[thejeremyman9]

Originally Posted by oma3710

I honestly think they are wrong. I know the diy guy got 440whp with same setup and oem turbo. I would think I would be around 460-465

That's basically what i said if you read my post above lol. To reiterate what i said initially as well, ignore the numbers and look at the curves, particularly the difference between the curves.

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by thejeremyman9

Updated all the information for your car, including car weight, occ weight, frontal area, drag coef and tire height. Selected 3rd gear like your logs. Confirming gearing matches 8AT specs i had in there. This is about as accurate as it can get.

While i think the numbers are probably about 10% low and you are likely in the upper 400wtq and mid 400whp with the dinan turbo, the point of virtual dyno is not to be able to say my car makes XXX HP, its really just a tool to compare different logs to get a sense for the relative change in HP and the shape of the curve to see how your tune/hardware is able to hold power (or not). So in other words once you get your tune dialed in you can compare that log to these logs and see if the tune revisions made the difference. This of course assumes you log on the same road and in similar ambient conditions. Just like a real dyno run there are numerous factors at play.

These numbers look spot on for a Dinan Turbo, and that’s based on the other dynos I’ve seen. It’s not a PS2, which I’m assuming those off the shelf tunes were based on. I mean, pushing 450whp is a big deal on these - Dinan rates the turbo upgrade at 450BHP.

The biggest advantage they have is holding more boost efficiently towards redline. I’m going to assume it’s correct until I see something else showing otherwise.

[harkes]

Originally Posted by oma3710

I honestly think they are wrong. I know the diy guy got 440whp with same setup and oem turbo. I would think I would be around 460-465

Stock car makes 250-260whp (x0.85 = 310crank). You are delusional if you think you can get 460(REAL - not unicorn)whp with a stage1 turbo

https://www.n54tech.com/forums/showp...71&postcount=3

[oma3710]

Originally Posted by harkes

Stock car makes 270-280whp (x0.85 = 330crank). You are delusional if you think you can get 460(REAL - not unicorn)whp with a stage1 turbo

Bmw diy guy OEM turbo got 440whp with fbo, xdi 35 and Cary Jordan tune. So your telling me that the Dinan turbo can't get 460whp?


BMW DIY Guy F32 435i build out thread https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1622618

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by oma3710

Bmw diy guy OEM turbo got 440whp with fbo, xdi 35 and Cary Jordan tune. So your telling me that the Dinan turbo can't get 460whp?

Yes, that’s a custom tune pushing the envelope.

[oma3710]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

Yes, that’s a custom tune pushing the envelope.

I am running a Cary Jordan custom tune as well with E85. He got those numbers on oem turbo and no E85.

[harkes]

Originally Posted by oma3710

Bmw diy guy OEM turbo got 440whp with fbo, xdi 35 and Cary Jordan tune. So your telling me that the Dinan turbo can't get 460whp?


BMW DIY Guy F32 435i build out thread https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1622618

What ever you chose to believe... Do a 62-124 / 60-130mph once finished then we will see what the car is REALLY making instead of these unicorn numbers. Mine did 7.3sec 62-124 with 495whp (DynoDynamics numbers) - also a 8AT @ 1550kg.

PS: That 495whp was achieved with Pure Stage2 maxed out on methanol.

My video from the dyno:

[oma3710]

Originally Posted by harkes

What ever you chose to believe... Do a 62-124 / 60-130mph once finished then we will see what the car is REALLY making instead of these unicorn numbers. Mine did 7.3sec 62-124 with 485whp (DynoDynamics numbers) - also a 8AT @ 1550kg.

Do you have ps2? I'm on my cell so I can't see sig.

[thejeremyman9]

Originally Posted by oma3710

Bmw diy guy OEM turbo got 440whp with fbo, xdi 35 and Cary Jordan tune. So your telling me that the Dinan turbo can't get 460whp?


BMW DIY Guy F32 435i build out thread https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1622618

The obsession with wanting XXX HP is so unnecessary, and so is the comparison of whp numbers from different cars on different dynos on different days etc etc. Who knows how the dyno from BMWDIYGUY was reading. Even if it was only 10% "high", that means he was only "really" making 400whp. Its not uncommon for there to be more than 10% difference between difference dynos (mustang, dynojet, etc), not to mention the fact that some people are running crazy CFs for the density altitude at the time (inflating actual numbers put down), potentially dynoing with the hood open (not representative of real conditions), and all the other confounding factors that can affect the number the dyno spits out. Plus, who cares what peak HP number the car is making if the powerband, power delivery, or driveability suck? Did you look at BMWDIYGUYs graph? That thing looked pretty awful. It was snaped like a "n". Area under the curve is what matters.

I'm not trying to be mean or bash on your build in any way I am just saying you will forever be disappointed if you just chase after some number. Use a better benchmark for your build - whether its acceleration numbers like harkes said, or wanting to beat your friends car, or getting a time at a dragstrip, or bettter yet just being fast enough for you to have fun. Measure your progress by comparison to where you were yesterday not where someone else is today. Or, forget everything i said, find a "high reading" dyno in your area, pay for a dyno session, and get a piece of paper that shows you made xxx HP so you can put in on your wall and show your friends.

Anyways, rant over, I am still interested to see where your custom tune goes. I hope it gets you where you want to be, and I am happy to put new logs in Virtual Dyno when your tune is dialed in so we can see how much better it (hopefully) is.

[oma3710]

Originally Posted by thejeremyman9

The obsession with wanting XXX HP is so unnecessary, and so is the comparison of whp numbers from different cars on different dynos on different days etc etc. Who knows how the dyno from BMWDIYGUY was reading. Even if it was only 10% "high", that means he was only "really" making 400whp. Its not uncommon for there to be more than 10% difference between difference dynos (mustang, dynojet, etc), not to mention the fact that some people are running crazy CFs for the density altitude at the time (inflating actual numbers put down), potentially dynoing with the hood open (not representative of real conditions), and all the other confounding factors that can affect the number the dyno spits out. Plus, who cares what peak HP number the car is making if the powerband, power delivery, or driveability suck? Did you look at BMWDIYGUYs graph? That thing looked pretty awful. It was snaped like a "n". Area under the curve is what matters.

I'm not trying to be mean or bash on your build in any way I am just saying you will forever be disappointed if you just chase after some number. Use a better benchmark for your build - whether its acceleration numbers like harkes said, or wanting to beat your friends car, or getting a time at a dragstrip, or bettter yet just being fast enough for you to have fun. Measure your progress by comparison to where you were yesterday not where someone else is today. Or, forget everything i said, find a "high reading" dyno in your area, pay for a dyno session, and get a piece of paper that shows you made xxx HP so you can put in on your wall and show your friends.

Anyways, rant over, I am still interested to see where your custom tune goes. I hope it gets you where you want to be, and I am happy to put new logs in Virtual Dyno when your tune is dialed in so we can see how much better it (hopefully) is.

Well said 👍🏼

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by thejeremyman9

The obsession with wanting XXX HP is so unnecessary, and so is the comparison of whp numbers from different cars on different dynos on different days etc etc. Who knows how the dyno from BMWDIYGUY was reading. Even if it was only 10% "high", that means he was only "really" making 400whp. Its not uncommon for there to be more than 10% difference between difference dynos (mustang, dynojet, etc), not to mention the fact that some people are running crazy CFs for the density altitude at the time (inflating actual numbers put down), potentially dynoing with the hood open (not representative of real conditions), and all the other confounding factors that can affect the number the dyno spits out. Plus, who cares what peak HP number the car is making if the powerband, power delivery, or driveability suck? Did you look at BMWDIYGUYs graph? That thing looked pretty awful. It was snaped like a "n". Area under the curve is what matters.

I'm not trying to be mean or bash on your build in any way I am just saying you will forever be disappointed if you just chase after some number. Use a better benchmark for your build - whether its acceleration numbers like harkes said, or wanting to beat your friends car, or getting a time at a dragstrip, or bettter yet just being fast enough for you to have fun. Measure your progress by comparison to where you were yesterday not where someone else is today. Or, forget everything i said, find a "high reading" dyno in your area, pay for a dyno session, and get a piece of paper that shows you made xxx HP so you can put in on your wall and show your friends.

Anyways, rant over, I am still interested to see where your custom tune goes. I hope it gets you where you want to be, and I am happy to put new logs in Virtual Dyno when your tune is dialed in so we can see how much better it (hopefully) is.

This - Love his build, but majority of the power is unusable and will likely disappear if the car is pushed to any kind of aggressive driving or track duty.

[harkes]

Originally Posted by oma3710

Do you have ps2? I'm on my cell so I can't see sig.

Yes, PS2

[oma3710]

New logs...


https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5ede...729b350d6aa24e


https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5ede...90c638fba0959f


https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5ede...90c63864a088dc

[AmuroRay]

Plug it into VD.

[oma3710]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

Plug it into VD.

I said f*** it to numbers. The car pulls a lot better than the oem turbo.

[thejeremyman9]

Originally Posted by oma3710

I said f*** it to numbers. The car pulls a lot better than the oem turbo.

Glad you finally decided to stop chasing numbers!

I will still put it into VD to see how it compares to the previous revision though, as that is informative and should indicate if the tune revisions are making more power.

[oma3710]

Originally Posted by thejeremyman9

Glad you finally decided to stop chasing numbers!

I will still put it into VD to see how it compares to the previous revision though, as that is informative and should indicate if the tune revisions are making more power.

Thanks bro!!! 😉

[thejeremyman9]

Originally Posted by oma3710

New logs...


https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5ede...729b350d6aa24e


https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5ede...90c638fba0959f


https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5ede...90c63864a088dc

Just took a quick look through the logs, specifically the 3rd one.

In all of them you have overboost from 3500-4500 or so, up to around 2psi, basically like BM3 OTS maps. Also, there is not throttle closure or other protective intervention during the overboost, also like BM3. It almost looks like this is intentional... i dont know why BM3 or tuners do this, probably because it "feels" fast when you get that massive torque shove at spool up, but for the sake of comparison a stock car and MHD-tuned car will not allow (nor intentionally) overboost beyond target like this, and if any overboost starts to occur, they feed in throttle closure to prevent it and get it under control. The other thing is that you MAP sensor looks to be maxed at 22.4psi - did you only put the 3.5bar MAP on the charge pipe? You are also dropping to 17.5 psi at redline and WGDC is int he mid 90s, so i dont think theres any way you are going to hold close to 20 psi to redline.

In the 1st and 3rd log you also have this weird behavior up top where boost target drops suddenly along with a throttle closure, WGDC and timing... no idea what that is. Its at like 6800 rpm.

Timing looks pretty good although Cyl 1 falls behind up top in 2 of the logs. If that's the front plug you could pull it and take a look/check gap. Its good though for ~100F IATs.

I wish your MAF sensor read above 41.4, still no idea why some people's max there and others dont.

[oma3710]

Originally Posted by thejeremyman9

Just took a quick look through the logs, specifically the 3rd one.

In all of them you have overboost from 3500-4500 or so, up to around 2psi, basically like BM3 OTS maps. Also, there is not throttle closure or other protective intervention during the overboost, also like BM3. It almost looks like this is intentional... i dont know why BM3 or tuners do this, probably because it "feels" fast when you get that massive torque shove at spool up, but for the sake of comparison a stock car and MHD-tuned car will not allow (nor intentionally) overboost beyond target like this, and if any overboost starts to occur, they feed in throttle closure to prevent it and get it under control. The other thing is that you MAP sensor looks to be maxed at 22.4psi - did you only put the 3.5bar MAP on the charge pipe? You are also dropping to 17.5 psi at redline and WGDC is int he mid 90s, so i dont think theres any way you are going to hold close to 20 psi to redline.

In the 1st and 3rd log you also have this weird behavior up top where boost target drops suddenly along with a throttle closure, WGDC and timing... no idea what that is. Its at like 6800 rpm.

Timing looks pretty good although Cyl 1 falls behind up top in 2 of the logs. If that's the front plug you could pull it and take a look/check gap. Its good though for ~100F IATs.

I wish your MAF sensor read above 41.4, still no idea why some people's max there and others dont.

Yes, I only put the 3.5 tmap on the charge pipe. Where else do I need to change it? Should I be worried with any of the things mentioned above?

[thejeremyman9]

Originally Posted by oma3710

Yes, I only put the 3.5 tmap on the charge pipe. Where else do I need to change it? Should I be worried with any of the things mentioned above?

You don't NEED to change it anywhere else if the tuner is working with it. But you are clearly maxing out the manifold pressure sensor, so i can only assume he is working off pre-throttle boost (where you have the 3.5bar). A related point is that pre-throttle boost and manifold boost are pretty consistently 2psi different throughout the pull, which is a little strange when the throttle is open 100%... dunno if that's a artifact of the 3.5bar, but i never really see that in any other logs.

I dont think you necessarily need to be worried about anything if the tuner thinks its fine... just be aware you are overboosting and nearly maxing out the turbo trying to reach boost targets. Not necessarily ideal for longevity.

[thejeremyman9]

FYI here is virtual dyno. Bottom 3 are the new logs. Doesnt show much. Are you logging on a bumpy road? The RPM in the logs is never smooth... for example you have spots where RPM decrease at the next logging interval compared to the previous one, which doesnt really make sense unless you a breaking traction (doesnt look like it since its just generally wavy) or hitting a bump. The RPM should really be a smooth continuously increasing curve if the road is smooth.

[oma3710]

Originally Posted by thejeremyman9

You don't NEED to change it anywhere else if the tuner is working with it. But you are clearly maxing out the manifold pressure sensor, so i can only assume he is working off pre-throttle boost (where you have the 3.5bar). A related point is that pre-throttle boost and manifold boost are pretty consistently 2psi different throughout the pull, which is a little strange when the throttle is open 100%... dunno if that's a artifact of the 3.5bar, but i never really see that in any other logs.

I dont think you necessarily need to be worried about anything if the tuner thinks its fine... just be aware you are overboosting and nearly maxing out the turbo trying to reach boost targets. Not necessarily ideal for longevity.

Can I replace the manifold pressure sensor? If so, which one do I need to change it too?