[2014BMW320iMSport]

I know there are all manner of threads on this subject but I am wondering how bad (frequent) the issue really is and how quickly it goes from a slight noise to total destruction of the engine. I realize to those it who have experienced the slipping timing chain the statistics don't matter .... your call is a total loss but internet forums are usually where people post bad experiences and this can sometimes skew the real numbers (what % of the overall fleet of thousands of models).

My main concern is that my 2014 320i is a high mileage car. I drive much more than the average person. I am the second owner and bought it with all service records at 16,000 miles. I now have 85,000+ miles and if I own it another year that number will be well above 100,000 miles. I am trying to determine if I should replace the car and not take any chances. Looking at posts on the matter leads me to believe that replacing the timing chain and rails is costly (some say several thousands dollars).

Here are my questions:

1) Is the problem really that prevalent? BMW has produced thousands of 320 and 328 models.

2) For those who have experienced it (either the noise and fixed it, or those whose motors just suddenly went) how bad or noticeable is the noise and how quickly can you go from hearing some noise to engine failure? Are we talking days, months, minutes or in some cases without any warning.

Trying to make a decision whether to get out now or keep the car. I really enjoy the car and this issue notwithstanding had planned to keep the car a few more years. I do have an aftermarket warranty that covers the engine (through Carmax where I bought the car) but I am sure there are enough loop holes for them to get out of replacing an entire engine or make it difficult enough that I'd likely end up hiring a lawyer and accruing tons of legal fees.

I've read all the different threads and there is quite a bit of conflicting info on when the timing part was replaced (based on production month and year) and also confusion about how to visually identify which part (old or upgrade new) your car has.

I know from past experience on another car I owned that had engine issues (valve stem guides wearing out prematurely) that what is taken as gospel on the internet isn't always accurate and that you have to do hours of research to clear up some misconceptions. On that previous car (not a BMW) I did get legal representation and we conducted hours of research and got verifiable information from the manufacturer that dispelled much of the myth or gospel on the internet that was taken for 100% accurate.

[bavarianride]

Post 3/2013 is supposed to be OK per BMWNA, who last week issues an ELW on pre-3/2013 timing chain and drive chain for oil pump for 7-yr/70k-mile.

One local foreman their shop saw 20 cars so far, across all N20/N26 in 3 series/5 series/X1/X3/Z4.

Our metro area has 8 dealers, so just say together there are 150 cars with issues. And across US there are 10 major metro areas, for 1500 cars total.

MY12 and early pre-3/2013 MY13 are like 150k units in US? So we are probably looking at 1% failure rate. All my opinions an guesstimates of course.

Do note all ESC has maximum payout tied to FMV of the car, so a car worth $10k will not get paid $20k to $25k for a new engine from ESC.

[pompous]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

Post 3/2013 is supposed to be OK per BMWNA, who last week issues an ELW on pre-3/2013 timing chain and drive chain for oil pump for 7-yr/70k-mile.

Side questions...My SA said this actually has to be "failed" for them to replace it. Otherwise they charge a $150 diagnostic fee. What is an ELW by the way?

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by pompous

Side questions...My SA said this actually has to be "failed" for them to replace it. Otherwise they charge a $150 diagnostic fee. What is an ELW by the way?

ELW=extended limited warranty

The F30 timing chain ELW is tied to SI B11 03 17, which applies to pre-3/2013 F30 328i/320i, F10 528i, and other N20/N26 usages(X1/X3/Z4?).

The ELW is for 7-yr/70k-mile.

Your SA is correct, customers need to authorize diagnostics. If the issue is confirmed, the diagnostics fee will be paid by BMWNA, otherwise the customers need to pay diag.

My local SA does say a diag of TC issue will take 4-6 hours at shop(including teardown).

On the other hand, bmwtechnician.com says if whine matches a BMW sound file then the issue will be confirmed. If true the diag hour should not be more than an hour.

[Sunnyledge]

So while BMW is saying the issue is with pre 3/2013 engines, are there notable cases occuring in post 3/2013 cars?

[englishguy84]

Originally Posted by Sunnyledge

So while BMW is saying the issue is with pre 3/2013 engines, are there notable cases occuring in post 3/2013 cars?

Definitely feel like I’ve seen some on these forums conventional wisdom was that they changed the parts around 1/15

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by englishguy84

Definitely feel like I’ve seen some on these forums conventional wisdom was that they changed the parts around 1/15

Online part shows 2 part# for timing chain, one for till 1/2015, with Notes of "ENDED", the other has no condition.

There are other related engine parts, e.g. valve train stopper bolt, that have 1/2015 ENDED status too, so one explanation is that the new TC part# was related to other changes.

[interceptor428]

I'm wondering if the TC (and other part) changes in 2015 are related to this new 0w-20 oil now used in these engines

[mfstrby]

Just to prepare myself for the worst, does anyone know how much it would cost to get it fixed?

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by colonel_bagshot

Just to prepare myself for the worst, does anyone know how much it would cost to get it fixed?

Local indies quoted around $2k for timing chain, rails, oil chain, and oil pump, assuming no engine damage.

[mfstrby]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

Local indies quoted around $2k for timing chain, rails, oil chain, and oil pump, assuming no engine damage.

Oh boy, I was expecting to hear something like that. Is it even possible to avoid engine damage?

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by colonel_bagshot

Oh boy, I was expecting to hear something like that. Is it even possible to avoid engine damage?

The local foreman said the engine whine is very noticeable, and it takes some time(not sure how long) to degrade to broken chain. The camshaft timing will likely be messed up and CEL will be lit(not confirmed by any online account, believable?) before the chain snaps, but it is not 100% clear.

Check out the video clips in the attached link.

Also the stretched timing chain will lead to rubbing, and there will be excessive shiny patches on the timing chain. Those can be visually inspected through the oil cap opening.

FWIW, the BMW engineers did make the timing chain easily accessible.

https://bmwtechnician.com/2016/08/07...ng-chain-issue

[bavarianride]

A friend just confirmed that his 2016 328i shows up on bmw-rp.com too, so maybe BMWNA just keeps it simple and extends warranty on timing chain of all N20/N26.

[englishguy84]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

The local foreman said the engine whine is very noticeable, and it takes some time(not sure how long) to degrade to broken chain. The camshaft timing will likely be messed up and CEL will be lit(not confirmed by any online account, believable?) before the chain snaps, but it is not 100% clear.

Check out the video clips in the attached link.

Also the stretched timing chain will lead to rubbing, and there will be excessive shiny patches on the timing chain. Those can be visually inspected through the oil cap opening.

FWIW, the BMW engineers did make the timing chain easily accessible.

https://bmwtechnician.com/2016/08/07...ng-chain-issue

And then they made the B48 and stuck the timing chain in the back!

[OUGrad05]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

The local foreman said the engine whine is very noticeable, and it takes some time(not sure how long) to degrade to broken chain. The camshaft timing will likely be messed up and CEL will be lit(not confirmed by any online account, believable?) before the chain snaps, but it is not 100% clear.

Check out the video clips in the attached link.

Also the stretched timing chain will lead to rubbing, and there will be excessive shiny patches on the timing chain. Those can be visually inspected through the oil cap opening.

FWIW, the BMW engineers did make the timing chain easily accessible.

https://bmwtechnician.com/2016/08/07...ng-chain-issue

I looked at this on my wife's BMW X3, it was produced in 2014 and had shiny patches, we have since traded it due to poor out of warranty service issues at local BMW dealer that a good family friend experienced, but makes me wonder if our marks were excessive. I'll see if I can find those pics and repost.

[OUGrad05]

Here's one of them, clear chain scuffing, not sure what counts as excessive, the vehicle at this point had 38,000 miles on it. Based on subsequent reading, I would be less worried about the chain persay and instead the plastic guides which are likely taking damage due to the scuff marks on the metal chain.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by englishguy84

And then they made the B48 and stuck the timing chain in the back!

For that reason it unlikely any 30i and 40i will be in my garage.

Supposedly swapping TC to the back provides improved NVH characteristics, at the expense of accessibility and serviceability.

That is all good if reliability is rock solid .... oh well ....

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by OUGrad05

Here's one of them, clear chain scuffing, not sure what counts as excessive, the vehicle at this point had 38,000 miles on it. Based on subsequent reading, I would be less worried about the chain persay and instead the plastic guides which are likely taking damage due to the scuff marks on the metal chain.

Your jpg does not show up, do check out this picture from bmwtechnician. Mine also has shiny patch, but not as wide(on full length of each link), and not as deeply scratched. Yes the plastic guides(top and side) are snapped together, the first thing to break is the snap-on tab, and once that is broken, the two guides will be off spec, and the chain will start to take extra stress.

https://bmwtechnician.files.wordpres...08/image13.jpg

[insanecoder]

Originally Posted by englishguy84

And then they made the B48 and stuck the timing chain in the back!

Supposedly these were fixed in the BXX engines
so confidently they were that indeed the damn chain was placed completely out of reach lol yes so if indeed the problem still existed they may have serious service work to do

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by insanecoder

Supposedly these were fixed in the BXX engines
so confidently they were that indeed the damn chain was placed completely out of reach lol yes so if indeed the problem still existed they may have serious service work to do

For B engines with TC in the back, even if the engine is not damaged, any TC fix will need to remove engine from the bay.

That was the case for N47 TC problem and a huge PR nightmare for BMW. Apparently BMW engineers are so confident that past history will not repeat it .... time will tell....

[rak299]

I would not expect CEL to come on. Slack would be taken up by chain tensioner. The biggest mess I ever saw was on an older model MBZ. Slack in chain caused enough vibration to break a chain rail. The rail spun around and got between the chain and the cam sprocket, snapping the chain. Open valve hits a piston, valve breaks camshaft.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by rak299

I would not expect CEL to come on. Slack would be taken up by chain tensioner. The biggest mess I ever saw was on an older model MBZ. Slack in chain caused enough vibration to break a chain rail. The rail spun around and got between the chain and the cam sprocket, snapping the chain. Open valve hits a piston, valve breaks camshaft.

Yes none of the online account of TC failure mentions CEL. Some of the engine failures related to N20/N26 happened with snapped chain too, resulting in $20k to $25k repair bill at dealer. One indy said he charged $3500-4000 to swap in a used N20/N26 engine for a X1, but it was luck to locate such the engine(which costed $2500?).