is he in the right or wrong

KRS_SN · 05-13-2021, 11:36 AM

He paid for a feature he used the feature the car let him do it.
https://news.sky.com/story/tesla-own...pilot-12304968

winther1 · 05-13-2021, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KRS_SN

He paid for a feature he used the feature the car let him do it.
https://news.sky.com/story/tesla-own...pilot-12304968

This technology is still in its early stages and accidents have happened. Has Tesla really invited owners to get comfortable on the backseat while the technology does the rest?
In any case, I hate the view that the future of motoring means autonomous cars - that somehow driving a vehicle is a chore that must be removed.

isleaiw1 · 05-13-2021, 02:01 PM

I am sure one of the Tesla owners will be along later but as far as I am aware the guidance with the car is never to take your attention away from driving and always be in control.

So he is in the wrong. And pretty stupid.

CajunBMW · 05-13-2021, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

I am sure one of the Tesla owners will be along later but as far as I am aware the guidance with the car is never to take your attention away from driving and always be in control.

So he is in the wrong. And pretty stupid.

+1

DaveA · 05-13-2021, 02:19 PM

How could you ever demonstrate that you were in control of the vehicle when doing this...?

If the reporting is to be believed, seems he knew that he was likely in trouble because it is reported he moved from the back into the drivers seat...

auburnf30x · 05-13-2021, 02:23 PM

I don't know enough about the Tesla autopilot to make any useful comments. But I do find it strange that they didn't design some way to disable it if no one is in the driver's seat. Some form of weight sensor, etc. Regardless of how well the technology works/doesn't work, I don't see any way possible it can predict or react to the rest of the humans out there on the road making questionable and sometimes dangerous decisions behind the wheel. Someone needs to have their hand on the controls, IMO. Thinking any other way scares the hell out of me, to be honest.

I, too, lament the advent of autonomous cars. I don't care how long or how boring the trip, I enjoy the drive. I only surrender the driver's seat if I am physically not capable of driving.

JR1664 · 05-13-2021, 03:33 PM

If he wanted a back seat driver I'm sure one of my daughters would have volunteered.

sahajesh · 05-13-2021, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR1664

If he wanted a back seat driver I'm sure one of my daughters would have volunteered.

Not funny Dad

gangzoom · 05-13-2021, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by auburnf30x

I don't know enough about the Tesla autopilot to make any useful comments. But I do find it strange that they didn't design some way to disable it if no one is in the driver's seat.

You cannot activate AP without the driver been in the drivers seat, and every 10-20 seconds the car 'checks' the steering is been held by the driver via a torque sensor. If system doesn't detect a driver in the drivers seat it will disable immediately and bring the car to a stop, if there is no torque measured at the steering wheel visual and audio alarms sound before the system disengages and stops the car.

auburnf30x · 05-13-2021, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gangzoom

You cannot activate AP without the driver been in the drivers seat, and every 10-20 seconds the car 'checks' the steering is been held by the driver via a torque sensor. If system doesn't detect a driver in the drivers seat it will disable immediately and bring the car to a stop, if there is no torque measured at the steering wheel visual and audio alarms sound before the system disengages and stops the car.

Makes sense. I guess that’s why the guy’s foot is on the wheel in the photos.

Which makes even less sense...that seems like an extremely uncomfortable position to hold.

garyfried · 05-13-2021, 06:31 PM

You can't fix stupid !

Paddy1975 · 05-14-2021, 03:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garyfried

You can't fix stupid !

No but can pay extra and become it !!!!!

stefan4 · 05-14-2021, 03:57 AM

He's definitely in the wrong, but this is the problem with driving assistance, people become lazy or get distracted. IMO you should either be FULLY IN CONTROL or the system should be FULLY AUTONOMOUS, the middle ground is where you get these kind of incidents and reckless acts.

Ridg · 05-14-2021, 04:48 AM

100% in the wrong but given the American legal system, he's probably got a case for suing Tesla as it should have either prevented him from doing it or had a warning.

stefan4 · 05-14-2021, 05:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ridg

100% in the wrong but given the American legal system, he's probably got a case for suing Tesla as it should have either prevented him from doing it or had a warning.

It would be the easiest thing in the world to add a weight sensor in the driver seat. So if your not sat in the drivers seat, the system does not operate the vehicle.

gangzoom · 05-14-2021, 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stefan4

It would be the easiest thing in the world to add a weight sensor in the driver seat. So if your not sat in the drivers seat, the system does not operate the vehicle.

I feel like maybe people here don't read things...….or maybe its just the internet as a whole

.

stefan4 · 05-14-2021, 06:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gangzoom

Quote:

Originally Posted by stefan4

It would be the easiest thing in the world to add a weight sensor in the driver seat. So if your not sat in the drivers seat, the system does not operate the vehicle.

I feel like maybe people here don't read things...….or maybe its just the internet as a whole

.

Fair cop

I missed your post. PLEASE DONT SHOOT ME!!! 🤣🤣🤣

Wills2 · 05-14-2021, 09:54 AM

The "driver" is clearly not all there and needs to have his licence removed.

Pentland · 05-14-2021, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KRS_SN

He paid for a feature he used the feature the car let him do it.
https://news.sky.com/story/tesla-own...pilot-12304968

Clearly wrong. I paid for a car that can do 155mph, the car let me do 155mph….we can see where this is going. However, American laws are well, sometime a law unto themselves.

KRS_SN · 05-14-2021, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pentland

Quote:

Originally Posted by KRS_SN

He paid for a feature he used the feature the car let him do it.
https://news.sky.com/story/tesla-own...pilot-12304968

Clearly wrong. I paid for a car that can do 155mph, the car let me do 155mph….we can see where this is going. However, American laws are well, sometime a law unto themselves.

that is a great point. Just because you can do it doesn't mean you should do it.

gangzoom · 05-15-2021, 01:18 AM

I just did the first long drive in about 6 months in our X with the latest Autopilot software. I have to say it really has made progress, the software handled 90% of lane changes, and though I chickened out of letting it negotiate the M4/5/6 mergers it probably would have been fine.

There is no replacement for stupidity demonstrated by the poster, but without the 'checks' Tesla already put in place more idiots would be doing the same thing.

The software is pretty much there 95% of the time on M ways, but ofcourse when you are driving you need it to work 100% of the time. Getting that last 5% right is the hardest.

Incidentally it was funny to observe the impact of 'smart motorway' cameras on speed. I set the speed limit at the legal limit at 70mph, 80%+ of cars were doing over that comfortably on the M69 with zero cameras with a few doing clearly licence losing speed, but on the M4/M5/M6 I was overtaking in lane 3 at 70mph. Anyways that was about the most interesting part of a 2hr 30min drive touring the Midlands M roads.........Cannot even fit a pedal bike ride in this weekend

.

HighlandPete · 05-15-2021, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gangzoom

The software is pretty much there 95% of the time on M ways, but of course when you are driving you need it to work 100% of the time. Getting that last 5% right is the hardest.

Sure is the hardest.

Having spent most of my career in R&D and product design, the old adage goes along the lines of... It takes 5% of the time to achieve 95%, but 95% of the time to achieve the final 5%.

IMO, it will never be 100%. I suppose the risk analysis will weigh up whether autonomous driving is statistically safer, compared with human control.

05-13-2021, 11:36 AM	#1
KRS_SN Major General 13514 Rep 5,203 Posts Drives: IX,G07 Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: Glasgow iTrader: (0) Garage List 2020 X7 [10.00] X5 [8.50] IX [8.00]	is he in the right or wrong He paid for a feature he used the feature the car let him do it. https://news.sky.com/story/tesla-own...pilot-12304968
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05-13-2021, 02:01 PM	#3
isleaiw1 Lieutenant General 8764 Rep 12,243 Posts Drives: iPace / Mini Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: UK iTrader: (0)	I am sure one of the Tesla owners will be along later but as far as I am aware the guidance with the car is never to take your attention away from driving and always be in control. So he is in the wrong. And pretty stupid.
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05-13-2021, 02:19 PM	#5
DaveA Brigadier General 1874 Rep 3,432 Posts Drives: BMW M135i xDrive Join Date: May 2013 Location: Teesside iTrader: (0)	How could you ever demonstrate that you were in control of the vehicle when doing this...? If the reporting is to be believed, seems he knew that he was likely in trouble because it is reported he moved from the back into the drivers seat... __________________ CAR HISTORY - Golf GTI 245 - F30 340i M Sport - F30 330d M Sport MPPK - F30 320d Sport - 997 Gen2 GT3 - 987 Cayman S - 986 Boxster S - Ibiza Cupra - Polo 16v - E30 M3 (Official GB import) - Integra 16v - Mk2 Polo S - Mk1 Golf C
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05-13-2021, 02:23 PM	#6
auburnf30x Lieutenant 435 Rep 562 Posts Drives: 2017 BMW 330i xDrive Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: Auburn, AL iTrader: (0) Garage List 2017 BMW 330i xDrive [8.50]	I don't know enough about the Tesla autopilot to make any useful comments. But I do find it strange that they didn't design some way to disable it if no one is in the driver's seat. Some form of weight sensor, etc. Regardless of how well the technology works/doesn't work, I don't see any way possible it can predict or react to the rest of the humans out there on the road making questionable and sometimes dangerous decisions behind the wheel. Someone needs to have their hand on the controls, IMO. Thinking any other way scares the hell out of me, to be honest. I, too, lament the advent of autonomous cars. I don't care how long or how boring the trip, I enjoy the drive. I only surrender the driver's seat if I am physically not capable of driving. __________________ 2017 330i xDrive Imperial Blue Exterior / Venetian Beige Leather with Oyster Accent Interior / Anthracite Wood Trim
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05-13-2021, 03:33 PM	#7
JR1664 Major 1147 Rep 1,263 Posts Drives: F30 340i Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: UK iTrader: (0)	If he wanted a back seat driver I'm sure one of my daughters would have volunteered.
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05-13-2021, 06:31 PM	#11
garyfried Private 286 Rep 97 Posts Drives: BMW 435ix Join Date: Dec 2020 Location: Alberta, iTrader: (0)	You can't fix stupid !
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05-14-2021, 03:57 AM	#13
stefan4 Colonel 1084 Rep 2,376 Posts Drives: 340i on order Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: sheffield iTrader: (0)	He's definitely in the wrong, but this is the problem with driving assistance, people become lazy or get distracted. IMO you should either be FULLY IN CONTROL or the system should be FULLY AUTONOMOUS, the middle ground is where you get these kind of incidents and reckless acts. __________________ Current - X3m Comp Gone but not forgotten - F80 m3 Comp, F30 340i, F30 - 320i
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05-14-2021, 04:48 AM	#14
Ridg Lieutenant 205 Rep 404 Posts Drives: F31 330d Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: Kent iTrader: (0)	100% in the wrong but given the American legal system, he's probably got a case for suing Tesla as it should have either prevented him from doing it or had a warning.
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05-14-2021, 09:54 AM	#18
Wills2 Barge driver 8656 Rep 12,425 Posts Drives: 730d Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: UK iTrader: (0)	The "driver" is clearly not all there and needs to have his licence removed. __________________ 730d/Z4C
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05-15-2021, 01:18 AM	#21
gangzoom Brigadier General 1685 Rep 3,285 Posts Drives: E90 335i M sport Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Leicester iTrader: (1)	I just did the first long drive in about 6 months in our X with the latest Autopilot software. I have to say it really has made progress, the software handled 90% of lane changes, and though I chickened out of letting it negotiate the M4/5/6 mergers it probably would have been fine. There is no replacement for stupidity demonstrated by the poster, but without the 'checks' Tesla already put in place more idiots would be doing the same thing. The software is pretty much there 95% of the time on M ways, but ofcourse when you are driving you need it to work 100% of the time. Getting that last 5% right is the hardest. Incidentally it was funny to observe the impact of 'smart motorway' cameras on speed. I set the speed limit at the legal limit at 70mph, 80%+ of cars were doing over that comfortably on the M69 with zero cameras with a few doing clearly licence losing speed, but on the M4/M5/M6 I was overtaking in lane 3 at 70mph. Anyways that was about the most interesting part of a 2hr 30min drive touring the Midlands M roads.........Cannot even fit a pedal bike ride in this weekend .
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