[Pond]

My old E92 Alpina B3 BiTurbo has just been sold again. #159

I knew it was one of the best of a rare breed but obviously didn't realise how good! 2008, 45,000 miles, just 3 owners and a full Sytner service history.

So much for the used car market being on the down turn and slow. I paid £16,000 for it in late 2021. Sold it in 2022 for £15,000. Just sold for £24,000 in two days!

I knew I should have kept it!

Piccies of the old girl:

[P-ToK72]

Originally Posted by Pond

My old E92 Alpina B3 BiTurbo has just been sold again. #159

I knew it was one of the best of a rare breed but obviously didn't realise how good! 2008, 45,000 miles, just 3 owners and a full Sytner service history.

So much for the used car market being on the down turn and slow. I paid £16,000 for it in late 2021. Sold it in 2022 for £15,000. Just sold for £24,000 in two days!

I knew I should have kept it!

Piccies of the old girl:

That really is a good looking car and really quite rare.

[bishbosh]

Lovely car!

Bet it was hard to keep clean though.

[boba-fett]

Hmmm, It's not a very nice looking car though is it?

Are you looking at it from a making money position as I can think of a lot more cars I'd rather have than that?

[Pond]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

Hmmm, It's not a very nice looking car though is it?

Are you looking at it from a making money position as I can think of a lot more cars I'd rather have than that?

Purely financial reasons. It has doubled it's value in less than 3 years!
I didn't particularly like it TBH; the old-fashioned ZF6 auto was a bit 'slow'. The inside was very dated. There was always that worry of when (not if) the tuned N54 was going to break something very expensive aswell.

Very tail happy on cold tyres (Pilot supersports).

It did get a LOT of attention, though, as they are so rare.

Presuming whoever bought it for £24k is going to stick it in a garage, not drive it and hope it becomes a 'proper' classic.

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by Pond

Purely financial reasons. It has doubled it's value in less than 3 years!
I didn't particularly like it TBH; the old-fashioned ZF6 auto was a bit 'slow'. The inside was very dated. There was always that worry of when (not if) the tuned N54 was going to break something very expensive aswell.

Very tail happy on cold tyres (Pilot supersports).

It did get a LOT of attention, though, as they are so rare.

Presuming whoever bought it for £24k is going to stick it in a garage, not drive it and hope it becomes a 'proper' classic.

Rare because there was a much, much better version of a hot 3 series called the M3!

I get the financial gain you could now get from such cars, but I would not give one driveway room! I can honestly say I have never bought a car for an investment only opportunity, I have to like it and want to drive it first and foremost, if it happens to make a few quid then happy days!

I wouldn't lose much sleep over it, there's lots of things that would go up in value better and cheaper if you keep it long enough and not use them!

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

Rare because there was a much, much better version of a hot 3 series called the M3!

I get the financial gain you could now get from such cars, but I would not give one driveway room! I can honestly say I have never bought a car for an investment only opportunity, I have to like it and want to drive it first and foremost, if it happens to make a few quid then happy days!

I wouldn't lose much sleep over it, there's lots of things that would go up in value better and cheaper if you keep it long enough and not use them!

Better is always relative to what you want - and like the road test that pitted touring versions of latest Alpina B3 against the latest M3, and found in favour of the Alpina, so would I!

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

Better is always relative to what you want - and like the road test that pitted touring versions of latest Alpina B3 against the latest M3, and found in favour of the Alpina, so would I!

Well that also depends on what review you read and what your requirements are.

Lets be honest the 335d took some beating in all aspects and the 340i's, but if its an all out sports version you want then its the M3. The Alpinas have always been the toned down softer version for people who don't want to be so shouty with there purchase, coupled with a bit of exclusivity that is not better than the sum of its parts and you pay for it as well!

I've never got the appeal of a standard bodied 3 series, with some wheels, a front lip a breathed on pretty standard engine and some interior changes that usually consisted of pieces of wood veneer.

I have always liked Alpina wheels though

I don't know enough about them and only had an 8 series version that was more cosmetic than anything else, but been in a few others, however I'm sure there is a fan base!

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

The Alpinas have always been the toned down softer version for people who don't want to be so shouty with there purchase, coupled with a bit of exclusivity !

Yep that sounds absolutely perfect. I fell for the Alpina C2 back at Sytner Nottingham way back when and have always preferred them to the M equivalents...

Lets be honest when I bought my M5 I really wanted a B5 Touring but I couldnt afford it!

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

Yep that sounds absolutely perfect. I fell for the Alpina C2 back at Sytner Nottingham way back when and have always preferred them to the M equivalents...

Lets be honest when I bought my M5 I really wanted a B5 Touring but I couldnt afford it!

A B5 touring was more expensive than the M5?

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

A B5 touring was more expensive than the M5?

It was my M5 which was one of the last of the non comp models at huge discount!

Although it might have been cheaper to spend more on the B5 and have kept it longer...

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

It was my M5 which was one of the last of the non comp models at huge discount!

Although it might have been cheaper to spend more on the B5 and have kept it longer...

Why do you prefer the B5, the M5 is not exactly shouty and to the untrained eye looks like a standard 5 series, in fact the B5 is probably more so?

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

Why do you prefer the B5, the M5 is not exactly shouty and to the untrained eye looks like a standard 5 series, in fact the B5 is probably more so?

Saloon v touring was one thing, M5 suspension was too harsh for my liking, and the B5 I tried seemed to be more comfortable, and suited my taste more...

As you said earlier its all about what you want from a car and it became apparent very quickly that the M5 wasnt what I wanted - even though it will always be the best car I ever own.

[Pond]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

Rare because there was a much, much better version of a hot 3 series called the M3!

I am guessing you have never had an Alpina?

Best way to describe them is 'the gentleman's M' IMO.

They are very different to drive than any other BMW (of the same model). Ms have always been 'shouty' and 'obnoxious' (on purpose). The equivalent Alpinas have always been understated but just as rapid; just in a more refined way.

Yes they were always stupid expensive, which makes them rare. The E92 above cost more than an M3 equivalent in 2008.

worth noting that an Apina isn't just bumpers, wheels and badges. There was an awful lot more went into them. Apparently every car's suspension was tuned specifically to the car. They were generally fitted with Mahle forged pistons and had bespoke engine and gearbox maps among many other things.

I would take a G series B3 touring over a G series M3 touring any day of the week as I know it will be a better car to actually drive.

[crAbb]

Originally Posted by Pond

I am guessing you have never had an Alpina?

Best way to describe them is 'the gentleman's M' IMO.

They are very different to drive than any other BMW (of the same model). Ms have always been 'shouty' and 'obnoxious' (on purpose). The equivalent Alpinas have always been understated but just as rapid; just in a more refined way.

Yes they were always stupid expensive, which makes them rare. The E92 above cost more than an M3 equivalent in 2008.

worth noting that an Apina isn't just bumpers, wheels and badges. There was an awful lot more went into them. Apparently every car's suspension was tuned specifically to the car. They were generally fitted with Mahle forged pistons and had bespoke engine and gearbox maps among many other things.

I would take a G series B3 touring over a G series M3 touring any day of the week as I know it will be a better car to actually drive.

To give you an idea of what goes into developing an Alpina, the seat cushions are 'tuned' to the revised suspension. The idea being to travel extremely fast, with the minimum of fatigue.

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by Pond

I am guessing you have never had an Alpina?

Best way to describe them is 'the gentleman's M' IMO.

They are very different to drive than any other BMW (of the same model). Ms have always been 'shouty' and 'obnoxious' (on purpose). The equivalent Alpinas have always been understated but just as rapid; just in a more refined way.

Yes they were always stupid expensive, which makes them rare. The E92 above cost more than an M3 equivalent in 2008.

worth noting that an Apina isn't just bumpers, wheels and badges. There was an awful lot more went into them. Apparently every car's suspension was tuned specifically to the car. They were generally fitted with Mahle forged pistons and had bespoke engine and gearbox maps among many other things.

I would take a G series B3 touring over a G series M3 touring any day of the week as I know it will be a better car to actually drive.

I had an 8 series that was an Alpina car, no engine mods though. Loved the wheels, massive dish's on them.

I guess I like an aesthetically pleasing car as well as a great driver, and thats probably why I have never been interested when the M3 is all pumped and blown.

Each to their own!

[XAlp]

Lovely car. I’d like an early E90 series B3 estate, but I’m not completely sure they exist! I slightly prefer the front compared to the facelift, plus I’d hope for the deep dish wheels!
Loved both my D3’s…
At the moment my AT browsing is for a later B3 touring or a V8 M3 convertible!

[TurboWeasel]

Originally Posted by Pond

Best way to describe them is 'the gentleman's M' IMO.

They are very different to drive than any other BMW (of the same model). Ms have always been 'shouty' and 'obnoxious' (on purpose). The equivalent Alpinas have always been understated but just as rapid; just in a more refined way.

Yes they were always stupid expensive, which makes them rare. The E92 above cost more than an M3 equivalent in 2008.

Yep, Alpina are engineers and craftsmen/ladies in their own right, unlike frippery mongers like Mansory who just ruin very expensive cars with equally over priced tacky tat.

M is just assumed to be the best because it sits at the top of BMW's hierarchy, but to be honest, both the E46 and E92 M3s I found to be very over-rated. Overly stiff and crashy suspension, crap steering, absolutely gutless below 4000rpm (but shorter final drives fix that), annoying resonance from their exhausts and just constantly busy on the road, never feeling truly settled.

The E39 M5 was much more of a well rounded daily usable package, because funnily enough, it was more akin to Alpina's ethos of effortless torque and comfort

I might look into an Alpina D5S some day when everyone has EVs and they are worthless!

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by TurboWeasel

Yep, Alpina are engineers and craftsmen/ladies in their own right, unlike frippery mongers like Mansory who just ruin very expensive cars with equally over priced tacky tat.

M is just assumed to be the best because it sits at the top of BMW's hierarchy, but to be honest, both the E46 and E92 M3s I found to be very over-rated. Overly stiff and crashy suspension, crap steering, absolutely gutless below 4000rpm (but shorter final drives fix that), annoying resonance from their exhausts and just constantly busy on the road, never feeling truly settled.

The E39 M5 was much more of a well rounded daily usable package, because funnily enough, it was more akin to Alpina's ethos of effortless torque and comfort

I might look into an Alpina D5S some day when everyone has EVs and they are worthless!

I am not sure I would call an E46 and M3 V8 overated. They are considered to be up there with the best and highly sought after. Not sure I would want any Turbo charged car over an NA either.

To get good power and toque from an engine by adding Turbos is easy and lazy, but getting similar power from an NA is a lot harder and takes much more research, development and no doubt cost. Normally from that development (flat plane cranks etc) comes great noises that they produced as well as crisp throttle response and power thats just builds and builds.

[crAbb]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

I am not sure I would call an E46 and M3 V8 overated. They are considered to be up there with the best and highly sought after. Not sure I would want any Turbo charged car over an NA either.

To get good power and toque from an engine by adding Turbos is easy and lazy, but getting similar power from an NA is a lot harder and takes much more research, development and no doubt cost. Normally from that development (flat plane cranks etc) comes great noises that they produced as well as crisp throttle response and power thats just builds and builds.

Turbocharging fits very neatly with the Alpina ethos of going very fast, very easily, in great comfort. If you have the opportunity, I'd urge you to try the latest G20/21 Alpinas. For me, they work better on UK roads than the M cars.

[Pond]

Originally Posted by crAbb

Turbocharging fits very neatly with the Alpina ethos of going very fast, very easily, in great comfort.

AND of course Alpina don't use a speed limiter, so bragging rights down the pub (or private members club) too. Win win.

[crAbb]

Originally Posted by Pond

AND of course Alpina don't use a speed limiter, so bragging rights down the pub (or private members club) too. Win win.

Indeed they don't. And their performance claims tend to be conservative. I recall thd first B7 had a claimed top speed of 300kph. A contemporary German motor magazine took one Nardo, and timed it at 311kph....