F30POST
F30POST
2012-2015 BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > Technical Forums > Suspension | Chassis | Brakes > Darn Thrust Arm / Control Arm Bushing - Replaced with Turner Monoball - Oh yesssss!
proTUNING Freaks
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      07-02-2019, 03:04 PM   #23
exE36M3
BMW CCA Member
exE36M3's Avatar
486
Rep
808
Posts

Drives: 2015 435i M Sport
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: NorCal

iTrader: (4)

BMW DIY Guy - I looked at the M3/M4 arms versus stock/Turner everything set-up, both are made of the aluminum stock, the geometry is different... but wasn't sure if there were any real gains overall for the extra $50-$75 more a side. Alignment, I haven't done mine yet as the car still tracks straight on the highway... but it's on my to-do list.

JaredG_F30 - agreed. I looked at just the monoball bushing option for what $200-ish less. But with 55k miles... I'm about 1/2-way through the ball joint life and I didn't have the resources or patience to get the bushing to be pressed in. So for $200 more... one less task to do and all parts are new.

Andino - woo hoo!
Appreciate 1
      07-07-2019, 02:57 PM   #24
e46m3to335i
Major
e46m3to335i's Avatar
United_States
172
Rep
1,375
Posts

Drives: 2015 F80 M3
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Fort Bragg, NC

iTrader: (26)

Nice thread with great info. So is it confirmed that only KMAC makes a version that fits the xDrive or will the TMS version work with xDrive as well?
Appreciate 0
      07-07-2019, 03:58 PM   #25
andino
Captain
480
Rep
681
Posts

Drives: F31 328i xdrive
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: norcal

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by e46m3to335i View Post
Nice thread with great info. So is it confirmed that only KMAC makes a version that fits the xDrive or will the TMS version work with xDrive as well?
According to their parts catalog, they make one for sdrive as well. Check out page 11 but I think the PN is 193916-5 J

https://k-mac.com/Catalogs/K-MAC%20S...%20Catalog.pdf
__________________
2016 328ix F31 - SOLD!
2006 997.1 C4S
Appreciate 0
      07-07-2019, 06:15 PM   #26
Eschmacher
Car Hypochondriac
Eschmacher's Avatar
United_States
331
Rep
899
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M-Sport Estoril Blue
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Sterling, VA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW 335i  [0.00]
So the M3 lower control arms that add camber also add caster, as do the monoballs. Will mixing the two be an issue? or should you pick one or the other?
__________________
Power mods: VRSF IC/Catted DP - FTP CP/BP - AFE Cat-back - BM3/XHP - Dorch S2
Handling mods: Koni yellow - Eibach prokit - Millway street - M Performance LSD - M3 brakes - EBC bluestuff
Exterior: Euro LCI tail lights - Shitty ECS CF spoiler - Chinese M performance diffuser
Interior: Bavsound stage 1 and subs - custom trunk sub by Mike1327
Appreciate 0
      07-10-2019, 12:44 PM   #27
quick_335i
Enlisted Member
14
Rep
46
Posts

Drives: 335i
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eschmacher View Post
So the M3 lower control arms that add camber also add caster, as do the monoballs. Will mixing the two be an issue? or should you pick one or the other?
I am wondering this as well?
__________________
2012 f30 n55 6 M/T, RWD
VRSF Catless DP/CP, CSF FMIC, BM3 Stage 2, KW V3
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2019, 05:44 AM   #28
Eschmacher
Car Hypochondriac
Eschmacher's Avatar
United_States
331
Rep
899
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M-Sport Estoril Blue
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Sterling, VA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW 335i  [0.00]
@andino

Earlier when you said you bought the kmac monoball bushings, did you mean the thrust arm bushings or LCA?
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2019, 10:32 AM   #29
andino
Captain
480
Rep
681
Posts

Drives: F31 328i xdrive
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: norcal

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eschmacher View Post
@andino

Earlier when you said you bought the kmac monoball bushings, did you mean the thrust arm bushings or LCA?
I purchased the monoball for the tension strut bushing which is the thrust arm iirc.
__________________
2016 328ix F31 - SOLD!
2006 997.1 C4S
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2019, 10:55 AM   #30
Eschmacher
Car Hypochondriac
Eschmacher's Avatar
United_States
331
Rep
899
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M-Sport Estoril Blue
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Sterling, VA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW 335i  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by andino View Post
I purchased the monoball for the tension strut bushing which is the thrust arm iirc.
Nice have you gotten it installed yet? Any feedback?

Looking to replace both my tension strut and LCA bushings with the kmac parts.
__________________
Power mods: VRSF IC/Catted DP - FTP CP/BP - AFE Cat-back - BM3/XHP - Dorch S2
Handling mods: Koni yellow - Eibach prokit - Millway street - M Performance LSD - M3 brakes - EBC bluestuff
Exterior: Euro LCI tail lights - Shitty ECS CF spoiler - Chinese M performance diffuser
Interior: Bavsound stage 1 and subs - custom trunk sub by Mike1327
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2019, 01:31 PM   #31
SlowF30
Private
United_States
9
Rep
47
Posts

Drives: Mineral Grey 335i
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Alexandria, Va

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eschmacher View Post
So the M3 lower control arms that add camber also add caster, as do the monoballs. Will mixing the two be an issue? or should you pick one or the other?
Quote:
Originally Posted by quick_335i View Post
I am wondering this as well?
I'm curious as well.

Would it be better to just go with M3 LCA and M3 Thrust ?

Can you mix and match M3 LCA and F30 Thrust with Mono Ball?

Is mono ball F30 LCA and Thrust the best option?

OR this is just too new of part so not enough people have tried ?
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2019, 05:10 PM   #32
CrushJelly
Private First Class
102
Rep
128
Posts

Drives: M140i
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Mine is a 140 but almost identical stock setup to the F30.

I ran F80 LCA by itself with stock tension strut/Thrust Arm/Upper Control Arm (UCA) for a while. No issues. Have since installed F80 UCA.

What you should do depends entirely on what you want.

1. Additional negative camber and track width at front? F80 LCA
2. Reduce the additional positive castor as a result of the F80 LCA? F80 UCA.
3. No additional negative camber or track width? Replace rubber bushes with mono balls for additional road feel.

Do NOT go polyurethane bushes for the LCA - they will eventually fail. Mine oval'd out after only a handful of KMs. SuperPro have pulled their LCA PU bushes off the shelves for this very reason.
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2019, 05:12 PM   #33
CrushJelly
Private First Class
102
Rep
128
Posts

Drives: M140i
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eschmacher View Post
Looking to replace both my tension strut and LCA bushings with the kmac parts.
I know another mate who has both castor adjustable and camber adjustable KMAC bushings for his LCA/UCA. He loves them, and their solid joint design means they won't fail like the polyurethane bushes.
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2019, 09:24 PM   #34
andino
Captain
480
Rep
681
Posts

Drives: F31 328i xdrive
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: norcal

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eschmacher View Post
Nice have you gotten it installed yet? Any feedback?

Looking to replace both my tension strut and LCA bushings with the kmac parts.
I haven't gotten them installed yet. Need to borrow a press large enough to replace them which I haven't had a change to yet.

I've driven a friend's car with them though and it feels great. His car is very similarly setup to mine so its easy to feel the difference.
__________________
2016 328ix F31 - SOLD!
2006 997.1 C4S
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2019, 10:17 PM   #35
Eschmacher
Car Hypochondriac
Eschmacher's Avatar
United_States
331
Rep
899
Posts

Drives: 2014 335i M-Sport Estoril Blue
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Sterling, VA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW 335i  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by andino View Post
I haven't gotten them installed yet. Need to borrow a press large enough to replace them which I haven't had a change to yet.

I've driven a friend's car with them though and it feels great. His car is very similarly setup to mine so its easy to feel the difference.
How is NVH? I'm willing to accept a little more as long as it's not too bad.
Appreciate 0
      08-02-2019, 02:55 AM   #36
andino
Captain
480
Rep
681
Posts

Drives: F31 328i xdrive
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: norcal

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eschmacher View Post
How is NVH? I'm willing to accept a little more as long as it's not too bad.
I don't find it bad but I'm also running camber plates on my daily driver. So my tolerance for nvh may be different from yours.
Appreciate 0
      08-04-2019, 05:17 AM   #37
thisismikeyb
Private First Class
thisismikeyb's Avatar
115
Rep
141
Posts

Drives: 2014 328i xDrive M-Sport EBII
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Anchorage

iTrader: (1)

How hard is it to press the stock bushings out and install the new ones? What tools did you use while swapping them out? Also what was your final alignment specs?

I'm looking at my last alignment chart from 5 years ago.... and it looks like I have -0.19/-0.43 camber up front with 7.20/6.54 degrees caster. It's all in German so making some assumptions.
__________________
2014 328i xDrive M-Sport EBII--M-Performance BBK/LSD/Aero--AA Signature Exhaust--Bilstein B6 DampTronic + Eibach Springs + H&R Swaybars + Millway Street Camber Plates + M3 Bump Stops + Dinan Shockware--Apex ARC-8 18x9.5et35+12mm Front Spacers w/Kumho Ecsta V730 275/35--FL-5/EC-7 18x8.5et35 w/Pilot Alpin PA4/Hakkapeliitta 10 Studded 245/45--BavSound Stage 1+Ghost Subs
Appreciate 0
      08-04-2019, 10:12 AM   #38
FaRKle!
Brigadier General
3995
Rep
3,530
Posts

Drives: 328d Wagon, M2 Comp, i4 eD35
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by thisismikeyb View Post
How hard is it to press the stock bushings out and install the new ones? What tools did you use while swapping them out? Also what was your final alignment specs?

I'm looking at my last alignment chart from 5 years ago.... and it looks like I have -0.19/-0.43 camber up front with 7.20/6.54 degrees caster. It's all in German so making some assumptions.
You definitely need a beefy press for the tension strut bushings. KMAC bushings come with pressing cups for removing the OE bushings and installing theirs. If you don't get KMAC though, you'll need to find the appropriate cups (I don't know where you'd do that though).

Autozone rents a tool (pic below) they say you can push bushings in/out, however it doesn't have enough room between the ends for our tension strut bushings, end supports, and pressing cups.


I've also tried a small bench-top arbor press, but that wasn't able to generate enough force to press the bushings out either.


So I ended up going to my friend's place since he has a Harbor Freight press and that did the job no problem.


I set my caster to about 8deg. Stock for me was about 6.5/7.
__________________
-328d Wagon Build Log (with helpful reference links)
-My YouTube Channel for some of the best DIYs and in depth information

Please don't PM me for suspension recommendations unless interested in paid private consultations.
Appreciate 1
      08-05-2019, 05:05 PM   #39
SoCalCarGuy
First Lieutenant
United_States
131
Rep
345
Posts

Drives: 2019 440ix cpe + 2018 x4 m40i
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: LA, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M4_GTS View Post
Someone needs to try this out on a xdrive car if it works.
I recently installed the KMAC camber bushings on my 440ix with h&r sport springs.

After dialing in -1.8 camber in the front. I took her for a spin. On my first WOT run, I popped a front axle (half shaft) out and broke a part on the outside of the transfer case in the process. Towed it back to the shop ($100).

$1500 in parts + labor to repair + replacing the bushings with new stock ones and realigning the car back to the -.7 the stock system produces.

KiesMotorsports also broke both of his axles with the m3/4 lower control arm (also searching for more negative camber) also with H&R lowering springs.

Some people (farkle) have had success on Eibachs with the bushings, but be careful if you're lowered. If you want a better handling setup, go RWD or make sure your tolerances for axle space is OK before driving. It can and will be an expensive error. NOT WORTH THE RISK, unless you're on eibachs (and even then, could be risky). Adding negative camber, pulls the axle too far from is seated position.
Appreciate 1
      08-10-2019, 12:57 AM   #40
M4_GTS
Lieutenant Colonel
Hong Kong
1153
Rep
1,523
Posts

Drives: M4 GTS
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Vancouver

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalCarGuy View Post
I recently installed the KMAC camber bushings on my 440ix with h&r sport springs.

After dialing in -1.8 camber in the front. I took her for a spin. On my first WOT run, I popped a front axle (half shaft) out and broke a part on the outside of the transfer case in the process. Towed it back to the shop ($100).

$1500 in parts + labor to repair + replacing the bushings with new stock ones and realigning the car back to the -.7 the stock system produces.

KiesMotorsports also broke both of his axles with the m3/4 lower control arm (also searching for more negative camber) also with H&R lowering springs.

Some people (farkle) have had success on Eibachs with the bushings, but be careful if you're lowered. If you want a better handling setup, go RWD or make sure your tolerances for axle space is OK before driving. It can and will be an expensive error. NOT WORTH THE RISK, unless you're on eibachs (and even then, could be risky). Adding negative camber, pulls the axle too far from is seated position.
I just went with the factory camber knuckles. No issues and I now have -1.1 camber on both sides. really happy with the outcome! Before the knuckles it was only -0.5.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by FMLYSDN View Post
You're a dick. Oops. Did I just say that?
Appreciate 0
      08-10-2019, 10:03 AM   #41
///M248
Private First Class
///M248's Avatar
United_States
42
Rep
107
Posts

Drives: 2014 F33 435i M Sport
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Royal Oak, MI

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalCarGuy View Post
I recently installed the KMAC camber bushings on my 440ix with h&r sport springs.

After dialing in -1.8 camber in the front. I took her for a spin. On my first WOT run, I popped a front axle (half shaft) out and broke a part on the outside of the transfer case in the process. Towed it back to the shop ($100).

$1500 in parts + labor to repair + replacing the bushings with new stock ones and realigning the car back to the -.7 the stock system produces.

KiesMotorsports also broke both of his axles with the m3/4 lower control arm (also searching for more negative camber) also with H&R lowering springs.

Some people (farkle) have had success on Eibachs with the bushings, but be careful if you're lowered. If you want a better handling setup, go RWD or make sure your tolerances for axle space is OK before driving. It can and will be an expensive error. NOT WORTH THE RISK, unless you're on eibachs (and even then, could be risky). Adding negative camber, pulls the axle too far from is seated position.
Wait what? M LCA or KMAC LCA bushings with lowered suspensions can damage axles?

My LCA’s are toast and I’m about to replace with M LCA or KMAC and I’m slammed on B14’s. Now I might wait
__________________
2014 F33 435i M Sport N55 EWG - MHD - Wagner HFC - VRSF 6" Race FMIC, CP & TIC - GFB DV+ - FuelIT Stage 3 525 - EOS PI - Turner Strut Brace - Bilstein B14 - M-LSD - Turner Aluminum Subframe Mounts - PowerFlex Adjustable LCA & TS Bushings - H&R Sway Bars - Dorch Stage 1 HPFP
Appreciate 0
      08-10-2019, 01:31 PM   #42
DSH7
Private First Class
34
Rep
142
Posts

Drives: F30 328i
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Pacific Northwest

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jahjaman View Post
Do NOT go polyurethane bushes for the LCA - they will eventually fail. Mine oval'd out after only a handful of KMs. SuperPro have pulled their LCA PU bushes off the shelves for this very reason.
Can you elaborate on how they fail? What do you mean by oval'd out? I've had Powerflex bushings in for 18 months with no issues whatsoever. Powerflex still has them on their site.
Appreciate 0
      08-10-2019, 05:21 PM   #43
CrushJelly
Private First Class
102
Rep
128
Posts

Drives: M140i
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSH7 View Post
Can you elaborate on how they fail? What do you mean by oval'd out? I've had Powerflex bushings in for 18 months with no issues whatsoever. Powerflex still has them on their site.
The arms articulate in a way so that it doesn't just go up and down, but also twists. The twisting articulation stresses the PU in a way it wasn't designed to, so where the eccentric bolt in the middle is circular, it ends up stretching the hole and "oval'ing" the bush out.

Simple test is putting the front wheels in the air and seeing whether you can jiggle the wheels where the lower control arm meets. If it moves even a tiny bit, it's toast.
Appreciate 0
      08-10-2019, 06:17 PM   #44
///M248
Private First Class
///M248's Avatar
United_States
42
Rep
107
Posts

Drives: 2014 F33 435i M Sport
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Royal Oak, MI

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jahjaman View Post
The arms articulate in a way so that it doesn't just go up and down, but also twists. The twisting articulation stresses the PU in a way it wasn't designed to, so where the eccentric bolt in the middle is circular, it ends up stretching the hole and "oval'ing" the bush out.

Simple test is putting the front wheels in the air and seeing whether you can jiggle the wheels where the lower control arm meets. If it moves even a tiny bit, it's toast.
This plus this caster issues with the M LCA makes me interested in trying the Poweflex push in LCA and Thust arm bushings...
__________________
2014 F33 435i M Sport N55 EWG - MHD - Wagner HFC - VRSF 6" Race FMIC, CP & TIC - GFB DV+ - FuelIT Stage 3 525 - EOS PI - Turner Strut Brace - Bilstein B14 - M-LSD - Turner Aluminum Subframe Mounts - PowerFlex Adjustable LCA & TS Bushings - H&R Sway Bars - Dorch Stage 1 HPFP
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:02 AM.




f30post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST