and heat?
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      11-05-2018, 06:42 PM   #2
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do you have a 335i with the hot climate package (no fog lights)? I have that package and never had a problem with heat. I spray WMI on the track with a stage 2 turbo. ~440 whp. As for sway bars I am not driving at that level to offer any advice. However my engine is still running strong, I get blackstone reports nothing jumping out to get worried about yet.

I am running 245 R 18 RE71Rs probably going to bump up to 255.
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      11-06-2018, 09:42 AM   #3
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do you have a 335i with the hot climate package (no fog lights)? I have that package and never had a problem with heat. I spray WMI on the track with a stage 2 turbo. ~440 whp. As for sway bars I am not driving at that level to offer any advice. However my engine is still running strong, I get blackstone reports nothing jumping out to get worried about yet.

I am running 245 R 18 RE71Rs probably going to bump up to 255.
No fog lights here. So you race with stage 2 turbos, how does the car feel after 20 minute sessions? Any issues with heat? Do you run race gas to prevent detonation?
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      11-06-2018, 10:39 AM   #4
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Very interested what race-ready brakes your vehicle has.
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      11-06-2018, 05:32 PM   #5
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Very interested what race-ready brakes your vehicle has.
Pads and fluid is all you need. Carbon and bbk is overkill.
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      11-06-2018, 05:40 PM   #6
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No fog lights here. So you race with stage 2 turbos, how does the car feel after 20 minute sessions? Any issues with heat? Do you run race gas to prevent detonation?
Running 93 and water methanol injection. I use about 2 gallons over the course of the day (4 25 minute sessions) The car hauls the mail the entire session never feel it heat soaking. I do monitor the IAT and it stays in check (under 120F) when it's mid 80's.

Never had a oil or water temp issue. But I am not "racing" so I might let out for point by and have opportunities to cool down a bit that a real race car won't get.
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      11-06-2018, 06:52 PM   #7
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Running 93 and water methanol injection. I use about 2 gallons over the course of the day (4 25 minute sessions) The car hauls the mail the entire session never feel it heat soaking. I do monitor the IAT and it stays in check (under 120F) when it's mid 80's.

Never had a oil or water temp issue. But I am not "racing" so I might let out for point by and have opportunities to cool down a bit that a real race car won't get.
Any oil starvation issues?
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      11-09-2018, 12:55 PM   #8
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This post made me sit up in my seat and smile.... nice to see others running the EWG N55 335i hard : ) We should talk....

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      11-09-2018, 02:34 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by 97supratt View Post
Hey everyone, just a quick into. I have been road racing for almost 11 years. Advanced HPDE courses. I used to race my f80 m3 but now I am building a daily/track n55 ewg msport 335i. The 335i seems very balanced. My question is what are the sway bars everyone are running and do you guys really run 245/255 tires? I'm just used to the f80 platform and running big wheels and tires. Any of you guys race with the bm3 tune on track? How does the car handle race sessions with the added boost and heat?
I just started tracking my F80 M3 and I'm curious what you think of the 335i vs the F80. I find the F80 very competent in double duty, however, it's not my daily, but it's not a dedicated track toy either. Why did you chose to switch? Cost? Should I consider a e92 or used F30?
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      11-09-2018, 03:01 PM   #10
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This post made me sit up in my seat and smile.... nice to see others running the EWG N55 335i hard : ) We should talk....

Love this pic of your car. I actually saved it hahaha. Which recaros you run?
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      11-09-2018, 03:06 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmg View Post
I just started tracking my F80 M3 and I'm curious what you think of the 335i vs the F80. I find the F80 very competent in double duty, however, it's not my daily, but it's not a dedicated track toy either. Why did you chose to switch? Cost? Should I consider a e92 or used F30?
I had the same dillema. The M lineup will always be more race oriented but the issue I have with M's is that the rotors are still too soft for race pads, the dampers cannot be lowered with "springs". Any M vehicle is setup for perfection from factory. The 335 seems to react better to mods and is really fun in the corners.

For a lot less you can just get a c5 z06 and be done with it. Hahah
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      11-09-2018, 03:37 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by 97supratt View Post
I had the same dillema. The M lineup will always be more race oriented but the issue I have with M's is that the rotors are still too soft for race pads, the dampers cannot be lowered with "springs". Any M vehicle is setup for perfection from factory. The 335 seems to react better to mods and is really fun in the corners.
So the cost offset going from a new F80 to a used 335i makes up for the upgraded rotors and mods on the F30?


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For a lot less you can just get a c5 z06 and be done with it. Hahah
LOL true
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      11-09-2018, 03:44 PM   #13
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sub'd just because this is a great thread
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      11-09-2018, 04:51 PM   #14
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So the cost offset going from a new F80 to a used 335i makes up for the upgraded rotors and mods on the F30?
It just makes it that much more exciting.

I mean, the f80 isn't the quickest on a road course either compared to the gt350 and a few others in that price range. The diff is great and i love the engine and transmission. But if i'm paying 75k+, it better deliver everywhere!!
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      11-09-2018, 08:01 PM   #15
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Love this pic of your car. I actually saved it hahaha. Which recaros you run?
Thanks! I always look through the track photographer site to see how the photos turn out. Usually they're all pretty meh... but this one from Watkins Glen really stood out.

I'm running a pair of Recaro Profi SPG XLs. I'm 6'3", 200#, and they fit me very well. with Brey-Krause mounts, the seat ergonomics are outstanding; I have a ton of clearance for my helmet.

To answer your original questions, I'm running 265/35 RE-71R tires on 18x9.5 Apex ARC-8 wheels and H&R sway bars. The rear sway is fixed, and the front has two adjustment holes; I'm running the stiffer of the two settings. I've been very happy with them. The F30 got a lot of criticism for being too soft, but once the suspension is sorted out, the car is an absolute blast to track. The way I have it set up, the balance is exceptional, and it's incredibly sure-footed and stable.

If you're curious about my other mods, they're all listed here.
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      11-09-2018, 09:11 PM   #16
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Thanks! I always look through the track photographer site to see how the photos turn out. Usually they're all pretty meh... but this one from Watkins Glen really stood out.

I'm running a pair of Recaro Profi SPG XLs. I'm 6'3", 200#, and they fit me very well. with Brey-Krause mounts, the seat ergonomics are outstanding; I have a ton of clearance for my helmet.

To answer your original question, I'm running H&R sway bars. The rear is fixed, and the front has two adjustment holes; I'm running the stiffer of the two settings. I've been very happy with them. The F30 got a lot of criticism for being too soft, but once the suspension is sorted out, the car is an absolute blast to track. The way I have it set up, the balance is exceptional, and it's incredible sure-footed and stable.

If you're curious about my other mods, they're all listed here.
Very nice setup! I like that harness bar.
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      11-20-2018, 03:15 PM   #17
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A little late to this thread, but I've been running Megan Racing sway bars on my F30 for two years now. They're the same size as the H&R's and have the same adjustments. Fixed in rear, two holes up front. Totally transformed the car on the track.

It's funny that the F30 is being favored over the F80 for the track. I've been looking at F80's nonstop lately, waiting for them to depreciate some more so I can trade up. I can't stand my RWD F30's open differential, but by the time I spend the near $3k to have an LSD installed, I may as well just wait and put that money towards an F80. Am I crazy, or should I just spend the money on the LSD and keep tracking the F30?
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      11-20-2018, 03:46 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Niart906 View Post
A little late to this thread, but I've been running Megan Racing sway bars on my F30 for two years now. They're the same size as the H&R's and have the same adjustments. Fixed in rear, two holes up front. Totally transformed the car on the track.

It's funny that the F30 is being favored over the F80 for the track. I've been looking at F80's nonstop lately, waiting for them to depreciate some more so I can trade up. I can't stand my RWD F30's open differential, but by the time I spend the near $3k to have an LSD installed, I may as well just wait and put that money towards an F80. Am I crazy, or should I just spend the money on the LSD and keep tracking the F30?
The F30 can certainly be a hell of a lot of fun on track. I've been pondering your question for a few minutes, and I think the answer depends on your goals.

If you want a fast car for the street that's well-sorted for casual track use without any mods, then obviously the F80 is a better choice in terms of both power and handling. But if your goals involve getting a bit more serious on track, then you'd still likely be modding an F80 as well... in which case it may make more sense to just stick with your current F30. Other than the diff, most of what I've modded on my F30 is more performance-optimized than the corresponding part that comes on an F80 stock... and I've modded a lot. Maybe I've just come to the point where I'm not happy with a car until I've modded it a bunch anyway.

Personally, I like having a track-focused F30 that can run with the F8Xs... and it would be good to see more out there!
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      11-20-2018, 07:26 PM   #19
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The F30 can certainly be a hell of a lot of fun on track. I've been pondering your question for a few minutes, and I think the answer depends on your goals.

If you want a fast car for the street that's well-sorted for casual track use without any mods, then obviously the F80 is a better choice in terms of both power and handling. But if your goals involve getting a bit more serious on track, then you'd still likely be modding an F80 as well... in which case it may make more sense to just stick with your current F30. Other than the diff, most of what I've modded on my F30 is more performance-optimized than the corresponding part that comes on an F80 stock... and I've modded a lot. Maybe I've just come to the point where I'm not happy with a car until I've modded it a bunch anyway.

Personally, I like having a track-focused F30 that can run with the F8Xs... and it would be good to see more out there!
You and I seem alot a like lol. I too prefer a modded car in general.

If I were to upgrade to an F80 I'd also buy a beater as I'm not looking to DD an F80. I'd lose too much to depreciation. But if I were to keep the F30, I could look at adding an LSD and eventually buy another E46 M3 dedicated for track work/weekends. I love my F30, and have driven a bunch of F80's, but I still want another E46 M3 at some point in my life.

Not sure what track groups you typically run with, but I've been using Track Night in America the last few years. I typically do Pocono a few times a summer if you're ever in the area. I'd love to get down to NJMP at some point this coming year too. Would love to compare mods.
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      11-20-2018, 11:07 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DVC View Post
The F30 can certainly be a hell of a lot of fun on track. I've been pondering your question for a few minutes, and I think the answer depends on your goals.

If you want a fast car for the street that's well-sorted for casual track use without any mods, then obviously the F80 is a better choice in terms of both power and handling. But if your goals involve getting a bit more serious on track, then you'd still likely be modding an F80 as well... in which case it may make more sense to just stick with your current F30. Other than the diff, most of what I've modded on my F30 is more performance-optimized than the corresponding part that comes on an F80 stock... and I've modded a lot. Maybe I've just come to the point where I'm not happy with a car until I've modded it a bunch anyway.

Personally, I like having a track-focused F30 that can run with the F8Xs... and it would be good to see more out there!

You would think the perfect street/track car would be the F80 but the DCT clunks, in sport mode the transmission jumps because of the jerky engine response (race engine). The dampers are super super sensitive so if you change springs, your top hats will make noise (not if but when).

The diff is good but not the best. Under braking or off throttle it can be tricky. The F80 can get expensive very quickly if you do track duty.
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      11-21-2018, 12:09 PM   #21
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You and I seem alot a like lol. I too prefer a modded car in general.

If I were to upgrade to an F80 I'd also buy a beater as I'm not looking to DD an F80. I'd lose too much to depreciation. But if I were to keep the F30, I could look at adding an LSD and eventually buy another E46 M3 dedicated for track work/weekends. I love my F30, and have driven a bunch of F80's, but I still want another E46 M3 at some point in my life.

Not sure what track groups you typically run with, but I've been using Track Night in America the last few years. I typically do Pocono a few times a summer if you're ever in the area. I'd love to get down to NJMP at some point this coming year too. Would love to compare mods.
Ha - I have been wanting to pick up and e46 M3 for a dedicated track car for a looong time. But the F30 has been so rewarding on track, that I just haven't felt compelled to make the switch yet.

I usually run with BMW CCA, but I've been thinking of switching it up. I'm probably 45 mins from Pocono, but I've never run there... I always end up at NJMP, Summit, Watkins or Lime Rock. Would be great to connect for an event next season.
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      11-21-2018, 12:22 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by 97supratt View Post
You would think the perfect street/track car would be the F80 but the DCT clunks, in sport mode the transmission jumps because of the jerky engine response (race engine). The dampers are super super sensitive so if you change springs, your top hats will make noise (not if but when).

The diff is good but not the best. Under braking or off throttle it can be tricky. The F80 can get expensive very quickly if you do track duty.
I wasn't aware of any of those things specifically, but I'm actually not surprised. M cars nowadays seem to employ so much 'tech' to make for a fast street car, which ends up making them a bit harder to work with for a track setup. And if you strip all the M tech out (diff, EDC dampers, etc.) and replace it with something better suited for the track, then there's a case to be made for just starting off with the 335 anyway (especially if you already have one).

To my point above, I recently drove the new F90 M5, and was so disappointed... It's the pinnacle of technology, but the overall feel was not enjoyable at all to me. Even as a street car, I found the performance characteristics to be far too 'tech-infused' - terrible feel in both acceleration and braking (like on/off buttons); and steering/weight transition were not to my liking either. While modern ABS and traction control systems are a huge improvement from older systems, most cars are set up overall to impress the average person on a test drive more than excel on track. My 335 became so much better when I swapped the EDC dampers for coil overs, coded out the eLSD and various brake assist nannies, etc.... and my next step is to get linear throttle mapping (same profile for comfort, Sport and Sport+) when I finally get around to doing a flash tune.
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