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      04-17-2014, 01:20 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joewalton View Post
What's stupid is if BMW sits on its ass while other brands diversify their offerings.

The 4 Gran Coupe is a wider, sleeker, sexier F30. And there are so many F30's out there now that many of us welcome something more unique than coating a family sedan in Estoril Purple II paint and bolting-on boy racer fender flares.

How ironic. The M3 wouldn't exist unless BMW was catering to its niches; and yet you criticize the 4GC on the same grounds? Makes lots of sense. Totally.
Well said As a 4GC buyer the axe grinders don't bother me, although I have seen some mind-bogglingly stupid comments like "if you drive with the rear hatch open, then rear passengers will suffer buffeting"
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      04-17-2014, 03:31 AM   #46
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I would like that 435i could cost here in Europe also about $47k That much cost here 2-3 years old 335i, mostly on E9X platform.
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      04-17-2014, 04:06 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by Jackbmw View Post
I would like that 435i could cost here in Europe also about $47k That much cost here 2-3 years old 335i, mostly on E9X platform.
You could come to Australia? Here a 435i costs $118k.
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      04-17-2014, 05:49 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joewalton View Post
Because if you have children between the ages of 2 and 10 they fit perfectly back there and the doors are necessary for school dropoffs, playdates, soccer practice, and all the other family obligations.

For years I suffered in a family sedan while lusting after the coupe, doing the right and responsible thing for my kids. Now I get my sleek coupe, they get a smaller seating area and tiny doors. My turn now. Have fun back there, bitches. Fuck 'em.
Quote 100%!
Plus, the GC has a practical hatch in respect to the sedan.

It just happened that this year I need to change car for family reasons, and my first option was an A5 Sportback.
Now that BMW released the GC, I quickly ordered one. At least in my case, BMW managed to sell one car more!
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      04-17-2014, 06:09 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPM90 View Post
...

But, it's really STUPID what BMW is doing.

It's a freakin F30 with slightly different styling.
What's the point?
They should have just released this as the mid model refresh.

...

BMW is afraid to lose sales and bleed existing customers to the Audi A5 sportback. That's all.


This car is not an f30 variant. It's a response to Audi, and frankly it could not wait until the mid-cycle refresh.


Besides, if they gave us this and called it an f30 LCI, frankly MOST people would be pissed. This car is not as sporty, has a hatchback, less headroom and (i'm guessing here), the chassis will not be as stiff and in turn will creak and bend. Probably why they are not making an M4 Gran Coupe.
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      04-17-2014, 06:10 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lonewolf1870 View Post
Quote 100%!
Plus, the GC has a practical hatch in respect to the sedan.

It just happened that this year I need to change car for family reasons, and my first option was an A5 Sportback.
Now that BMW released the GC, I quickly ordered one. At least in my case, BMW managed to sell one car more!
^

My point exactly!
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      04-17-2014, 06:13 AM   #51
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BTW, the more I look at these cars side by side, the more I respect them both for what they are. At a first glance, sure they look similar (f30 and f36). But put them side by side for a minute and I think the design differences become increasingly hard to ignore. Quite frankly the f36 is a gorgeous compromise. The f30 is a dedicated BMW, as is the f32. I like that in the f30 and f32. They look very distinct to my eyes.


But again, I am in love with the f36. I just hate the fact that I won't be able to get one since BMW NA will not be bringing the 6MT option.
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      04-17-2014, 06:17 AM   #52
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I think another big test for the f36 Gran Coupe will be how it drives. If it drives anything like the f32 it is modeled after, then this car will be a big hit, and IMO will cannibalize a lot of f30 sales. If it drives like an f34 GT, well then, ...
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      04-17-2014, 07:31 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpinweiss 335i View Post
I think another big test for the f36 Gran Coupe will be how it drives. If it drives anything like the f32 it is modeled after, then this car will be a big hit, and IMO will cannibalize a lot of f30 sales. If it drives like an f34 GT, well then, ...
Very true... hopefully the former, since it is based on the F32 The F34 is a much bigger car
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      04-17-2014, 09:45 AM   #54
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Looks really good. Those frameless windows are pretty awesome!
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      04-17-2014, 09:46 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joewalton
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ffs630 View Post
Still cant get past the rear of the car! I was hoping for a smaller 6GC not a slightly different 3 series GT.


You're kidding, right?

One is a slammed F30, the other is an AMC Pacer.
no, i'm not kidding..... I personally think the rear of the 4 resembles the rear if the GT.
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      04-17-2014, 09:55 AM   #56
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The only thing left for BMW to make is a new 3-series coupe. Pretty soon BMW will have as many variations of 3/4 series cars as Ford does with their F-series line.
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      04-17-2014, 02:48 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inFamousKicks View Post
Kinda stupid. They're stretching these model lines out too thin.
Too thin for what?
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      04-17-2014, 03:01 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPM90 View Post
It's a freakin F30 with slightly different styling.
What's the point?
Here's how I see it:
  • The 4 series is very different than the 3 series sedan. Same powertrains and interiors, but totally different sheetmetal and the coupes are lower and wider than the sedans and have different suspension treatment. They are sportier cars.
  • I like the 4 better than the 3, which can look a little stodgy to my eyes.
  • But I have two young daughters. They don't ride in my car a ton, but some. I could get away with a 2-door but it wouldn't be optimal.
  • Tossing my briefcase and jacket in the back seat of a 2-door might also become a PITA after a week.

Here comes the 4GC, which is equivalent to the 4 coupe mechanically and size-wise, yet somehow they have fit two rear doors on it and might even have improved the look at little over the 2-door in doing so. Also, I dig the hatch. Some do, others don't. I do.

I've been driving 5 series for a while. This latest one I got last year is beautiful and impeccably engineered, but it's a little too big and not much fun. I'm looking for a change next time around, but I don't see myself in a 3 series. I just don't.

So the 4GC is aimed right at me. I may represent a narrow market, but the way BMW is building cars these days, leveraging platform designs across models and reducing development costs, means that they can aim specific models at narrow markets and do so economically.

What some of you are calling "dilution" I call BMW building cars that more people are going to find perfect for them. I don't see a downside.


...

The 318ti, back in the E36 era...that was dilution. It was an underengineered, underpowered, crappy car that leveraged the Roundel for sales volume. The purpose of its existence was to move BMW downmarket, possibly at the expense of the brand cache, had they let it go on long enough. That is what dilution means.
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Last edited by WilliCO; 04-17-2014 at 03:12 PM..
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      04-17-2014, 03:23 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpinweiss 335i View Post
BMW is afraid to lose sales and bleed existing customers to the Audi A5 sportback. That's all.
To whatever extent that is true, I don't object to it. Every concept doesn't have to be revolutionary. I like Audis, but I've owned two and they both killed me in repairs down the road, so I don't trust them now. If there is a cool concept, I'd rather own the version BMW builds.

Also, Audi doesn't sell the A5 sportback in the US, so I couldn't buy one if I wanted to.
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      04-17-2014, 03:30 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alienranch View Post
The only thing left for BMW to make is a new 3-series coupe. Pretty soon BMW will have as many variations of 3/4 series cars as Ford does with their F-series line.
....and what's the problem with that? What's the issue if BMW releases a niche car for a niche that wants it and makes its customers happy?

Would the Beatles have been better to release 11 albums instead of 12?
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      04-17-2014, 03:33 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joewalton View Post
....and what's the problem with that? What's the issue if BMW releases a niche car for a niche that wants it and makes its customers happy?

Would the Beatles have been better to release 11 albums instead of 12?
Those 12 albums were released over many years, not all at once.
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      04-17-2014, 03:43 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alienranch View Post
The only thing left for BMW to make is a new 3-series coupe. Pretty soon BMW will have as many variations of 3/4 series cars as Ford does with their F-series line.
The F-series has been the best-selling vehicle in the United States for the past 32 years, the best-selling pick-up for 43 years, and is the best selling vehicle in Canada.

You may realize that and intended your post to be subtle and clever, in which case I applaud. I couldn't quite tell.
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      04-17-2014, 04:12 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alienranch View Post
The only thing left for BMW to make is a new 3-series coupe. Pretty soon BMW will have as many variations of 3/4 series cars as Ford does with their F-series line.
They did that already. It's called the 4-series.

I am beginning to get frustrated with the lack of understanding here. The model breakdown is clear if you stop and think about it.

Sedan-based: more conventional, practical
  • 3-series sedan
  • 3-series wagon
  • 3-series GT
  • 5-series sedan
  • 5-series wagon
  • 5-series GT
  • 7-series sedan
  • 7-series variants?

Coupe-based: sleek shapes, sacrifice some practicality for some extra style
  • 2-series coupe
  • 2-series convertible coming (?)
  • 2-series GC coming (?)
  • 4-series coupe
  • 4-series convertible
  • 4-series GC
  • 6-series coupe
  • 6-series convertible
  • 6-series GC

Is this really that difficult to comprehend, both in itself and as an overall philosophy BMW has chosen to adopt?

We're talking even vs. odd numbers here, denoting relative magnitude... it's elementary and it makes perfect sense.

Do you want a more traditional shape with more practicality, or a sleeker shape? How big do you want your car to be? Well alright, take your pick from this logical lineup.

As a sidenote, it seems obvious that the 1-series will be re-born as the FWD small sedan-type car, to go up against the A3 and CLA, and slot right into the overarching strategy for BMW's lineup.

I like how someone else put it - more models just means that there are less of each on the road, and as ubiquitous BMWs have become I think that's a good thing.
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      04-17-2014, 05:48 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bucket328
I'm confused, this is different from a 3 series GT how?
Okay you really need new glasses! The 4GC is a beautiful piece of wheels - might look too close to the 3 sedan or 4 coupe (to the last would make sense at least) but to say you can't see the difference between this and the butt-ugly GT? Come on? GT might be way more spacious and practical but damn they are ugly
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      04-17-2014, 05:59 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WJGreer
Quote:
Originally Posted by RPM90 View Post
It's a freakin F30 with slightly different styling.
What's the point?
Here's how I see it:
  • The 4 series is very different than the 3 series sedan. Same powertrains and interiors, but totally different sheetmetal and the coupes are lower and wider than the sedans and have different suspension treatment. They are sportier cars.
  • I like the 4 better than the 3, which can look a little stodgy to my eyes.
  • But I have two young daughters. They don't ride in my car a ton, but some. I could get away with a 2-door but it wouldn't be optimal.
  • Tossing my briefcase and jacket in the back seat of a 2-door might also become a PITA after a week.

Here comes the 4GC, which is equivalent to the 4 coupe mechanically and size-wise, yet somehow they have fit two rear doors on it and might even have improved the look at little over the 2-door in doing so. Also, I dig the hatch. Some do, others don't. I do.

I've been driving 5 series for a while. This latest one I got last year is beautiful and impeccably engineered, but it's a little too big and not much fun. I'm looking for a change next time around, but I don't see myself in a 3 series. I just don't.

So the 4GC is aimed right at me. I may represent a narrow market, but the way BMW is building cars these days, leveraging platform designs across models and reducing development costs, means that they can aim specific models at narrow markets and do so economically.

What some of you are calling "dilution" I call BMW building cars that more people are going to find perfect for them. I don't see a downside.


...

The 318ti, back in the E36 era...that was dilution. It was an underengineered, underpowered, crappy car that leveraged the Roundel for sales volume. The purpose of its existence was to move BMW downmarket, possibly at the expense of the brand cache, had they let it go on long enough. That is what dilution means.
+1

Very well put!
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      04-17-2014, 05:59 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S4NoMore
Quote:
Originally Posted by alienranch View Post
The only thing left for BMW to make is a new 3-series coupe. Pretty soon BMW will have as many variations of 3/4 series cars as Ford does with their F-series line.
They did that already. It's called the 4-series.

I am beginning to get frustrated with the lack of understanding here. The model breakdown is clear if you stop and think about it.

Sedan-based: more conventional, practical
  • 3-series sedan
  • 3-series wagon
  • 3-series GT
  • 5-series sedan
  • 5-series wagon
  • 5-series GT
  • 7-series sedan
  • 7-series variants?

Coupe-based: sleek shapes, sacrifice some practicality for some extra style
  • 2-series coupe
  • 2-series convertible coming (?)
  • 2-series GC coming (?)
  • 4-series coupe
  • 4-series convertible
  • 4-series GC
  • 6-series coupe
  • 6-series convertible
  • 6-series GC

Is this really that difficult to comprehend, both in itself and as an overall philosophy BMW has chosen to adopt?

We're talking even vs. odd numbers here, denoting relative magnitude... it's elementary and it makes perfect sense.

Do you want a more traditional shape with more practicality, or a sleeker shape? How big do you want your car to be? Well alright, take your pick from this logical lineup.

As a sidenote, it seems obvious that the 1-series will be re-born as the FWD small sedan-type car, to go up against the A3 and CLA, and slot right into the overarching strategy for BMW's lineup.

I like how someone else put it - more models just means that there are less of each on the road, and as ubiquitous BMWs have become I think that's a good thing.
+2

Amazing response, absolutely enjoyed reading this!

Well said!
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