F30POST
F30POST
2012-2015 BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > Technical Forums > Suspension | Chassis | Brakes > Bilstein B14 with Vorshlag Camber Plates
proTUNING Freaks
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      09-04-2021, 04:21 PM   #1
1bad14-F30
Private
1bad14-F30's Avatar
United_States
30
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M Sport
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: WA State

iTrader: (0)

Bilstein B14 with Vorshlag Camber Plates

I posted some of this in a reply to another post. After reading a lot on this forum, as well as others, I decided to go with a Bilstein B14 kit (will probably switch to B16's down the road) with Vorshlag Camber Plates with 2.5" coil over spring perches.

Based on Farkle's recommendations and testing, I will be installing some Hyperco 275 lb/in 2.5" springs up front (over dampened a bit) with 60mm (Bilstein) to 2.5" adaptors at the coilover. This will replace the Bilstein 400 lb/in progressive spring to give it a bit less pitch. The biggest complaint I have heard from most about the Bilstein setup, is it is a bit stiff and bumpsteery (is that a word?). I am holding off on the much higher spring rate in the rear, until I see how I like this setup. The rear spring (Bilstein 565 lb/in) will be an easy replace/install later down the road. So for now, the dampening will be tuned to the rear spring as designed. SPL Front and Rear adjustable end links as well to make sure there is no pre-load on the sway bars after lowering.

My plan is -2.5* camber on the front and -2.0* rear for the street and spirited driving. Having the ability to change the front camber setting to more in the -3.5* to -4.0* for the days I AutoX or track it. I have the M Sport non adaptive suspension with the beefier sway bars already. I will also be adding a Weichers aluminum front strut brace.

Doing a brake upgrade at the same time. M Performance Big Brake Kit through FCP Euro. Lifetime Replacement on all parts, including consumables. I know the 370mm front rotors and 345mm rear rotors will add a little unsprung weight for not a whole lot (if any) additional braking capacity on the street, but I plan to switch pads (Hawk 5.0 HPS street pads) for AutoX and Track Days to Pagid RSL29 pads and think it will make a difference there. I will be installing Turner Motorsport stainless steel brake lines as well.

Considering the total cost for all of these upgrades, I went with the B14 for now. I just want to make some major changes all around to the handling, overall ride height and braking on this F30. I have no problem going to a B16 or KW V3 down the road a bit.

I also just added Aodhan AFF7 wheels and Michelin PS4S 3 weeks ago. 235/35/19 & 275/30/19. Just the tires alone, made a HUGE difference in confidence in steering. The above suspension and brake changes should only increase that dramatically.
__________________
2014 335i - BM3 Stage 2+ Race Gas, VRSF Catless DP, Race IC, CP, Muffler Delete, xHP Stage 3, NGK 97506, Eldor Coils, Turner Motorsport intake with BMS filter, BMS Oil Catch Can, Red Line fluids.

Last edited by 1bad14-F30; 09-07-2021 at 08:49 PM..
Appreciate 1
AmuroRay2165.00
      09-07-2021, 11:01 AM   #2
FaRKle!
Brigadier General
3995
Rep
3,530
Posts

Drives: 328d Wagon, M2 Comp, i4 eD35
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
Go with the KW 60210190 springs in front instead. They're similar format to the springs that come on the B14 (60mm bottom ID, stock ID on top) so no adapters are needed, and due to the shape have more travel than the standard 2.5" coilover spring. Spring rate is 265lbs/in. You have to call KW to order. They should be $80 each.
__________________
-328d Wagon Build Log (with helpful reference links)
-My YouTube Channel for some of the best DIYs and in depth information

Please don't PM me for suspension recommendations unless interested in paid private consultations.
Appreciate 2
DLag30103.50
      09-07-2021, 04:23 PM   #3
1bad14-F30
Private
1bad14-F30's Avatar
United_States
30
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M Sport
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: WA State

iTrader: (0)

Thanks for the recommendation on the KW springs. I will keep that in mind for another F30 in the stable. I already got the 2.5" Hyperco's (188B0275)and ordered the Vorshlag Camber Plates with 2.5" coilover spring perches. I installed the adaptors and some swift thrust sheets onto the Bilstein front struts. Waiting for some other parts to do the install.
__________________
2014 335i - BM3 Stage 2+ Race Gas, VRSF Catless DP, Race IC, CP, Muffler Delete, xHP Stage 3, NGK 97506, Eldor Coils, Turner Motorsport intake with BMS filter, BMS Oil Catch Can, Red Line fluids.
Appreciate 0
      09-17-2021, 08:10 AM   #4
e90Nate
Colonel
Canada
285
Rep
2,146
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Canada

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by FaRKle! View Post
Go with the KW 60210190 springs in front instead. They're similar format to the springs that come on the B14 (60mm bottom ID, stock ID on top) so no adapters are needed, and due to the shape have more travel than the standard 2.5" coilover spring. Spring rate is 265lbs/in. You have to call KW to order. They should be $80 each.
would this spring result in a smoother ride? I find my bilsteins a bit crashy in the front. and very firm
__________________
Appreciate 0
      09-17-2021, 10:11 AM   #5
FaRKle!
Brigadier General
3995
Rep
3,530
Posts

Drives: 328d Wagon, M2 Comp, i4 eD35
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by e90Nate View Post
would this spring result in a smoother ride? I find my bilsteins a bit crashy in the front. and very firm
Ideally you'd swap the rear spring too to give this kit flat ride for a smooth ride. The softer spring will make the front end less stiff, but the "crashiness" probably won't change much since the rebound from the damper isn't any different.
__________________
-328d Wagon Build Log (with helpful reference links)
-My YouTube Channel for some of the best DIYs and in depth information

Please don't PM me for suspension recommendations unless interested in paid private consultations.
Appreciate 1
      09-17-2021, 02:11 PM   #6
e90Nate
Colonel
Canada
285
Rep
2,146
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Canada

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by FaRKle! View Post
Ideally you'd swap the rear spring too to give this kit flat ride for a smooth ride. The softer spring will make the front end less stiff, but the "crashiness" probably won't change much since the rebound from the damper isn't any different.
any suggestions for what rear spring? trying to avoid going out and buying kw street comfort lol
__________________
Appreciate 0
      09-28-2021, 11:31 AM   #7
1bad14-F30
Private
1bad14-F30's Avatar
United_States
30
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M Sport
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: WA State

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1bad14-F30 View Post
I am holding off on the much higher spring rate in the rear, until I see how I like this setup. The rear spring (Bilstein 565 lb/in) will be an easy replace/install later down the road. So for now, the dampening will be tuned to the rear spring as designed.
Decided after much more research about Flat Ride (Quick Settling) and using the FCM Elite spreadsheet for F30 to go with Hyperco 10" - 2.5" 750# coils for the rear. Decided to do this now, rather than wait. This equates to approximately 15% Flat Ride. So for the time being, I will be over dampened a bit in the front and under dampened in the rear a bit. Down the road, I may have the struts recalibrated to these (or whatever spring rate I end up at finally).
Attached Images
 
__________________
2014 335i - BM3 Stage 2+ Race Gas, VRSF Catless DP, Race IC, CP, Muffler Delete, xHP Stage 3, NGK 97506, Eldor Coils, Turner Motorsport intake with BMS filter, BMS Oil Catch Can, Red Line fluids.

Last edited by 1bad14-F30; 09-30-2021 at 12:11 PM..
Appreciate 0
      09-28-2021, 07:22 PM   #8
Logicoeur
Lieutenant Colonel
Logicoeur's Avatar
988
Rep
1,934
Posts

Drives: F30 335i xDrive
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Boston

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1bad14-F30 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1bad14-F30 View Post
I am holding off on the much higher spring rate in the rear, until I see how I like this setup. The rear spring (Bilstein 565 lb/in) will be an easy replace/install later down the road. So for now, the dampening will be tuned to the rear spring as designed.
Decided after much more research about Flat Ride (Quick Settling) and using the FCM Elite spreadsheet for F30 to go with Hyperco 10" - 2.5" 750# coils for the rear. Decided to do this now, rather than wait. This equates to approximately 13% Flat Ride. So for the time being, I will be over dampened a bit in the front and under dampened in the rear a bit. Down the road, I may have the struts recalibrated to these (or whatever spring rate I end up at finally).
30% off the front spring rate won't be too soft??
__________________
F30 335iX | Remus Axleback | Fabspeed Catted DP | VRSF Comp IC | 18X9 ET35 19lb MT1 | 255/40/18 ECS | Ohlins RT Millway Street | Millway Control Arm Bushings | Turner Endlinks | TMH 75mm 14x1.5 Studs | BMW MPerf LSD | XDelete | Pipercross Filter | MHD Stg2 93
Appreciate 0
      09-28-2021, 08:02 PM   #9
1bad14-F30
Private
1bad14-F30's Avatar
United_States
30
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M Sport
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: WA State

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Logicoeur View Post
30% off the front spring rate won't be too soft??
I assume you mean 30% less than the supplied Bilstein progressive 397# front? Based on my research and more importantly some testing and information on these threads from FaRKle!, I don't believe so. It will be over dampened a bit, so that will be something to feel out. Especially for a more streetable comfort factor, with enough performance for some very spirited driving. Springs and struts are easy enough to swap out. I don't mind changing out my entire strut/spring combo for a more aggressive setup at the track if needed. All of the complaints I have read and heard of with the B14's, are of the harshness of the ride on the street. Particularly due to the Pitch that the kit comes with.

In hindsight, I would have gotten the B16 kit, to be able to adjust dampening to various spring rates I will probably try, but I got it through FCP Euro for the lifetime warranty. B16 standard kit is currently and has been on backorder with no ETA for a while now. Yes Bilstein has a great warranty, but I would rather deal with FCP Euro than Bilstein from a customer service and long term warranty standpoint.

My main reason for going to a coilover suspension was:
  • Fix ride height. Especially with new tire/wheel combo
  • Better suspension geometry and handling
  • I needed new struts anyway
__________________
2014 335i - BM3 Stage 2+ Race Gas, VRSF Catless DP, Race IC, CP, Muffler Delete, xHP Stage 3, NGK 97506, Eldor Coils, Turner Motorsport intake with BMS filter, BMS Oil Catch Can, Red Line fluids.
Appreciate 0
      09-28-2021, 08:13 PM   #10
Logicoeur
Lieutenant Colonel
Logicoeur's Avatar
988
Rep
1,934
Posts

Drives: F30 335i xDrive
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Boston

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1bad14-F30 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Logicoeur View Post
30% off the front spring rate won't be too soft??
I assume you mean 30% less than the supplied Bilstein progressive 397# front? Based on my research and more importantly some testing and information on these threads from FaRKle!, I don't believe so. It will be over dampened a bit, so that will be something to feel out. Especially for a more streetable comfort factor, with enough performance for some very spirited driving. Springs and struts are easy enough to swap out. I don't mind changing out my entire strut/spring combo for a more aggressive setup at the track if needed. All of the complaints I have read and heard of with the B14's, are of the harshness of the ride on the street. Particularly due to the Pitch that the kit comes with.

In hindsight, I would have gotten the B16 kit, to be able to adjust dampening to various spring rates I will probably try, but I got it through FCP Euro for the lifetime warranty. B16 standard kit is currently and has been on backorder with no ETA for a while now. Yes Bilstein has a great warranty, but I would rather deal with FCP Euro than Bilstein from a customer service and long term warranty standpoint.

My main reason for going to a coilover suspension was:
  • Fix ride height. Especially with new tire/wheel combo
  • Better suspension geometry and handling
  • I needed new struts anyway
Understood. I guess I should have asked what the delta is compared to the stock springs.

We are somewhat in the same boat but I have already gone coilover. Not name brand but one with a bunch of adjustability. I went 350F/1000F with adjustable dampening. Some bumps make the front end bang so loud it's stressful to drive and search for road imperfections. Even riding my motorcycle on the same roads wasnt so draining lol. I have yet to adjust the dampening up from the midpoint when it was installed, but I'm not confident it will help my crashing. Thought it may be an undersprung scenario.
__________________
F30 335iX | Remus Axleback | Fabspeed Catted DP | VRSF Comp IC | 18X9 ET35 19lb MT1 | 255/40/18 ECS | Ohlins RT Millway Street | Millway Control Arm Bushings | Turner Endlinks | TMH 75mm 14x1.5 Studs | BMW MPerf LSD | XDelete | Pipercross Filter | MHD Stg2 93
Appreciate 0
      09-28-2021, 10:05 PM   #11
1bad14-F30
Private
1bad14-F30's Avatar
United_States
30
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M Sport
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: WA State

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Logicoeur View Post
Understood. I guess I should have asked what the delta is compared to the stock springs.
From what I can find it looks like stock M Sport are 165 lb/in Front and 485 lb/in Rear. So the 275 lb/in fronts are still over 100 lb/in stiffer. Will still be over dampened a bit. So there will still be some crashiness I suspect. Hopehully not too much. Lol. I hear you on the ride. I am trying to avoid that harshness, but still get a significant upgrade to my stock, body rolling, strut worn out suspension. Should have all the parts here by Friday for my complete suspension and brake upgrade. M Performance Big Brake Kit with Red Rotors arrived today! Bilstein B14's with Hyperco 2.5" 275F (8") / 750R (10"), Vorshlag Camber Plates, SPL Parts front and rear adjustable end links to keep geometry on sway bars correct, Big Brake Kit, Stainless brake lines, etc. Car should feel quite a bit different by Saturday Night!
__________________
2014 335i - BM3 Stage 2+ Race Gas, VRSF Catless DP, Race IC, CP, Muffler Delete, xHP Stage 3, NGK 97506, Eldor Coils, Turner Motorsport intake with BMS filter, BMS Oil Catch Can, Red Line fluids.

Last edited by 1bad14-F30; 09-28-2021 at 11:20 PM..
Appreciate 0
      10-03-2021, 03:43 PM   #12
Logicoeur
Lieutenant Colonel
Logicoeur's Avatar
988
Rep
1,934
Posts

Drives: F30 335i xDrive
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Boston

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1bad14-F30 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Logicoeur View Post
Understood. I guess I should have asked what the delta is compared to the stock springs.
From what I can find it looks like stock M Sport are 165 lb/in Front and 485 lb/in Rear. So the 275 lb/in fronts are still over 100 lb/in stiffer. Will still be over dampened a bit. So there will still be some crashiness I suspect. Hopehully not too much. Lol. I hear you on the ride. I am trying to avoid that harshness, but still get a significant upgrade to my stock, body rolling, strut worn out suspension. Should have all the parts here by Friday for my complete suspension and brake upgrade. M Performance Big Brake Kit with Red Rotors arrived today! Bilstein B14's with Hyperco 2.5" 275F (8") / 750R (10"), Vorshlag Camber Plates, SPL Parts front and rear adjustable end links to keep geometry on sway bars correct, Big Brake Kit, Stainless brake lines, etc. Car should feel quite a bit different by Saturday Night!
Well your comment made me get off my ass and try to adjust my suspension since it is unlikely an undersprung problem seeing those numbers. I've been really lazy (first kid just turned 1yo this week ).

Anyway the plan was to adjust the front dampers towards hard (20-21 clicks total) from the midpoint done at installation. Took some time to figure out the orientation with the car parked on the ground (mixture of cellphone video and the viewfinder on my apple watch). Drivers side went fine, went to 14 from 10 clicks.

Went to do thr passenger side and IT WAS AT FULL SOFT (don't be nasty). Adjusted it to match the drivers side after that revelation. Car is driving like night and day. Even went down to drive across imperfections in the road I would usually avoid and no banging. It's night and day now lol. The firmness is definitely reminiscent of my wife's Macan S that I just got her. Stock suspension but it's very nice on the road and a bit firmer than most would expect.

Welp problem solved. For now
__________________
F30 335iX | Remus Axleback | Fabspeed Catted DP | VRSF Comp IC | 18X9 ET35 19lb MT1 | 255/40/18 ECS | Ohlins RT Millway Street | Millway Control Arm Bushings | Turner Endlinks | TMH 75mm 14x1.5 Studs | BMW MPerf LSD | XDelete | Pipercross Filter | MHD Stg2 93
Appreciate 1
      10-04-2021, 03:42 PM   #13
1bad14-F30
Private
1bad14-F30's Avatar
United_States
30
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M Sport
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: WA State

iTrader: (0)

Well, Finally got the suspension all installed. It feels Awesome! Still have some fine tuning to do, but what a difference. Love the Flat Ride and how it handles.

Note to anyone else installing B14 or B16. Just put it on the lowest setting. Bilstein has built in fool proofing to keep from going too low. Wish I had known this to start. Took me a bit to go back through the rear setup. I installed 10" 750# coils. There was no turning the adjusters. (I added Swift thrust sheets on second attempt, but probably will never need them now) No worries. It's always faster the second time... Looked like a 4x4 on first try. Lol. Going to let it settle for a week or so, then do my string alignment. Vorshlag camber plates as delivered have me at -2.8* LF and -2.5* RF - Rear with new setup -2.0* LR and -1.8* RR. I will fix the camber and caster, then adjust the toe (front and rear). I have a digital camber gauge and will do a string alignment as well. I'll post pics when it has settled and I have done the alignment.

Didn't get to the brakes. That'll have to wait until 2 weeks from now. Headed to AZ for a few days. Get some sun and heat. It's already deep into fall temps here in the PNW.
__________________
2014 335i - BM3 Stage 2+ Race Gas, VRSF Catless DP, Race IC, CP, Muffler Delete, xHP Stage 3, NGK 97506, Eldor Coils, Turner Motorsport intake with BMS filter, BMS Oil Catch Can, Red Line fluids.

Last edited by 1bad14-F30; 10-09-2021 at 09:03 PM..
Appreciate 1
FaRKle!3994.50
      10-29-2021, 09:06 AM   #14
1bad14-F30
Private
1bad14-F30's Avatar
United_States
30
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M Sport
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: WA State

iTrader: (0)

M Performance brakes on now...

Got the M Performance brakes on and bedded in (fun in the rain, not). I am using Rotors I had made from Brake Performance out of California. Hawk HPS 5.0 Pads front and rear as well as Turner MS stainless steel brake lines front and rear. The rotors are one piece cast, so a tiny bit heavier, but I had them make the slots curved and all the way to the edge. This eliminates the noise people have complained about with the BMW rotors with straight slots. Plus it just looks better IMHO. Also went with the black zinc coating on the rotors. Looks good and functions well.

Excuse the dirty car. It has been raining non stop here in the Pacific NW, so I haven't really been able to test them. Probably for the best anyway. I'll get them settled in with a few hundred miles and then hopefully have some decent dry roads in the next week or so to report back. Initial impression, I absolutely can feel and love the difference.

(If anyone is interested or cares, I have Dura Coating - Tire Dressing on my tires. This stuff is incredible. Prep is key, but worth the effort.)
Attached Images
   
__________________
2014 335i - BM3 Stage 2+ Race Gas, VRSF Catless DP, Race IC, CP, Muffler Delete, xHP Stage 3, NGK 97506, Eldor Coils, Turner Motorsport intake with BMS filter, BMS Oil Catch Can, Red Line fluids.
Appreciate 1
FaRKle!3994.50
      01-17-2023, 04:26 PM   #15
AmuroRay
Brigadier General
AmuroRay's Avatar
2165
Rep
4,073
Posts

Drives: M235i
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Florida

iTrader: (0)

How is this working for you? Where did you get the swift thrust sheets?
__________________
Mods: Yes.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:13 PM.




f30post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST