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BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > Technical Forums > Suspension | Chassis | Brakes > PSS10 Comfort vs. Normal Version?
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      03-14-2020, 10:20 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CPT Smuggs View Post
I've been researching these a lot, trying to decide between KW SC, and PSS10 Comfort / Standard. I believe there is a typo in the spring rates, and they should read:

OEM 0mm Front Springs is 160 ft/lbs // Rears 486 ft/lbs
10-30mm Front Springs is 289 ft/lbs // Rears 428 ft/lbs
30-50mm Front Springs 400 ft/lbs // Rears 566 ft/lbs

The interesting part is that the KW SC have a flat +80 ft/lbs front and rear (240 / 575) while Bilstein is +129 / -58 (comfort) and +240 / +80 (standard) Both PSS10 use the same dampers, so the extra 20mm in spring length must factor in to the comfort spring rates. This makes the decision even harder as I want the Bilsteins for the ease of adjustment, but feel that the KW will be more comfortable as a daily driver.
You're correct. PSS10 Comfort is 289 front per my discussion with a Bilstein rep this week.

Where did you get that OEM rate info? Is that published somewhere? And aren't they somewhat different based on weights of different models (RWD, xDrive, F30, F31, etc) and options (6MT, auto, +/- sunroof, etc)?
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      09-15-2020, 01:30 PM   #24
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So if I am reading this correctly, the valving is the same between the comfort/standard versions. Only difference is spring rates?

I ask because there's a set of the comfort version for sale, but the plan was to upgrade springs anyways so it doesn't matter if I have the comfort version or not.
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      09-15-2020, 03:39 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itsrichierich View Post
So if I am reading this correctly, the valving is the same between the comfort/standard versions. Only difference is spring rates?

I ask because there's a set of the comfort version for sale, but the plan was to upgrade springs anyways so it doesn't matter if I have the comfort version or not.
Yes, the dampers are the same, the springs are what's different. Bilstein expects you to adjust the damping to what you like for whichever springs you have.
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      09-15-2020, 04:05 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by FaRKle! View Post
Yes, the dampers are the same, the springs are what's different. Bilstein expects you to adjust the damping to what you like for whichever springs you have.
From what you have seen, read or exerpienced, hows the 8/10k spring rate on the Bilstein PSS10? If I used your spring rate chart correctly, says it would be a "pitch" setup.
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      09-15-2020, 06:26 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itsrichierich View Post
From what you have seen, read or exerpienced, hows the 8/10k spring rate on the Bilstein PSS10? If I used your spring rate chart correctly, says it would be a "pitch" setup.
It's not quite accurate to use whole (or half) number kg/mm for Bilstein since they spec their springs in N/mm. The standard (non comfort) springs are 70N/mm (400lbs/in) front and 99N/mm (565lbs/in) rear. 8kg/mm is more like 450lbs/in.

As for the ride, pitch means you need a higher level of damping to control the body than you would otherwise, and that negatively affects ride quality. You can see Andino's experience (0:00 and 5:15) with the stock B14/B16 rates and changing to flat ride below, and this weekend I have another member with B16 comforts coming over to test changing to a flat ride setup to address his ride comfort issues (we're only changing the rear spring since the fronts are soft enough).
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      09-15-2020, 06:28 PM   #28
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I have PSS10 comforts on an F31. Changing the rear spring to a higher rate (to 16 kg/mm in my case) to bring it into a flat ride regime was a big improvement over the standard Bilstein springs. Better balance in weight transfer rate on F and R axles and better settling over bumps.
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      09-15-2020, 11:08 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FaRKle! View Post
It's not quite accurate to use whole (or half) number kg/mm for Bilstein since they spec their springs in N/mm. The standard (non comfort) springs are 70N/mm (400lbs/in) front and 99N/mm (565lbs/in) rear. 8kg/mm is more like 450lbs/in.

As for the ride, pitch means you need a higher level of damping to control the body than you would otherwise, and that negatively affects ride quality. You can see Andino's experience (0:00 and 5:15) with the stock B14/B16 rates and changing to flat ride below, and this weekend I have another member with B16 comforts coming over to test changing to a flat ride setup to address his ride comfort issues (we're only changing the rear spring since the fronts are soft enough).
Thanks for that, are you the other fine young gentleman in the video?

My dilemma is I am looking for a good out the box setup. Reason being is I won’t be keeping this car for long. I’m torn between KW V2, Bilstein PSS10 and smaller brand like CKS or something like that.

From a brand standpoint, I really like Bilstein. Had them on my truck (Before going to Kings), had them on my E46 M3. Loved them. I did both a lot of off-roading, trips to Mexico, they performed amazingly. Same with the E46 M3, frailty driven and 4 track days, performed well.

But for the same price, I can get KW V2 which comes with the cancellation kit. Now I know I can code it out, but for me as a piece of mind and ease of install, I can just plug in the cancellation kit. Never had personal experience with them. Had some friends with them but their opinions were a little biased since most of them didn’t have other coilovers to compare with. No doubt though, they are a good brand from what I can see.

But with all this said, this price I can get a set of CKS coilovers which is your typical “custom” built coilover system. Components from Taiwan, USA and Japan, depending on the component. I like how I can get custom springs, even though I don’t have any experience with choosing my own spring rates. I’m waiting for some detailed pictures of welded brackets and etc to see quality control. Another benefit to choosing them is that they come with camber plates, which saves me another $500 or so.

Decisions....

Edit: Car is used mainly for daily driving but will make an appearance at the track 3-4 times a year.

Last edited by itsrichierich; 09-15-2020 at 11:53 PM..
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