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      08-29-2017, 01:00 PM   #23
robbiep
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nobby Clark View Post
2. I often keep my PCP (BMW) cars to ride out the neg equity so I want it in good shape then too
That makes absolutely no sense. Your car is worth less than you the price you're being asked to pay for it, so you buy it so that you can keep it until it's depreciated even more.
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      08-29-2017, 01:47 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robbiep
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nobby Clark View Post
2. I often keep my PCP (BMW) cars to ride out the neg equity so I want it in good shape then too
That makes absolutely no sense. Your car is worth less than you the price you're being asked to pay for it, so you buy it so that you can keep it until it's depreciated even more.
The equity is a difficult one to accurately price as if you wanted to replace the car, you know the car would cost a darn site more to be auc than what they hand over for its apparent value... Ie at end of term, chances are they would place your car on the fourcourt for a fair bit more than the gfv. i.e is it really negative equity if you are planning to keep it anyway...
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      08-29-2017, 02:12 PM   #25
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I for one enjoy washing my cars, I spend hours sat in front of a screen for work and quite enjoy doing something more 'manual' where there is a sense of achievement. Mines on a PCP and don't 'own' the car but still like to look after it.

I don't own my house as I have a mortgage on it and will prob sell it in 5 years to get a larger property but I still look after it and keep it clean. Is that any different?
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      08-29-2017, 02:26 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robbiep View Post
That makes absolutely no sense. Your car is worth less than you the price you're being asked to pay for it, so you buy it so that you can keep it until it's depreciated even more.
You are assuming Im selling it at the end of term when it is in negative equity. I'm saying that in my experience, if you hold on to the car 1-2 years longer, the depreciation curve levels out and you can sell the car for what it's worth in year 4,5 or 6. In that time you are also not paying a monthly.

As @goodbyalfa says, you also need to weigh up the cost to change.

Cars are only in negative equity when you come to sell. If you buy new out right, you car is in negative equity immediately. It's a depreciating asset.

At the end of the day it's all down to cost per month. People cry about neg equity at the end of a PCP when really they are just upset there is nothing to add to their deposit on the next car.

Last edited by Nobby Clark; 08-29-2017 at 02:42 PM..
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      08-29-2017, 03:44 PM   #27
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I don't own my house as I have a mortgage on it and will prob sell it in 5 years to get a larger property but I still look after it and keep it clean. Is that any different?
A PCP is renting a car - you do not own it at all. You have (probably) paid an advance rental, and a rental fee each month.
You have bought your house, with the aid of a mortgage. You are not renting it.

If you don't understand the difference between the 2, then there's really not much to be said.
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      08-29-2017, 03:54 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by robbiep View Post
A PCP is renting a car - you do not own it at all. You have (probably) paid an advance rental, and a rental fee each month.
You have bought your house, with the aid of a mortgage. You are not renting it.

If you don't understand the difference between the 2, then there's really not much to be said.
Please elaborate, or read your own last sentence back to yourself.

With both a PCP and a mortgage you pay a deposit, you pay monthly premiums and you don't own either until you have paid everything. No difference.
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      08-29-2017, 10:46 PM   #29
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About 2 hours inside and out for my F31. Use a foam gun, 2 buckets, mini air compressor etc.... if I am sealing the wheels with HydrO2 then add another 30 mins!

Generally every 2 weeks. Have 3 cars.... and I enjoy being outside! Oh and they're all owned.
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      08-30-2017, 01:35 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by robbiep View Post
Cars get washed if they really need it - maybe every month in winter, every 2-3 months this time of year.
And we own all our cars, not on lease or PCP !

Does amuse me, some people spending hours carefully washing and waxing, working on the wheels, on a car they don't even own.
And what defines "if they really need it"? That's down to opinion, some feel their cars need washing as soon as they can visibly see dirt and others think they need washing when they can no longer see out of their windows/mirrors.

I've always bought used cars and the condition of some that I have viewed is appalling. Baked on dirt/tar is a pain to remove and if droppings have been left on the paintwork for weeks, they eat through the lacquer. The condition of the car is the first thing I see when viewing a car and it has often put me right off.

I wash my cars as a hobby, I'm sure you have hobbies that aren't everyone's cuppa tea, yet you will find forums full of people who enjoy the same thing
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      08-31-2017, 12:31 PM   #31
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the car is in some ways a representation of myself
Exactly, which is why mine only has a proper wash once a fortnight
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      08-31-2017, 01:07 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nobby Clark View Post
You are assuming Im selling it at the end of term when it is in negative equity. I'm saying that in my experience, if you hold on to the car 1-2 years longer, the depreciation curve levels out and you can sell the car for what it's worth in year 4,5 or 6. In that time you are also not paying a monthly.

As @goodbyalfa says, you also need to weigh up the cost to change.

Cars are only in negative equity when you come to sell. If you buy new out right, you car is in negative equity immediately. It's a depreciating asset.

At the end of the day it's all down to cost per month. People cry about neg equity at the end of a PCP when really they are just upset there is nothing to add to their deposit on the next car.
It still doesn't make sense to me to buy a car that is worth less than you're being asked to pay. I can't imagine that being a common occurrence.

You could just buy a second hand car of the same age and same or similar spec and you're better off straight away. Both cars will be worth the same in the extra two years, but you'll have paid less to start with.

You may well have a personal attachment to your car, or you might think it's worth keeeping a car you know the history of. But financially it makes zero sense, which is why almost no one would do it. Here you go sir, I have a car for you that's worth £12k, it's all yours if you want it, but you need to give me £15k!
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      08-31-2017, 01:11 PM   #33
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I don't understand the point re detailing on how you pay for your car, own outright, pcp, lease or whatever. If you drive it everyday and you're keeping it for several years, the physical presence of the car and the driving experience is identical. Cleaning and detailing should not be connected to the financial choice you made, do it if you like to, don't if you don't. But each to their own surely?!
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      08-31-2017, 04:03 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex440 View Post
It still doesn't make sense to me to buy a car that is worth less than you're being asked to pay. I can't imagine that being a common occurrence.

You could just buy a second hand car of the same age and same or similar spec and you're better off straight away. Both cars will be worth the same in the extra two years, but you'll have paid less to start with.

You may well have a personal attachment to your car, or you might think it's worth keeeping a car you know the history of. But financially it makes zero sense, which is why almost no one would do it. Here you go sir, I have a car for you that's worth £12k, it's all yours if you want it, but you need to give me £15k!
In theory yes. In reality, finding a car of the same spec, the time involved, dealing with an unknown and it's not worth it.
You also need to keep in mind, most people are judging negative equity against a dealer trade in price and not an actual private sale. and they are doing this well before the PCP end date which makes a huge difference.
My car, for example, at 2 years old was valued at £20k trade in according to BNW. On WBAC, which usually gives the lowest value, it's over £25k.
My reckoning is the GFV will be very close to a private sale price at the end of the day.
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      08-31-2017, 04:09 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex440 View Post
I don't understand the point re detailing on how you pay for your car, own outright, pcp, lease or whatever. If you drive it everyday and you're keeping it for several years, the physical presence of the car and the driving experience is identical. Cleaning and detailing should not be connected to the financial choice you made, do it if you like to, don't if you don't. But each to their own surely?!
If you own or pcp and keep the car, the condition it's in will make a difference when it comes to selling. Cleaning the car regularly helps keep the paint tip top and reduces corrosion.
Which us d car would you buy? One that's clean and (perceived) well looked after or one that's neglected and got 3 years 5hit all over it.
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      08-31-2017, 04:11 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nobby Clark View Post
In theory yes. In reality, finding a car of the same spec, the time involved, dealing with an unknown and it's not worth it.
You also need to keep in mind, most people are judging negative equity against a dealer trade in price and not an actual private sale. and they are doing this well before the PCP end date which makes a huge difference.
My car, for example, at 2 years old was valued at £20k trade in according to BNW. On WBAC, which usually gives the lowest value, it's over £25k.
My reckoning is the GFV will be very close to a private sale price at the end of the day.
Sorry, you just said negative equity. It isn't in negative equity if you can't buy one for less than the GFV. The trade in price is irrelevant in calculating negative equity if you want to keep the car. The price that matters is what it would cost to replace it, so I assumed that was what you were talking about.
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      08-31-2017, 04:43 PM   #37
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I don?t see whether the car is owned or not has got anything to do with washing or keeping clean.

I had company cars for years and I always kept them clean as I like a nice clean car.
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      08-31-2017, 06:42 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex440 View Post
Sorry, you just said negative equity. It isn't in negative equity if you can't buy one for less than the GFV. The trade in price is irrelevant in calculating negative equity if you want to keep the car. The price that matters is what it would cost to replace it, so I assumed that was what you were talking about.
More like if you can't sell it for more than the GFV. That's the problem. You're in a selling position, not a buying one.
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      09-01-2017, 02:59 AM   #39
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plus, you never mentioned all the free swirls you got!!!!
But since it's going to be dirty again the minute it rains and I only get it cleaned every 4 months or so, I don't care about swirls
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      09-01-2017, 05:21 AM   #40
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On garden leave and washing my car 2-3 times per week.

Damn having spare time and damn having a black car
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      09-01-2017, 10:11 AM   #41
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I try and wash mine every two weeks, which is normally around every 1k miles.

Takes me 90-120 minutes.
That includes cleaning inside of wheels
Wash
Dry
Quick Detail/ or I apply sealant every two months which adds an extra 30 minutes..

It's certainly not a quick job..
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      09-01-2017, 10:24 AM   #42
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It takes me about 3 hours to clean my F31. Even when I intend to "just give it a quick going over". The EBII looks so good in the sun I always end up polishing and or waxing.
Last weekend I questioned what I'd become when, for the first time ever, I used a toothbrush on the wheels (to get to those 'hard to reach places'.).
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      09-01-2017, 10:39 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by jnismith View Post
But since it's going to be dirty again the minute it rains and I only get it cleaned every 4 months or so, I don't care about swirls
That's like saying,"I'm not going to wash my hands after having a dump. I'll only have to do it again tomorrow."


The next buyer may care about swirls though.

Last edited by Nobby Clark; 09-01-2017 at 02:10 PM..
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