[Sennen]

I managed to wangle an extended test drive in a manual M2 this weekend and I thought I would post my thoughts.

First off I would say that I tip my hat to BMW for still producing a performance car with a Manual box...... something Audi and Merc haven't done for years now...... if I am honest though that is basically where the praise ends.

The engine is certainly punchy but certainly not head and shoulders above my old M2 Comp Manual and if anything a little less soul less but that may be 'rose tinted glasses' playing its part there.

It feels a much larger car than the old M2 and 'MUCH' heavier which really detracts from what I associate with a good drivers car.

The interior is head and shoulders above the previous iteration but at the same time it feels a bit out of keeping with a small 'M' Car........ a bit too 'Merc Chintzy' if that makes sense.

I like the looks and if anything it gels better than the previous iteration but it really is a 'lump'.

I have been spoilt with the Alpine and the only real advantage I can see is the the M2 has 4 seats and is 'Manual'...... as a driving experience it falls way short.

Next on the list to test drive is a Manual Carrera T which I am sure will be head and shoulders above the new M2 but at 40k it should be!!!

To summarise the M2 in manual guise is an 'OK' car and I love the fact BMW still produce it but there is far better out there even if it is only available in 'Auto'.

[kzg1969]

I cant really contribute much to this, other than a recent test of a Carrera 2 was probably the best car i have driven (although the Targa version was a buffeting nightmare). I wouldn't say it was head and shoulders above the M3T (which is what i went with) but it was indeed better (even giving away 150hp-ish).

So, watching.....

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by kzg1969

I cant really contribute much to this, other than a recent test of a Carrera 2 was probably the best car i have driven (although the Targa version was a buffeting nightmare). I wouldn't say it was head and shoulders above the M3T (which is what i went with) but it was indeed better (even giving away 150hp-ish).

So, watching.....

I am hearing this more and more. It seems to be the general consensus that the standard (and cheapest) Carrera and T are the sweet spots in the range. My sons GTS is just too much for the road in my opinion..... he loves it though.

Love the M3T and with the exception of the 8 series it is the best looking car BMW produce

My next 'performance' car has to be manual and with a bit more room than the Alpine...... trips to Lakes & Cornwall with the GF are impossible with luggage so we have to use the UP.

I was hoping the M2 was going to be so much better than it was but to be frank it was quite disappointing...... I have high hopes for the Carrera T with a manual box and the rear seats optioned back in............ watch this space.

[335dX]

Leave this here for you to watch...

Having driven one of these it doesn't feel heavy at all, but if you drive a Caterham it would...

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by 335dX

Leave this here for you to watch...

Having driven one of these it doesn't feel heavy at all, but if you drive a Caterham it would...

Yes this review was what ultimately persuaded me to test drive the M2.

Chris Harris views have nearly always aligned with mine but I cannot get excited over the new M2 as much as he did.

EVO thought the handling was somewhat disjointed in the M2 which wasn't apparent to me unlike in the Supra I owned which was a real mess on the handling front, the weight was certainly apparent over the outgoing 'Comp' model though and wasnt nearly as 'sharp' as I was hoping.

https://www.evo.co.uk/bmw/m2/207002/...e-and-handling

The New M2 is certainly not a bad car but it could have been so much better. As long as we continue this trend of increasing each new models size and weight we are going to always have this problem I fear.

Yes in relation to a Caterham it is going to feel very lardy but I was comparing it more with my Alpine...... maybe not a fair comparison but the M2 always seems to be lumped up against the Cayman and Alpine in tests.

Great it exists though, especially in Manual form and maybe the upcoming 'Comp' (assuming there is one) will address its short comings

[boba-fett]

I've driven the new M2 in the auto variety, and I thought it was nice! Most BMW's drive heavy compared to other stuff, and thats fairly normal for this brand and the trend continues here. I think its a mix of weighted steering, heavy feel of controls and pedals, high dash, thick steering wheel and so on, although it will fit into place after owning for a while! I thought it was a nice car and a noticeably better M2 to drive than the two previous models.

I think its about the best M car available at present. I am just not so sold on the looks now! I thought it looked lush when it first came out and a bit of return to form, but the more I see them, I now think there is an old school box arch look to it and a front thats been designed with a set square! I'm not sure it will age well.

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

I've driven the new M2 in the auto variety, and I thought it was nice! Most BMW's drive heavy compared to other stuff, and thats fairly normal for this brand and the trend continues here. I think its a mix of weighted steering, heavy feel of controls and pedals, high dash, thick steering wheel and so on, although it will fit into place after owning for a while! I thought it was a nice car and a noticeably better M2 to drive than the two previous models.

I think its about the best M car available at present. I am just not so sold on the looks now! I thought it looked lush when it first came out and a bit of return to form, but the more I see them, I now think there is an old school box arch look to it and a front thats been designed with a set square! I'm not sure it will age well.

I think 'Nice' sums the new M2 up very well Bobba...... I really wanted it to be 'special' though and for me that just wasn't there.

I actually like the looks and in my humble opinion is an improvement over the old M2.

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by Sennen

I think 'Nice' sums the new M2 up very well Bobba...... I really wanted it to be 'special' though and for me that just wasn't there.

I actually like the looks and in my humble opinion is an improvement over the old M2.

Yes nice works well! special can come in many forms, I like my Mini GP better as an engaging drive believe it or not, but I don't like the image quite so much, that is of it being a kids car! Bit GT3 RS like with stickers and spoilers and to most just looks like a car you bought that came with a bag of sand Halfords voucher and trying to hard.

I thought the previous M2 Comp was a nice looking car, and still is today.

[Alscoob]

Not that I know much about M2's and never driven one and not up to speed on anything Porsche since getting rid of an bloody awful Cayenne some years ago, however in looking at 911's the only thing you can get in the back seat is the wifes handbag the space is fairly usless for proper seats and anyone of a moderate size, I would therefore have thought that the M2 in it's new shape and size would give more rear space than a 911 or a VW up! ... I may well be wrong and stand to be corrected having not driven or climbed in either.

Although the M2 may have its shortcomings, to compare it to a stripped out 911 at Circa £40k more ( they give you less and charge more!) is a little unfair is it not? one being a quick 4 seater saloon car the other a 2 seater sports car, okay they both have 2 doors, so rear access is a pain, but likely easier in an M2.

If you want to improve the M2 think Litchfield perhaps and have it in black, as said it hides the box front quite nicely. I'm sure you'll have likely seen this but Harry's review made me wish I had that money to spend

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by Alscoob

Not that I know much about M2's and never driven one and not up to speed on anything Porsche since getting rid of an bloody awful Cayenne some years ago, however in looking at 911's the only thing you can get in the back seat is the wifes handbag the space is fairly usless for proper seats and anyone of a moderate size, I would therefore have thought that the M2 in it's new shape and size would give more rear space than a 911 or a VW up! ... I may well be wrong and stand to be corrected having not driven or climbed in either.

Although the M2 may have its shortcomings, to compare it to a stripped out 911 at Circa £40k more ( they give you less and charge more!) is a little unfair is it not? one being a quick 4 seater saloon car the other a 2 seater sports car, okay they both have 2 doors, so rear access is a pain, but likely easier in an M2.

If you want to improve the M2 think Litchfield perhaps and have it in black, as said it hides the box front quite nicely. I'm sure you'll have likely seen this but Harry's review made me wish I had that money to spend

I certainly have no issue with the practicality or looks of the M2...... on that front it is a very well packaged product.

Totally agree cross shopping a Carrara T is not going to be something many people will be doing due to the price differential but my next 'performance' car needs to have both a manual gearbox and more luggage space than the Alpine...... there are not many options out there now unfortunately.

The GF and I are contemplating a 3 week jaunt around France and Italy in June next year and it would be nice to do it in something 'special'. Granted the 911 does not have acres of room and it would certainly not be practical for 4 people over any distance but it is certainly large enough for us with the suitable application of 'cargo bags'.

I could of course just 'nick' my sons GTS as my GF keeps hinting

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

Yes nice works well! special can come in many forms, I like my Mini GP better as an engaging drive believe it or not, but I don't like the image quite so much, that is of it being a kids car! Bit GT3 RS like with stickers and spoilers and to most just looks like a car you bought that came with a bag of sand Halfords voucher and trying to hard.

I thought the previous M2 Comp was a nice looking car, and still is today.

I hear good things about the Mini GP Bobba but like you I just associate Mini with young girls...... my niece adores the Cooper I bought her last year

[Sennen]

I hadn't realised Harry has reviewed a standard M2...... his comments basically mirror mine.

[Alscoob]

Originally Posted by Sennen

I hadn't realised Harry has reviewed a standard M2...... his comments basically mirror mine.

That's why I posted the Litchfield version

Now then if I were having a run around France & Italy for a few weeks then I suspect a Porsche would make it that much better & feel a little more special too. Whether it's worth buying a car just for that, while nice if you can, maybe a bit much, unless it's a car change irrespective of the 'tour' of course?

...And if the Alpine is going have to say a nice thing to do when you get a new car is to bugger off somewhere when you pick it up, kind of take the long way home. We've done this on many occasions, gives you the chance to really get to know it and to go to the EU would make it even better.

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Sennen

Yes in relation to a Caterham it is going to feel very lardy but I was comparing it more with my Alpine...... maybe not a fair comparison but the M2 always seems to be lumped up against the Cayman and Alpine in tests.

Great it exists though, especially in Manual form and maybe the upcoming 'Comp' (assuming there is one) will address its short comings

Very interesting to hear your views on the manual M2. I do wonder how much is about frame of reference - particularly if the car would feel as lardy to those of us who don’t usually drive lightweight machines.

I am tempted to try one, although no doubt I’d miss the luxury of the 8 on longer trips. Did you get as far as discussing discounts?

[isleaiw1]

Maybe the upcoming electric Alpine will be more his thing?

[Wills2]

I like the M2 I was thinking of getting one then sense prevailed on me as I was stepping off the lease/pcp train, the only issue for me is the S58 is dead below 2600rpm and I mean dead, I had the 510hp version in my X3M and it was annoying.

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by JD6

Very interesting to hear your views on the manual M2. I do wonder how much is about frame of reference - particularly if the car would feel as lardy to those of us who don’t usually drive lightweight machines.

I am tempted to try one, although no doubt I’d miss the luxury of the 8 on longer trips. Did you get as far as discussing discounts?

Yes coming from the Alpine is going to make most cars feel heavy JD6 but it doesnt get away from the fact the new M2 weighs exactly the same as my old 840i Coupe at 1805kg (BMWs figures) which is just ridiculous

If you want a performance manual car your options are limited at all price points but imo the 8 series is head and shoulders above the M2..... I really miss mine and keep getting that 'hankering'

No I didnt 'talk turkey' but from what I can work out there is plenty of 'dizzy' to be had

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by Wills2

I like the M2 I was thinking of getting one then sense prevailed on me as I was stepping off the lease/pcp train, the only issue for me is the S58 is dead below 2600rpm and I mean dead, I had the 510hp version in my X3M and it was annoying.

I thought the engine was plenty punchy enough but it did seem to lack a little character compared with the old M2 unit but that may be just the old 'rose tinted glasses' working their magic.

[Blacktemplar]

Originally Posted by JD6

Very interesting to hear your views on the manual M2. I do wonder how much is about frame of reference - particularly if the car would feel as lardy to those of us who don’t usually drive lightweight machines.

That's a very valid point - if your point of reference is a lightweight agile car like the Caterham or Alpine then of course the M2 is going to feel large and ponderous by comparison.

Coming from an X3 M40i I can say that it feels anything but. Yes, it has a chunky muscularity to it with the wide body & sill extensions, but from inside you don't feel the heft in the same way - though I would agree with Sennen that the corners of the car are hard to place until you get used to it.

It's interesting that both EVO and Harry felt it a bit 'numb/disconnected' but that was only a factor when pushing hard at 8/10ths plus - how many of us (a) ever get the opportunity to do that on our cramped & broken roads and (b) are capable of competently handling close to 500bhp through the rears? I know I'm not, and 7-8/10ths is the limit of my skillset, even with a clever M-Diff.....

As to the 'numb' steering I can't say that's something I've really noticed, certainly no better or worse than anything else I've driven recently. I'm sure the thick wheel doesn't help, but on the admittedly limited 'spirited drives' I've managed so far (only 850 miles in), both the chassis - which is fantastic as Chris Harris attests - and the steering have impressed.

Harry makes a good point - the S58 is best paired with the ZF auto - in 'efficient' mode it's a decent setup for wafting around town, setting the M1/M2 buttons to something progressively more aggressive means you have instant access to beast mode. Have to say I haven't noticed the grunt being lacking below 2600rpm, but still running it in and keeping broadly below 4500rpm. Maybe a different tune to the S58 in the X3M - I know low down torque compared unfavourably with the B58 in the M40i.

Unlike some lucky individuals on here, I'm not in a position to have the luxury of a more sensible daily driver (nor do I need one) so the M2 has to be a practical daily as well as a weekend hooligan. The boot is a decent size, it can carry two moderately-sized humans in the back and it's perfectly civilised around town. When its run in and the weather improves I'll assess its hooligan credentials on some country roads... in the end, this is effectively a slightly shorter, slightly detuned M4, and I think that's a good thing.

As I say, I'm an 'average Joe' driver so not in a position to wring the M2's neck or judge how fine a driver's tool it actually is, or isn't. I have a feeling Clarkson made this point somewhere along the line, that 99% of drivers who own performance cars will never be able to extract the full performance potential out of them.

In terms of the size & perceived lardiness of the M2, it also strikes me that there are a lot of sales in the US/Canada (just hop onto the G87 forum, you can hear the tumbleweed in the UK/EU section), and across the pond this is a small, lightweight "coop" so frame of reference is everything.

Mine is Black Sapphire Metallic, and as Alscoob says, it really hides the bulk and some of the slightly awkward angles around the grille. Have to say I really like the styling, though it benefits from a small sprinkling of CF bodykit additions (minus those hideous strakes & side winglet things)

At the end of the day, this isn't really directly competing with anything, as there's nothing else quite like it out there - perhaps with the exception of the Mustang. Merc & Audi are 4/5 door, Porsche & Alpine are 2 seaters, and manual options are limited across the board. Cost is also a factor, and to my mind the M2 scores well on the £/bhp/usability scale. I have no doubt that offerings from Porsche (or indeed the M3/M4/M8) are seen as more desirable but they also come with a much heftier price tag.

I absolutely get that the M2 isn't for everyone, and to an extent there are some compromises in there that possibly detract from it being a 'great' M Car - but to me it's pretty much spot on, and in the end that's all that really matters.

Just my 2p worth....

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by Blacktemplar

That's a very valid point - if your point of reference is a lightweight agile car like the Caterham or Alpine then of course the M2 is going to feel large and ponderous by comparison.

Coming from an X3 M40i I can say that it feels anything but. Yes, it has a chunky muscularity to it with the wide body & sill extensions, but from inside you don't feel the heft in the same way - though I would agree with Sennen that the corners of the car are hard to place until you get used to it.

It's interesting that both EVO and Harry felt it a bit 'numb/disconnected' but that was only a factor when pushing hard at 8/10ths plus - how many of us (a) ever get the opportunity to do that on our cramped & broken roads and (b) are capable of competently handling close to 500bhp through the rears? I know I'm not, and 7-8/10ths is the limit of my skillset, even with a clever M-Diff.....

As to the 'numb' steering I can't say that's something I've really noticed, certainly no better or worse than anything else I've driven recently. I'm sure the thick wheel doesn't help, but on the admittedly limited 'spirited drives' I've managed so far (only 850 miles in), both the chassis - which is fantastic as Chris Harris attests - and the steering have impressed.

Harry makes a good point - the S58 is best paired with the ZF auto - in 'efficient' mode it's a decent setup for wafting around town, setting the M1/M2 buttons to something progressively more aggressive means you have instant access to beast mode. Have to say I haven't noticed the grunt being lacking below 2600rpm, but still running it in and keeping broadly below 4500rpm. Maybe a different tune to the S58 in the X3M - I know low down torque compared unfavourably with the B58 in the M40i.

Unlike some lucky individuals on here, I'm not in a position to have the luxury of a more sensible daily driver (nor do I need one) so the M2 has to be a practical daily as well as a weekend hooligan. The boot is a decent size, it can carry two moderately-sized humans in the back and it's perfectly civilised around town. When its run in and the weather improves I'll assess its hooligan credentials on some country roads... in the end, this is effectively a slightly shorter, slightly detuned M4, and I think that's a good thing.

As I say, I'm an 'average Joe' driver so not in a position to wring the M2's neck or judge how fine a driver's tool it actually is, or isn't. I have a feeling Clarkson made this point somewhere along the line, that 99% of drivers who own performance cars will never be able to extract the full performance potential out of them.

In terms of the size & perceived lardiness of the M2, it also strikes me that there are a lot of sales in the US/Canada (just hop onto the G87 forum, you can hear the tumbleweed in the UK/EU section), and across the pond this is a small, lightweight "coop" so frame of reference is everything.

Mine is Black Sapphire Metallic, and as Alscoob says, it really hides the bulk and some of the slightly awkward angles around the grille. Have to say I really like the styling, though it benefits from a small sprinkling of CF bodykit additions (minus those hideous strakes & side winglet things)

At the end of the day, this isn't really directly competing with anything, as there's nothing else quite like it out there - perhaps with the exception of the Mustang. Merc & Audi are 4/5 door, Porsche & Alpine are 2 seaters, and manual options are limited across the board. Cost is also a factor, and to my mind the M2 scores well on the £/bhp/usability scale. I have no doubt that offerings from Porsche (or indeed the M3/M4/M8) are seen as more desirable but they also come with a much heftier price tag.

I absolutely get that the M2 isn't for everyone, and to an extent there are some compromises in there that possibly detract from it being a 'great' M Car - but to me it's pretty much spot on, and in the end that's all that really matters.

Just my 2p worth....

Yes very fair points..... pound for pound it is good value and its great BMW have the minerals ro produce it

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Sennen

Yes coming from the Alpine is going to make most cars feel heavy JD6 but it doesnt get away from the fact the new M2 weighs exactly the same as my old 840i Coupe at 1805kg (BMWs figures) which is just ridiculous

If you want a performance manual car your options are limited at all price points but imo the 8 series is head and shoulders above the M2..... I really miss mine and keep getting that 'hankering'

No I didnt 'talk turkey' but from what I can work out there is plenty of 'dizzy' to be had

The M2 is surprisingly heavy. The 8 is a bit of an outlier these days - they made a serious effort to keep the weight down with lightweight panels in aluminium and carbon reinforced plastic, together with carbon fibre in the chassis.

There’s no good logic behind moving from an 840i to an M2, expect the feeling that decent manual cars are on the way out. The two cars I regret selling more than any others are my mk2 Golf GTi and my E39 M5. The M2 would no doubt be worse than the 8 in many respects, but it might just scratch an itch…

I’ll be interested to hear how you find the Carrera T - it sounds special, but well outside my budget.

Not sure what it is about December, but I always seem to get an urge to buy cars at this time of year. Dec 23 I bought the Mini, Dec 22 the 840i and Dec 20 the previous 840i. Perhaps it’s the short days meaning less chance to get out on the fells and longer evenings to browse car sites!

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Blacktemplar

Unlike some lucky individuals on here, I'm not in a position to have the luxury of a more sensible daily driver (nor do I need one) so the M2 has to be a practical daily as well as a weekend hooligan. The boot is a decent size, it can carry two moderately-sized humans in the back and it's perfectly civilised around town. When its run in and the weather improves I'll assess its hooligan credentials on some country roads... in the end, this is effectively a slightly shorter, slightly detuned M4, and I think that's a good thing.

Have you done any motorway runs in the M2 yet? This would have to be my distance cruiser as well as a toy, so I’d be interested to know how it feels on a run - comfort / noise / exhaust drone…