[tony20009]

Originally Posted by noro

That's great! Total dollars saved a month: $3.56

How about cancelling that gym membership he never uses.


Joking aside, I don't know you or your son, but I find it a bit "silly" when somebody invests into a car this expensive and then proceeds to turn into a cheapo when it comes to gas.

Check one of the other posts I made in the thread. I'm not the one being cheap; I provide my kid with more than enough money to buy premium fuel, and premium just about everything else that he wants to buy. I don't know why he wants to cheap out on the gas, but I did what to give him a good answer based on something others have actually experienced, rather than on what I or others just happened to believe based on reason only. We both are smart enough to reason that premium is probably the right thing to use, but neither of us knew whether no using premium has negative affects that folks observed because they tried not using premium.

BTW, he doesn't have gym membership. He's in college; it has more equipment and space than nearly any public gym. LOL ( I know you just mentioned that to underscore your point, and not as a serious alternative. )

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by tony20009

Check one of the other posts I made in the thread. I'm not the one being cheap; I provide my kid with more than enough money to buy premium fuel, and premium just about everything else that he wants to buy. I don't know why he wants to cheap out on the gas, but I did what to give him a good answer based on something others have actually experienced, rather than on what I or others just happened to believe based on reason only. We both are smart enough to reason that premium is probably the right thing to use, but neither of us knew whether no using premium has negative affects that folks observed because they tried not using premium.

BTW, he doesn't have gym membership. He's in college; it has more equipment and space than nearly any public gym. LOL ( I know you just mentioned that to underscore your point, and not as a serious alternative. )

But the 328i engine has only been out a relatively short while. The car will run perfectly fine on cheapo gas......but what happens after 2 or 3 years of use when you find out is has damaged the engine? Not saying it will, but what if?

This question is a little like "The surgeon general thinks smoking is a bad idea....can I hear from smokers to see what they say?" And then when 20 smokers say "Hey, I smoke 60 a day and feel great!" That is a sign that the surgeon general is playing it a bit safe? Nuts!!!!

It's your car put what you like in it

[gnosis8]

Guys, come on. Running 87 doesn't damage the engine. It this were the case, of the tens of millions of BMWs out there, if even 1 of every 1,000 BMW drivers went with 87 AKI consistently, that'd be tens of thousands of BMWs with constant engine problems occurring within the warranty period. There is no such issue, not even outside of the warranty period. Do you see a bunch of people posting about having engine problems with their used BMWs that they recently purchased, wondering if it's because the previous owner was in the "87 Club"? If there was, there'd be a sticky on this forum called "87 octane related problems" and it would have about 532,324 posts and 50,978,300 views, and BMW would have updated all of their manuals... back in 1987... to say, "Whatever the hell you do, never put a drop of anything below 91 AKI or else you will destroy your engine... and if you're in the U.S. you will probably get sued."

BTW I can understand why people would want to skimp and go with 87 or even 89. I mean, that's like, one whole free extra beer every month. One frosty, ice cold, bubbly, delicious beer. Mmm... beer...

[tony20009]

Originally Posted by NISFAN

But the 328i engine has only been out a relatively short while. The car will run perfectly fine on cheapo gas......but what happens after 2 or 3 years of use when you find out is has damaged the engine? Not saying it will, but what if?

This question is a little like "The surgeon general thinks smoking is a bad idea....can I hear from smokers to see what they say?" And then when 20 smokers say "Hey, I smoke 60 a day and feel great!" That is a sign that the surgeon general is playing it a bit safe? Nuts!!!!

It's your car put what you like in it

I don't know if it's quite like your smokers analogy. I for one smoke. And I can tell you that from the very first year of smoking, I noticed that it took me longer to get over a cold. Having smoked for many years now, I can share more observations, but at least I will share my observations if someone asks. I would think if anyone is using non-premium fuel on a regular basis, and has been for several months or so, they'd have something to share.

Not that the SG is wrong about smoking, but experts have been wrong about plenty of things, not necessarily deliberately misrepresenting facts (although that's happened too). So, just because an expert says so, is no reason to put full faith in their pronouncements. Yes, it makes sense to give their points of view more weight than that of the average Joe, but that doesn't mean there's no value in asking for observations of specific behavior.

As I said earlier, what I requested were specific points of data, observations, not opinions. The car came with an opinion in the owners manual which is why I didn't ask for what folks think on the matter.

[tony20009]

Originally Posted by gnosis8

...Do you see a bunch of people posting about having engine problems with their used BMWs that they recently purchased, wondering if it's because the previous owner was in the "87 Club"? If there was, there'd be a sticky on this forum called "87 octane related problems" and it would have about 532,324 posts and 50,978,300 views...

LOL...yep...there's no shortage of opinions here.

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by tony20009

I don't know if it's quite like your smokers analogy. I for one smoke. And I can tell you that from the very first year of smoking, I noticed that it took me longer to get over a cold. Having smoked for many years now, I can share more observations, but at least I will share my observations if someone asks. I would think if anyone is using non-premium fuel on a regular basis, and has been for several months or so, they'd have something to share.

Not that the SG is wrong about smoking, but experts have been wrong about plenty of things, not necessarily deliberately misrepresenting facts (although that's happened too). So, just because an expert says so, is no reason to put full faith in their pronouncements. Yes, it makes sense to give their points of view more weight than that of the average Joe, but that doesn't mean there's no value in asking for observations of specific behavior.

As I said earlier, what I requested were specific points of data, observations, not opinions. The car came with an opinion in the owners manual which is why I didn't ask for what folks think on the matter.

But surely the only observation or points of data that matter, is the engine that has been religiously driven to the same pattern and driving style as your son. Then said engine gets opened up by an expert and given a health check?

That is not something anyone can give you

[drob23]

Originally Posted by tony20009

Thanks to everyone who responded to the request I made. I appreciate your sharing the outcome of your personal observations.



Actually I didn't. I asked for folks to share observations and/or anecdotes of what one may have experienced from having violated the premium fuel mandate. Precious few folks responded with what I asked for. You'll see my original post below.

I think you already responded to this on page 1 but OK...

[tony20009]

Originally Posted by NISFAN

But surely the only observation or points of data that matter, is the engine that has been religiously driven to the same pattern and driving style as your son. Then said engine gets opened up by an expert and given a health check?

That is not something anyone can give you

That seems plausible. But then if that's so, this thread has far too many posts in it. LOL

[F32]

Did anyone else read this entire thread while facepalming?

[Ali Shiralian]

Originally Posted by dalrx

If you can afford to give your kid a new f30 then just give him money for free gas and tell him to fill it with supreme all the time , problem solved.

My thoughts exactly, I wish I had him as a dad

[philbake]

Seems like BMW designed the engine(s) to run at peak power and efficiency using 91 octane, but will operate safely using 89. Simple as that. That's your decision point. Here in Denver, we have 85/87/91 as the choices. Even though I live at 6k ft, I've been reluctant to go to 87, which is mid grade here.

[pflau]

Consumer Report had an article where they did a study to see which cars really need premium and which cars ask for premium but would be OK with mid-grade or regular. BMW NEEDS premium. Anything other than that ends up costing more in lost MPG or efficiency.

[ADM]

FWIW
You get what you pay for.
Penny wise & dollar foolish.

That being said, after paying for the price of the vehicle...what you will get you the most bang for your buck, complimented by the long term pay beck.

THat Having been said,what you do want the best payback, Thus don't be "penny wise and dollar foolish." ~
What price do you extrapolate to the "ultimate driving machine.?"

[BEAR-AvHistory]

This subject has been beaten to death. You want a lot of info use the search function & go lookup the old 80 page gas wars threads.

Why is it so hard to put in whatever it says on the gas tank lid? Agree with the others sounds like your kid needs a Honda.

[fredsf30]

This is such a ridiculous question. Why even bother asking it?

If you average 15,000 miles per year, the extra cost per year is $150-$250 per year.

If you think that small savings is worth the risk of damaging your engine, you can't be helped.

[SeriusK]

Originally Posted by fredsf30

This is such a ridiculous question. Why even bother asking it?

If you average 15,000 miles per year, the extra cost per year is $150-$250 per year.

If you think that small savings is worth the risk of damaging your engine, you can't be helped.

^^My sentiments exactly.

[fredsf30]

This type of question just wastes everyone's time.

[openwheelracing]

Trust me every loaner car we get are filled with 87 octane and they drive just fine.

I do wonder if people fill up differently if they lease / or purchase.

[BimmerQuest]

All four of my grandparents smoked from age 16 into their 90s...I've always put premium in cars when the manufacturer recommended it...

[casualDIYer]

Some rehash here so please forgive.

The use of 'grade' probably isn't the best description of the octane levels in gas. All gas stations sell automobile grade gasoline (i.e. unleaded and suitable for use on public roads). Other 'grades' of gas would be 'race' gas, or 'farm' gas which would work in most cars but have high levels of particulate matter. No so enviro friendly. Not sure if it would screw up a catalytic converter or sensors but race cars aren't built to win the 'friendliest car toward the environment' awards.

As for what level of octane, as others have mentioned, it doesn't matter as far as the computer is concerned. The car's computer will adjust it's timing based on the octane level to prevent engine knock.

So, octane doesn't matter? Well, if the only difference was octane I would say there is no difference but there is a surprise in store for those choosing lower octane levels. Ethanol. Here in Canada 87 has about 10%, 89 5% and 91 or 93 . . . 0 (for Shell at least. I've heard Petro-Can, Suck-no-co, and Husky use Ethanol in higher octane gas). The use of Ethanol in gasoline burning engine often results in poorer fuel economy, at least according to the US government:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/ethanol.shtml

I have actually experimented with this a bit with my old e46. With 91, I got about 10% better mileage. With 87, 10% less. And the price difference between the two is . . . 10%

As for octane, not a problem. As for ethanol . . . I ain't putting no corn juice in my F30

[openwheelracing]

unfortunately I live in California, ethanol everywhere I go.......

[syuan92]

I've been using 89 Octane for my AH3 since it says it's okay in the fuel compartment but I just did the calculation for yearly difference in savings versus using 93 octane and I've decided that I'm going to start using 93 octane from now on. I'm feeling pretty stupid right now.