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      07-09-2017, 09:02 AM   #1
D's Bimmer
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Will Flash tune ever come for B58?

Having just recently come from the world of MHD, I am not likely to jump on a piggyback tune at the moment. I have done a little reading but wanted to know what others think in terms of whether a true DME customizable tune will ever likely happen for the B58? I hope so as I think this engine has great potential. I am not looking for 500+ numbers. Just a customizable DME based tune for a spirited daily driver.

Fingers crossed that in the next 6-12 months MHD or some other shop will make this happen.
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      07-09-2017, 09:16 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D's Bimmer View Post
Having just recently come from the world of MHD, I am not likely to jump on a piggyback tune at the moment. I have done a little reading but wanted to know what others think in terms of whether a true DME customizable tune will ever likely happen for the B58? I hope so as I think this engine has great potential. I am not looking for 500+ numbers. Just a customizable DME based tune for a spirited daily driver.

Fingers crossed that in the next 6-12 months MHD or some other shop will make this happen.
I'm pretty sure it will happen if it hasn't already. Since piggy back tunes exist there should be a custom DME tune available to the generable public that are in development which tuning shops will soon start offering.
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      07-09-2017, 10:09 AM   #3
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Don't think it's going to happen anytime soon. This dme is on a whole new level. We cracked mine open and id it. I'm working with someone on a solution but it's not looking good at the moment honestly.

Also I spoke to mhd and he said that he will make a map once some one cracks the dme.

Last edited by Roki187; 07-09-2017 at 02:34 PM.
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      07-09-2017, 04:40 PM   #4
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a lot of different parties are working on it, it's just a matter of time
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      07-09-2017, 05:36 PM   #5
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I still think our best bet is to pool our money and bribe someone at BMW.
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      07-10-2017, 12:20 AM   #6
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It's going to take a while to get into the 340 DME unfortunately. It took a while for the N55 F3X platform to be cracked. It it will be done. Not sure when.
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      07-10-2017, 12:22 AM   #7
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Didn't they just crack the N55 DME? 5 years lol
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      07-10-2017, 09:09 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by E90 LCI View Post
Didn't they just crack the N55 DME? 5 years lol
Yes, and not even fully yet. And the b58 dme is a 3 core. This will take some time. I wouldn't hold my breath.
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      07-10-2017, 09:58 AM   #9
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LOL... these "when will the DME get cracked" are just funny at this point.

Seriously... If over 450 bph at the wheels (Tune, WMI, Turbo, etc.) isnt enough power (which by the way your already approaching the limits of many components of the car) then this isnt the platform for you.
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      07-10-2017, 10:02 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riskmaker76 View Post
LOL... these "when will the DME get cracked" are just funny at this point.

Seriously... If over 450 bph at the wheels (Tune, WMI, Turbo, etc.) isnt enough power (which by the way your already approaching the limits of many components of the car) then this isnt the platform for you.
True lol. There are those that will say that a DME tune done by a tuning shop is customized for your specific vehicle and won't result in CELs or drivetrain malfunctions as much and want a more reliable car that the tuning shop stands behind should there be problems vs piggy back tune, which may cause problems on some cars.
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      07-10-2017, 10:38 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riskmaker76 View Post
LOL... these "when will the DME get cracked" are just funny at this point.

Seriously... If over 450 bph at the wheels (Tune, WMI, Turbo, etc.) isnt enough power (which by the way your already approaching the limits of many components of the car) then this isnt the platform for you.
Then what do you say to all of the 500+whp Pure Turbo N55 & N54 guys?
The b58 also seems so have more potential with the results we have seen (and still no ethanol results). And having the ability to have that much more control over the DME doesnt just benefit power... What if you prefer the b58 platform over the S55? It sure does come a hell of a lot chaper and sound way better...
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      07-10-2017, 11:46 AM   #12
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I guess knowing it took more than 5 years to get it on the N55... Knowing you can get more than 500 + hp now with WMI and a New Turbo... Knowing these cars just were not meant for that much HP (even though they can produce it) AND have such little data on reliability, etc. etc.

And the question has been asked about gazillion times over the past year..

Just seems silly to ask for it at this point...


Quote:
Originally Posted by jalkster View Post
Then what do you say to all of the 500+whp Pure Turbo N55 & N54 guys?
The b58 also seems so have more potential with the results we have seen (and still no ethanol results). And having the ability to have that much more control over the DME doesnt just benefit power... What if you prefer the b58 platform over the S55? It sure does come a hell of a lot chaper and sound way better...
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      07-10-2017, 12:01 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riskmaker76 View Post
I guess knowing it took more than 5 years to get it on the N55... Knowing you can get more than 500 + hp now with WMI and a New Turbo... Knowing these cars just were not meant for that much HP (even though they can produce it) AND have such little data on reliability, etc. etc.

And the question has been asked about gazillion times over the past year..

Just seems silly to ask for it at this point...
Yes, the questions are quite repetitive. Its not like when there is a flashable alternative nobody will speak of it, itll be everywhere, along with other companies coming out with maps due to the unlock. But, I mean to each his own. if I were to build a straight line performance car and I wanted to use a turbo BMW, the b58 is a great option imo. Yes its still early in development and we havent seen long term reliability but its proven to be strong and efficient so far. Seems slightly silly to call others in the wrong for using a 3 series to make power. the big single turbo n54 cars are some of the OG sleepers.
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      07-10-2017, 01:56 PM   #14
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not silly to use the B58 for straight line power... Silly to ask a question when the answer is obvious...

the last JB4 update IMO finally added some drivability.. Reliable WMI for the platform is not much more than 6 months old... And add on turbo is still in relative beta...

I surely would not compare this B58 to the N54 motor

I dont think all this would constitute enormous amounts of data..

but like you said, to each is own... I feel silly and guess stating the obvious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jalkster View Post
Yes, the questions are quite repetitive. Its not like when there is a flashable alternative nobody will speak of it, itll be everywhere, along with other companies coming out with maps due to the unlock. But, I mean to each his own. if I were to build a straight line performance car and I wanted to use a turbo BMW, the b58 is a great option imo. Yes its still early in development and we havent seen long term reliability but its proven to be strong and efficient so far. Seems slightly silly to call others in the wrong for using a 3 series to make power. the big single turbo n54 cars are some of the OG sleepers.
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      07-10-2017, 02:12 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riskmaker76 View Post
not silly to use the B58 for straight line power... Silly to ask a question when the answer is obvious...

the last JB4 update IMO finally added some drivability.. Reliable WMI for the platform is not much more than 6 months old... And add on turbo is still in relative beta...

I surely would not compare this B58 to the N54 motor

I dont think all this would constitute enormous amounts of data..

but like you said, to each is own... I feel silly and guess stating the obvious.
Good to hear that. May finally opt for the jb4, Ive been hesistant due to the high rpm throttle cuts and such so its good to hear its running smooth now. but only reason I compared the n54 to the b58 is because you said the car would be nearing the limits of certain components and both can be found in 3 series yada yada.

Do you have a dp? I remember there being talk about cars with a dp running differently.
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      07-10-2017, 03:55 PM   #16
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Even though Hex8 is getting a bad rap for this whole removing auto clear on the codes... IMO its the smoothest release yet...

I do not have a down pipe however, for those with downpipes if you get the EWG wires you can change FUA to reduce duty cycle of the waste gate - that will lower the amount of throttle closures..

All in all JB4 has MUCH improved since last year IMO..

Limits of the drive train not the motor.... - especially if you're running a manual.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jalkster View Post
Good to hear that. May finally opt for the jb4, Ive been hesistant due to the high rpm throttle cuts and such so its good to hear its running smooth now. but only reason I compared the n54 to the b58 is because you said the car would be nearing the limits of certain components and both can be found in 3 series yada yada.

Do you have a dp? I remember there being talk about cars with a dp running differently.
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      07-10-2017, 06:18 PM   #17
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Encryption and signed code is good business for BMW and FCA (the manfactures that I have noted as using it). It keeps casual users from doing a flash tune as currently it requires you to open your ECU and alter the bootloader. It protect the product from tampering and allows them greater control over their CPO products which is just another revenue stream for their dealers.

EDIT: I forgot it also lets them sell you the MPPSK flash at pure profit.
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      07-10-2017, 06:28 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zinner View Post
Encryption and signed code is good business for BMW and FCA (the manfactures that I have noted as using it). It keeps casual users from doing a flash tune as currently it requires you to open your ECU and alter the bootloader. It protect the product from tampering and allows them greater control over their CPO products which is just another revenue stream for their dealers.

EDIT: I forgot it also lets them sell you the MPPSK flash at pure profit.
Some were talking about third party shops installing MPPSK, some vendors on here saying they could do it. How is this possible without access to the DME? Unless they are certified by BMW indy shops and can do warranty work. I have seen youtube channels of folks who have independent shops that do warranty work, but haven't seen if this is the case for BMW.
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      07-10-2017, 06:38 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmer456 View Post
Some were talking about third party shops installing MPPSK, some vendors on here saying they could do it. How is this possible without access to the DME? Unless they are certified by BMW indy shops and can do warranty work. I have seen youtube channels of folks who have independent shops that do warranty work, but haven't seen if this is the case for BMW.

What you are mentioning is more of a business issue than a technical issue. Public key encryption allows BMW to sign a calibration file, the DME verifies that signature and runs the calibration. The file is no longer secret and their IP is protected because you can't run that file on another car.

As for 3rd parting working on the cars, that is a right to repair debate which is pretty hot at the moment.
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      07-11-2017, 02:41 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riskmaker76 View Post
LOL... these "when will the DME get cracked" are just funny at this point.

Seriously... If over 450 bph at the wheels (Tune, WMI, Turbo, etc.) isnt enough power (which by the way your already approaching the limits of many components of the car) then this isnt the platform for you.
It's not just about maximum power potential. It's about being able to run a safe AFR, safe timing, report the correct torque to the TCU among many other advantages. Also please don't call a piggyback a tune.
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      07-11-2017, 07:48 AM   #21
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Trust me there is not a computing platform on this planet that cannot be hacked and cracked given enough effort
Where there is money there will be a way
Like I said previously, the flash will be detectable warranty gone
ergo the real market appears after the LCI warranty has expired
so the developers have some time
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      07-11-2017, 08:03 AM   #22
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The first actual flash will likely be a bench flash and will still require a jb4 to control boost.
Also unless you know someone that was a part of the team that wrote the encryption, it could take a very long time to crack. But as someone mentioned earlier, it will take $$$ or a bunch f time.
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