[JustChris]

Originally Posted by OneExtra

Given that driving in and out of Bristol at practically anytime of day is a complete nightmare something needs to be done to control the amount of traffic not just dirty traffic.

At rush hour Bristol is practically gridlocked

Also the majority of trains if not all going through Bristol Temple Meads station are diesel and extremely dirty.

Is it Deli where the solution is odd number plates are allowed in 1 day, even number plates another.

Folks make sure you have a car in each category ready for UK City Centres!

[Bryans69]

Originally Posted by OneExtra

Given that driving in and out of Bristol at practically anytime of day is a complete nightmare something needs to be done to control the amount of traffic not just dirty traffic.

At rush hour Bristol is practically gridlocked

Also the majority of trains if not all going through Bristol Temple Meads station are diesel and extremely dirty.

However, suggest on here that maybe some people could / should cycle around town, and you may as well suggest everyone offer their firstborn to the devil

[The0pportunist]

Perhaps we should do a massive cruise over to Bristol council and then rev the tits out of our petrol engines to demonstrate modern diesels are cleaner and quieter!

[thescouselander]

Bristolians don't like outsiders - they'd prefer you live in Clifton, Redland or Bedmo etc and walk in. They certainly would want anyone from places like South Gloucestershire arriving in their motor vehicles.

Luckily there isn't really any need to drive into Bristol as there are plenty of places near by with the same shops/facilities etc.

[Kal101]

Now here’s a thought for the councils

How’s about instead of creating congestion and traffic with totally inbred traffic “ calming” measures you spend half the time and effort in keeping the traffic moving and reduce the pollution from engines be they petrol or diesel just sitting there.

[TodmordenLad]

Originally Posted by Kal101

Now here's a thought for the councils

How's about instead of creating congestion and traffic with totally inbred traffic " calming" measures you spend half the time and effort in keeping the traffic moving and reduce the pollution from engines be they petrol or diesel just sitting there.

Far too sensible, mate - and doesn't generate any revenue for the council!?

[mikeoz]

Has got me thinking this as i was set on another diesel for my next car. I know there are a number of European cities that are also banning diesels by 20XX. I tend to do 4 or more road trips a year so its got me thinking about what i want to drive for the next 3 yrs or so/...M40d oe M40i....

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by mikeoz

Has got me thinking this as i was set on another diesel for my next car. I know there are a number of European cities that are also banning diesels by 20XX. I tend to do 4 or more road trips a year so its got me thinking about what i want to drive for the next 3 yrs or so/...M40d oe M40i....

330e is now quite a cracking package. 30 miles real world 'free' travel. If you have a few days of the week short journeys only consider this free fuel, most in the UK are filling up 'leccy' with about £1.20 for those 30 miles.

Overall on their longer commute trips they get 85mpg ish.

Doesn't actually need a home wallbox bu can have one for slightly faster charging (but if overnight why bother).

If base spec, can be head for under £40k too but ETTO with the specs.

[SuperHamz]

Originally Posted by JustChris

Is it Deli where the solution is odd number plates are allowed in 1 day, even number plates another.

Folks make sure you have a car in each category ready for UK City Centres!

Funny, was being told about yesterday by a colleague, in Dehli they have the odd/even registration category..

He was telling me that most working couples will have two cars and will ensure that one's registration ends with an odd number and the other with an even number.

Then those who are single and can afford it get a cheap second car with the opposite registration.

So the odd/even registration restriction doesn't help at all.

I think the annoyance from the public is that the hypocrisy from the Government/Council/Authorities (irrelevant of which party) who are not making the public transport systems "green", reliable AND affordable, but instead are then coming up with ill-thought out restrictions and/or penalties and not fixing the root cause.

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by SuperHamz

Funny, was being told about yesterday by a colleague, in Dehli they have the odd/even registration category..

He was telling me that most working couples will have two cars and will ensure that one's registration ends with an odd number and the other with an even number.

Then those who are single and can afford it get a cheap second car with the opposite registration.

So the odd/even registration restriction doesn't help at all.

I think the annoyance from the public is that the hypocrisy from the Government/Council/Authorities (irrelevant of which party) who are not making the public transport systems "green", reliable AND affordable, but instead are then coming up with ill-thought out restrictions and/or penalties and not fixing the root cause.

Haha.

I'm taking this one to the think tank in my head today.
How about a system similar to 'The Purge'? Once every year PHEV, EV and Petrol Drivers are allowed to wreak havoc on the Diesel owner community. Problem solved. I guess the GvT are doing a slightly more (less) humane version of this now.

[TodmordenLad]

Originally Posted by mikeoz

Has got me thinking this as i was set on another diesel for my next car. I know there are a number of European cities that are also banning diesels by 20XX. I tend to do 4 or more road trips a year so its got me thinking about what i want to drive for the next 3 yrs or so/...M40d oe M40i....

It's a tricky one, Mike
London has adopted a fairly reasonable approach in that the ULEZ prohibits any diesels which don't meet EU6. EU6 was introduced in Sept 2015 and the basic EU6 standard is positively lax if you compare it with the latest iteration of the standard, with many 'EU6 compliant' cars kicking out up to ten times - and more - what they claim to in real world tests.
Bristol's proposed policy is an outright ban, irrespective of the level of EU standard compliance of the diesel car you want to drive into the city.
This is ridiculous to my mind and is probably motivated by revenue as much as anything else, and that's the issue. The role of facts in local policy setting on emissions is going to vary tremendously.

Here's a fact. The latest EU6D-TEMP compliant diesels from MB and BMW are as clean if not cleaner in real world tests in terms of NOx and CO2 than their petrol counterparts.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-ne...o-new-research

The other issue is that that CO2 has been all but forgotten in the debate about clean air, which is solely focused on NOx - which admittedly some might see as a more pressing issue for cities but CO2 is the global issue.

[Wills2]

The 545e will be a good shout when it's released, 400hp 3.0l and 40 miles EV range.

[TodmordenLad]

Originally Posted by Wills2

The 545e will be a good shout when it's released, 400hp 3.0l and 40 miles EV range.

Yeh, very possibly although pricey and heavy though

[mikeoz]

Originally Posted by TodmordenLad

It's a tricky one, Mike
London has adopted a fairly reasonable approach in that the ULEZ prohibits any diesels which don't meet EU6. EU6 was introduced in Sept 2015 and the basic EU6 standard is positively lax if you compare it with the latest iteration of the standard, with many 'EU6 compliant' cars kicking out up to ten times - and more - what they claim to in real world tests.
Bristol's proposed policy is an outright ban, irrespective of the level of EU standard compliance of the diesel car you want to drive into the city.
This is ridiculous to my mind and is probably motivated by revenue as much as anything else, and that's the issue. The role of facts in local policy setting on emissions is going to vary tremendously.

Here's a fact. The latest EU6D-TEMP compliant diesels from MB and BMW are as clean if not cleaner in real world tests in terms of NOx and CO2 than their petrol counterparts.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-ne...o-new-research

The other issue is that that CO2 has been all but forgotten in the debate about clean air, which is solely focused on NOx - which admittedly some might see as a more pressing issue for cities but CO2 is the global issue.

Yes your right and the Co2 is what they are targeted on..i can see them coming back and hammering petrol again once the Co2 starts to rocket and they miss all the targets..again.

[Wills2]

I'm lucky in that I don't drive in rush hour but over the last few weeks I've been caught in it a couple of times and it's farking dreadful this is around the Leeds area truly dreadful....I couldn't do that everyday....

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by JustChris

I saw this too. Very interesting, it's a free hit for a council.

MORE MONEY!!!

but justified by the Eco reasoning (very valid if air quality is poor).

So Diesels will continue to plummet in appeal. Pretty certain this will be my last.

Bit late to this.

Diesels are just today's targets it'll be something else next.

It could even be electric cars.

We had friends to stay a few weeks ago and the guy is a watch manager at Paddington Fire Station. He tells me the fire brigade are frightened to death of how to deal with battery fires on electric cars. They just can't be put out. They can put it out completely and 2-5 days later it can set on fire again.

He says some cities in Europe are dropping them into skips full of sand, or completely submerging in water. None of which is very practical.

He says if and when electric cars become the norm in cities it will be a nightmare.

He gives a scenario where a multi storey goes up in flames because of an electric car, or something happens on Eurotunnel. What happens to the electric car if they're suddenly banned for safety reasons from certain places?

Maybe something that will never happen, but it could.

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

Bit late to this.

Diesels are just today's targets it'll be something else next.

It could even be electric cars.

We had friends to stay a few weeks ago and the guy is a watch manager at Paddington Fire Station. He tells me the fire brigade are frightened to death of how to deal with battery fires on electric cars. They just can't be put out. They can put it out completely and 2-5 days later if can set on fire again.

He says some cities in Europe are dropping them into skips full of sand, or completely submerging in water. None of which is very practical.

He says if and when electric cars become the norm in cities it will be a nightmare.

He gives a scenario where a multi storey goes up in flames because of an electric car, or something happens on Eurotunnel. What happens to the electric car if they're suddenly banned for safety reasons from certain places?

Maybe something that will never happen, but it could.

Home 'incidents' will be a bit of a problem too. People who cheap out with no wall box and try to load a standard domestic ring circuit with their car overnight while everyone is asleep. Could get nasty.

Worth paying for a type2 connector/cable and getting a pro in for a separately fused stand alone ring.

Different challenges are coming for sure.

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

Bit late to this.

Diesels are just today's targets it'll be something else next.

It could even be electric cars.

We had friends to stay a few weeks ago and the guy is a watch manager at Paddington Fire Station. He tells me the fire brigade are frightened to death of how to deal with battery fires on electric cars. They just can't be put out. They can put it out completely and 2-5 days later if can set on fire again.

He says some cities in Europe are dropping them into skips full of sand, or completely submerging in water. None of which is very practical.

He says if and when electric cars become the norm in cities it will be a nightmare.

He gives a scenario where a multi storey goes up in flames because of an electric car, or something happens on Eurotunnel. What happens to the electric car if they're suddenly banned for safety reasons from certain places?

Maybe something that will never happen, but it could.

I guess your fireman friend didn't do a GCSE in chemistry. Putting a lithium filled car with the batteries exposed in water is not a great plan!

Here is the lithium from a battery dropped in water (jump to 5:50)

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by JD6

I guess your fireman friend didn't do a GCSE in chemistry. Putting a lithium filled car with the batteries exposed in water is not a great plan!

Here is the lithium from a battery dropped in water (jump to 5:50)

He wasn't doing it, he said other cities in Europe were. He mentioned salt water, but not sure if that makes a difference.

It's also a bit of a distraction and not really the point. His point was they are difficult to deal with. He acknowledged that there may well be less fires with electric cars than with combustion engines. But at least with a normal car they know when it's out it's going to stay out. That's the worry they have.

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Ps. I did GCSE and A Level chemistry, we didn't drop lithium batteries into water once.

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Goneinsixtyseconds

Ps. I did GCSE and A Level chemistry, we didn't drop lithium batteries into water once.

If you didn’t know that lithium catches fire in water then you should hand back your certificates

[Goneinsixtyseconds]

Originally Posted by JD6

If you didn’t know that lithium catches fire in water then you should hand back your certificates

Actual advice for dealing with battery fires, but thanks for your nit picking.

"The electrolyte consists of lithium salt in an organic solvent (lithium hexafluorophosphate) and is highly flammable. Burning electrolyte can ignite combustible material in close proximity. ... If a Class D extinguisher is not available, douse a lithium-metal fire with water to prevent the fire from spreading."