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      08-02-2013, 03:46 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by or0b0to View Post
I currently have a 2006 VW Jetta TDI manual...

[snip]

Neither had DHP or the 8sp SAT, and though they were faster than my TDI, they were sooooooo boring to drive comparatively. My 5sp Manual might be a dog from standstill in 1st gear, but on the twisty roads of New England it's a blast in 2nd-3rd-4th gear. I just didn't get that with either of the BMW's.

[snip]

Any of you folks in interwebs land have similar experiences driving TDI's and looking to move to the BMW diesel?
i haven't driven the F30, but having some experience with VW's (an old Golf back in the day, and an '11 A3 TDI which we all know is a glorified Golf TDI), i think i have an idea where you're coming from. i remember that old Golf being an incredibly fun car to drive, even just going through some curves @ 20mph in a residential complex. similarly, the A3 is a fun car to throw around.

the problem is driver involvement != performance. you have to push these new cars MUCH harder to get them to feel "fun." at sane speeds on public roads they likely have more performance than you will ever need. in order to deliver higher and higher levels of refinement that mainstream consumers demand, the cars will necessarily feel more boring. also many tradeoffs are obviously made in the name of efficiency and convenience (e.g. electric steering, run-flat tires).

probably doesn't help very much, but that is my impression of things. priorities, priorities...
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      08-02-2013, 04:03 PM   #68
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How does the sunroof on the wagon compare to the "panorama" roof on the X5? I ask because I have the X5, and while the sunroof is huge, the heat gain is minimal when the panel is closed. The area I live in gets close to 250 sunny days per year, and I've never noticed the heat coming through the roof. I have had cars with thinner sunroof panels that do let heat through, but the X5 has a relatively thick and apparently well-insulated panel.
I'm sure it's about the same, but I don't think your sunny days in Colorado are a match for what we experience in the Southeast. Our cars are white in color, whereas the sunroof is darker. The heat gain will be greater with the sunroof in that case assuming that the insulation value is equal.
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      08-02-2013, 04:41 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by bimmerjph View Post
If VW's TDI resale values are any indicator, I would say the 328d will have much better resale value.
Now check the 335d resale value. Not that good.
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      08-02-2013, 09:10 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by or0b0to View Post
Update:

Sudbury BMW doesn't have their 328d in yet... :-/

It's on order and will be another few weeks before it shows up. It's listed in their inventory though, so the guy I spoke with last night thought it would be on the lot.
that's more of what I would have guessed - they went into production in early July, and I heard it would take 6 to 8 weeks to get over here. Thanks for the update!
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      08-02-2013, 10:00 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by or0b0to
I currently have a 2006 VW Jetta TDI manual that I've put 110k+ miles on, and have been cross shopping a ton of different cars in preparation of moving on from the ol' reliable beast... the 328d being one of them... and I've been anxiously awaiting these official numbers.

Over the last ~8 years of owning the TDI I've averaged 42mpg combined over 110k miles... that's significantly better than the EPA numbers that were released for the vehicle, so I'm really curious what the real world figures for this car can be.

The downside I think is the car itself.

I recently did a BMW Ultimate Driving experience to get the $1000 credit and to check out a number of cars, and was left extremely unimpressed by the 328 & 335 they had as test cars.

Neither had DHP or the 8sp SAT, and though they were faster than my TDI, they were sooooooo boring to drive comparatively. My 5sp Manual might be a dog from standstill in 1st gear, but on the twisty roads of New England it's a blast in 2nd-3rd-4th gear. I just didn't get that with either of the BMW's.

I've been lurking on these boards for ~6 months keeping tabs on new developments, so long time first time I guess, lol.

Any of you folks in interwebs land have similar experiences driving TDI's and looking to move to the BMW diesel?
Did you test a 335d? I owned a 2006 Jetta TDi before I bought my 335d and I could never go back to a Jetta. While efficient, it was boring. There was nothing "fun" about my manual Jetta TDi. 100 HP limited any fun, not to mention the FWD. Turn off the nanny controls on that D and then come back and tell us it's not fun.
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      08-02-2013, 11:42 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by dorkus View Post
the problem is driver involvement != performance. you have to push these new cars MUCH harder to get them to feel "fun."
Goes to that old saying, it's more fun to drive a slow car fast than a fast car slow.


I guess driving a fast car fast would be the most fun, but also illegal on any public roads.
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      08-02-2013, 11:42 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by GreekboyD View Post
Did you test a 335d? I owned a 2006 Jetta TDi before I bought my 335d and I could never go back to a Jetta. While efficient, it was boring. There was nothing "fun" about my manual Jetta TDi. 100 HP limited any fun, not to mention the FWD. Turn off the nanny controls on that D and then come back and tell us it's not fun.
Yeah, the 335d was a pretty sweet ride... I just wasn't in the market for a new car yet at the time, and when I started thinking about it they were already done with... I would have LOVED an A5 3.0 TDI, but alas, they never made the trip across the pond.

As far as the TDI being boring... to me its not... I liked it from the 1st day I had it, and then @ year 4 I got an RC stage 2 tune and it felt like a new fresh car again. In a straight line it's a dog from stand still, but 2nd-3rd gear on small twisty New England roads are total blast.

You're not driving the HP in a diesel car anyways, it's all about that sweet meaty torque band. Stock it was 177ftlb, and with a tune brought it up to ~215ftlb and ~120hp... not bad for a 2006 4 cyl diesel engine that rocked over 50mpg on the hwy.

It's been 8 years since that engine, and bmw's 4 cyl diesel is 180/280... I think when compared to the arc of power increases in other vehicles that's pretty much on the mark.
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      08-03-2013, 07:06 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by or0b0to
Yeah, the 335d was a pretty sweet ride... I just wasn't in the market for a new car yet at the time, and when I started thinking about it they were already done with... I would have LOVED an A5 3.0 TDI, but alas, they never made the trip across the pond.

As far as the TDI being boring... to me its not... I liked it from the 1st day I had it, and then @ year 4 I got an RC stage 2 tune and it felt like a new fresh car again. In a straight line it's a dog from stand still, but 2nd-3rd gear on small twisty New England roads are total blast.

You're not driving the HP in a diesel car anyways, it's all about that sweet meaty torque band. Stock it was 177ftlb, and with a tune brought it up to ~215ftlb and ~120hp... not bad for a 2006 4 cyl diesel engine that rocked over 50mpg on the hwy.

It's been 8 years since that engine, and bmw's 4 cyl diesel is 180/280... I think when compared to the arc of power increases in other vehicles that's pretty much on the mark.
Fair enough. A tune would definitely transform the car. I bought my 2006 brand new and sold it 6 years later with about 56,000 miles (90,000 kms) on it. Just woke up one day and needed a change...lol

I've totally revamped my suspension on the D and it handles incredibly well. The A5 is also intriguing too.
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      08-03-2013, 03:29 PM   #75
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I have the 320d manual.

Had the car for 1 years and average consumption is 50 US MPG (as you see below from my fuelly profile)

However, put on cruisecontrol on 50-60 mph and you can expect to see numbers as high as 60+ US MPG . Lowest I've achieved is 69 US MPG to/from work one day with zero traffic and 90 % highway at 55 mph (Yes, my bord comp. is very accurate, always correct with manual calculations from fill ups) Not bad!

Also recently got the M-performance power kit that bumps power to 200 hp and 309 lb ft. I havn't really noticed any drop in MPGs, maybe a bit at higher speeds but nothing significant
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      08-03-2013, 05:57 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by Fille View Post
I have the 320d manual.

Had the car for 1 years and average consumption is 50 US MPG (as you see below from my fuelly profile)

However, put on cruisecontrol on 50-60 mph and you can expect to see numbers as high as 60+ US MPG . Lowest I've achieved is 69 US MPG to/from work one day with zero traffic and 90 % highway at 55 mph (Yes, my bord comp. is very accurate, always correct with manual calculations from fill ups) Not bad!

Also recently got the M-performance power kit that bumps power to 200 hp and 309 lb ft. I havn't really noticed any drop in MPGs, maybe a bit at higher speeds but nothing significant
Nice!

Diesels are great for exceeding mileage estimates... Now if only I had the MT option here in the US.
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      08-03-2013, 06:33 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by or0b0to View Post
Diesels are great for exceeding mileage estimates... Now if only I had the MT option here in the US.
The F30 320d is very capable for good mpg, depending on how it is driven.

BTW, the 8-speed auto is well suited to the engine, whether you drive for economy, sit more on the peak torque, or use the power. I'd not want the MT for this engine.

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      08-03-2013, 09:35 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by HighlandPete View Post
The F30 320d is very capable for good mpg, depending on how it is driven.

BTW, the 8-speed auto is well suited to the engine, whether you drive for economy, sit more on the peak torque, or use the power. I'd not want the MT for this engine.

HighlandPete
Yes, agree. People forget how much the extra 2 gears help in acceleration and fuel economy. I was pretty impressed with the ZF AT8 and the two modes of manual override shifting.

I am keeping my E60 M5 Sedan so the 328Txd with Diesel/AWD/wagon will compliment it nicely (not much overlap in vehicle function).
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      08-03-2013, 09:37 PM   #79
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The only 2014 models that BMW of Seattle has in stock at the moment are the few that are made in Spartenburg.
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      08-06-2013, 06:04 PM   #80
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Yes, agree. People forget how much the extra 2 gears help in acceleration and fuel economy. I was pretty impressed with the ZF AT8 and the two modes of manual override shifting.
I have to agree as well, I was very impressed even with the latest 320i with the ZF AT8 at how smooth the gears change and the balance of performance/economy. Having the ability to scroll through the gears manually and start in 2nd is quite handy, too.
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      08-07-2013, 03:38 AM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by or0b0to View Post
Yeah, I test drove a 328 & 335 with the regular AT at a recent ultimate driving and both made for a super boring drive. 2nd-3rd-4th in the manual TDI is waaaaaaay more fun on tight New England roads.

I'm going tomorrow to drive a 328d xdrive, so ill get a better idea about that then.

So far I have to say more performance/better numbers on paper =/= a more fun driving experience.
I was actually asking if you drove both the diesel versions or the petrol versions. But comparing AT to manual is not really fair. My manual Civic Si is more fun to drive than the automatic 320i had as a courtesy car the other day. Shifts were smooth on the automatic, but non-engaging, even in manual mode - I don't know how many seconds it took to respond to gear changes. Going up hills or moments when you need acceleration and you give it gas to downshift, it can feel laggy and unresponsive. Compared to the manual Civic that is, even though the performance is less on paper, I know exactly which gear to be in ahead of time, unlike the computer, so I know exactly how the car will respond and have the power I need when I need it. And no unexpected shifts, and faster launches, ability to skip gears, etc.

The 8 speed on the BMW is a lot smarter nowadays, knowing whether you're going uphill or downhill or maybe even when you're cornering, and adjusting ahead of time, but you will not feel the responsiveness of moving the gear with your hands. Plus a diesel manual can be even more fun due to the extra torque. Don't get me wrong, automatic transmissions can be fun for some people (usually the DCT or DSG gearboxes), but not for us. Seeing how many automatics there are on the road in North America just proves, though, that this "responsiveness" in selecting gears is not something important to the drivers here.
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Last edited by Pinz; 08-07-2013 at 03:45 AM.
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      08-18-2013, 03:15 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by bavarianboar View Post
Assuming you can find equal number of Diesel stations as Petrol Stations, at the spur of the moment and ease/convenience.
It honestly hasn't been an issue where I live.


Quote:
I like the Diesel cars, 335d was a blast, too bad they don't bring it in anymore.
I know, I want to hold on to mine for a long time because it'll be a while before we can get a big diesel motor in a small sedan again. Maybe Audi will send the A4 3.0TDI here but I doubt it.


Quote:
The only problem is the general perception of cost calculation. How much will it cost extra, is it worth the saving?
In our country that is how the equation is, not so in Europe where diesel cars are way more popular. I for one minute would find it hard to believe Europeans drive more than Americans.

If its that close : $1750, I would be a little nicer to the environment if I am not too concerned about the power and a bit of extra engine noise. 328d (320d) unfortunately does not cut it for me but very attractive option.
The 328d, when compared against other 4-cylinder diesels, looks like an attractive option. You have to pay the BMW tax of course, but BMW's motor spanks the VW/Audi version in terms of power and fuel economy. The 328d doesn't do as well when compared against the 328i, it gives up too much in power (whereas the 335d didn't give up all that much against the 335i).

I'll probably drive one just to see... now that I'm a responsible family man (cough) I think a diesel wagon would be better than any SUV I can think of.
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      09-11-2013, 03:14 AM   #83
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So I just picked up my 2014 328d a few days back and so far I am very impressed. For a car that can get such mileage is quick too. I have only run one tank through and I got 42mpg combined. On a 160 mile round trip freeway trip I saw 52mpg. This is with Eco Pro on with cruise control @ 72 and a/c on. I am sure as the engine brakes in it will get a little better and I'm sure my lead foot cost me a few miles. No hype. This is for real.
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