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      04-11-2015, 12:15 PM   #45
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Well that makes sense...take a lower end model, and option it out...there will always be overlap. The idea is to upsell. If you optioned out a 428, you would get to a point where a 435 makes more sense. Same applies with going from 435 to M4.

That being said, while pricing may point towards an M4, a 435Xi customer is not thinking about an M4...because performance is entirely different and M4 is RWD only.

Nothing new here, this happens with all products, industries and manufacturers.
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      04-11-2015, 12:20 PM   #46
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Whoever spends more than $60k for a 435i convertible is out of their minds... Especially now, when the 440i's are around the corner in a year or two. In 1 year the depreciation will make the value drop like a rock.

If money is no object, then go for it. But I'd rather get an M4 vert in that case.
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      04-11-2015, 12:36 PM   #47
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My 435 GC was nearly fully loaded except a few things, with options like MPPK and MPE. MSRP was something like $67k, I got it for $61k. My monthly payment is just under $700 a month.

While the MSRP is close to an M3 (i needed 4 doors) I was comfortable with the 435GC mainly because there was more negotiating room with the 4 series over the M cars. So even though MSRPs are close you wouldn't get anywhere near the same cap cost after negotiation.

Also, usually when people compare standard cars to M cars they talk about a fully loaded version to a bare bones stripper. There is no way I'd ever get a $50k+ car with no options like the package, comfort access etc. given that, the M3 price jumps up another $8k minimum in options.
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      04-11-2015, 01:09 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbydigital View Post
My 435 GC was nearly fully loaded except a few things, with options like MPPK and MPE. MSRP was something like $67k, I got it for $61k. My monthly payment is just under $700 a month.

While the MSRP is close to an M3 (i needed 4 doors) I was comfortable with the 435GC mainly because there was more negotiating room with the 4 series over the M cars. So even though MSRPs are close you wouldn't get anywhere near the same cap cost after negotiation.

Also, usually when people compare standard cars to M cars they talk about a fully loaded version to a bare bones stripper. There is no way I'd ever get a $50k+ car with no options like the package, comfort access etc. given that, the M3 price jumps up another $8k minimum in options.
You're right on, it is about a $10k gap between the M3 and 435GC if the optioning is similar, and a loaded up 435GC will definitely overlap with M3 pricing

The MSRP and negotiated cost of your 435GC and my M3 is the same, but I am definitely accepting a much lower set of comfort features (i.e. no back up camera, cloth seats, no moonroof, 18" wheels)
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      04-11-2015, 02:28 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbydigital View Post
My 435 GC was nearly fully loaded except a few things, with options like MPPK and MPE. MSRP was something like $67k, I got it for $61k. My monthly payment is just under $700 a month.

While the MSRP is close to an M3 (i needed 4 doors) I was comfortable with the 435GC mainly because there was more negotiating room with the 4 series over the M cars. So even though MSRPs are close you wouldn't get anywhere near the same cap cost after negotiation.

Also, usually when people compare standard cars to M cars they talk about a fully loaded version to a bare bones stripper. There is no way I'd ever get a $50k+ car with no options like the package, comfort access etc. given that, the M3 price jumps up another $8k minimum in options.
You're right on, it is about a $10k gap between the M3 and 435GC if the optioning is similar, and a loaded up 435GC will definitely overlap with M3 pricing

The MSRP and negotiated cost of your 435GC and my M3 is the same, but I am definitely accepting a much lower set of comfort features (i.e. no back up camera, cloth seats, no moonroof, 18" wheels)
Coming from an '04 Z4, I was determined to have all the interior creature comforts so I optioned it with basically everything except the lighting package. I even added parking assistant and ACC for the heck of it.

Admittedly, if it wasn't a lease, I would have been more conservative with options.
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      04-11-2015, 03:31 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by bobbydigital View Post
Coming from an '04 Z4, I was determined to have all the interior creature comforts so I optioned it with basically everything except the lighting package. I even added parking assistant and ACC for the heck of it.

Admittedly, if it wasn't a lease, I would have been more conservative with options.
I can definitely see that point of view. I would have really liked to have the side and rear cameras and parking sensors on the m3 but didn't want to pay for the executive package

My start point was the opposite from yours. I'm replacing a '12 z435 that had a lot of option packages but had nowhere close to the cooling capacity needed for track use and (I thought) did not have enough power for the weight.

Both our choices make a lot of sense based on what we were trying to get out of our z4 replacements!
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      04-12-2015, 01:15 AM   #51
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I'm not surprised but it's still jarring to see on paper.
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      04-12-2015, 07:37 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbydigital View Post
Coming from an '04 Z4, I was determined to have all the interior creature comforts so I optioned it with basically everything except the lighting package. I even added parking assistant and ACC for the heck of it.

Admittedly, if it wasn't a lease, I would have been more conservative with options.
I can definitely see that point of view. I would have really liked to have the side and rear cameras and parking sensors on the m3 but didn't want to pay for the executive package

My start point was the opposite from yours. I'm replacing a '12 z435 that had a lot of option packages but had nowhere close to the cooling capacity needed for track use and (I thought) did not have enough power for the weight.

Both our choices make a lot of sense based on what we were trying to get out of our z4 replacements!
You can't go wrong with the M3/4. May I ask if you would recommend anyone who doesn't track their cars periodically to buy an M3? I would love the performance but over the past decade I have been telling myself that I want to track cars and over that time I have been to the track less than 10 times and each time it was a dealer sponsored event. I doubt the next decade will be any different

Congrats on the m3
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      04-12-2015, 03:35 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 300hp View Post
You can't go wrong with the M3/4. May I ask if you would recommend anyone who doesn't track their cars periodically to buy an M3? I would love the performance but over the past decade I have been telling myself that I want to track cars and over that time I have been to the track less than 10 times and each time it was a dealer sponsored event. I doubt the next decade will be any different

Congrats on the m3
Thanks! My wife has an f30 335 so i have a lot of direct experience with that car too.

Honestly, i think for a straight up commuter and thinking rationally the 335 is the better car. Lower cost to lease/buy and 25 vs 20mpg. Both cars are overkill for commuter bumper to bumper traffic use.

For me though, it was not a rational decision. Ive wanted an m3 for many years and finances finally permitted it so i went for it. I am a light (1-2 days per month) non competitive track user and stock f30 335 sportline and z435 had insufficient cooling so that somewhat played into my decision as well.

Yolo so i think you should go for it. Or get a fast porsche.
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      04-12-2015, 11:06 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xDrive35i View Post
This happens every time BMW rolls out a new model year.

I loaded up a 435i xDrive convertible with M-sport for a whopping $77,725! After tax here in Chicago, that's about $85,000 for what is effectively a 335i convertible. The entry-level luxury segment has never entered this kind of territory before. Why not get an M4 convertible? I remember when the M5 barely eclipsed the $80,000 mark. I just can't wrap my brain around it!
That's really well equipped Cayman/Boxster territory. Trouble is you can get a slower hard topped version for $40,000 less. That makes no sense to me.
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      04-14-2015, 11:01 AM   #55
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Might be off topic but I recall seeing somewhere that the German philosophy to cars is that if it doesn't make it faster or perform better it doesn't belong. Does anyone else recall hearing/seeing this? Personally I'd forgo a lot of the creature comforts and ensure my money goes towards go faster/better options
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      04-14-2015, 06:11 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jb3617 View Post
Might be off topic but I recall seeing somewhere that the German philosophy to cars is that if it doesn't make it faster or perform better it doesn't belong. Does anyone else recall hearing/seeing this? Personally I'd forgo a lot of the creature comforts and ensure my money goes towards go faster/better options
Maybe a long time ago (i.e. my 1987 VW Jetta had no cup holders)

But these days I look at the Porsche option sheets and see a lot of color crests and other cosmetic options that cost a lot $. Same with BMW and individual paints, interiors etc. parking cameras, full leather interiors, moonroofs aren't performance oriented but are in a lot of our cars too...

I agree on your stance on options but can see the other side of it, since I do wish I had a backup camera....
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      04-14-2015, 07:38 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jb3617 View Post
Might be off topic but I recall seeing somewhere that the German philosophy to cars is that if it doesn't make it faster or perform better it doesn't belong. Does anyone else recall hearing/seeing this? Personally I'd forgo a lot of the creature comforts and ensure my money goes towards go faster/better options
I remember when even on a top-of-the-range Merc 560SEC, the passenger side door mirror was electrically-controlled but the driver's was manually adjusted. I think the theory was 'why make it electric the driver can just reach over...'

Glad they stopped with this nonsense.
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      04-14-2015, 07:45 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
Maybe a long time ago (i.e. my 1987 VW Jetta had no cup holders)

But these days I look at the Porsche option sheets and see a lot of color crests and other cosmetic options that cost a lot $. Same with BMW and individual paints, interiors etc. parking cameras, full leather interiors, moonroofs aren't performance oriented but are in a lot of our cars too...

I agree on your stance on options but can see the other side of it, since I do wish I had a backup camera....
I see your point. They wouldn't sell nearly as many cars as they do if they didn't have the options available.
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      04-14-2015, 11:25 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s0nu
Yeah these cars are getting a bit too expensive. I'm in the market for a 435 and my buddy just got an IS350 F sport for half the lease payment. With a better quality interior.
Not only that, the value on BMWs are dropping like there is no tomorrow!

A 60K car with 20K miles you are lucky if you get 35k after 3 years!

This will be the last BMW that I buy, from now on... only good deal on leases and in every 3 years change to a newer model without down payment.
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